Dochartaigh Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 What are you even talking about? The whole Aztec plotline that began with TOP/Sparta but somehow MI6 was the one who took the entire fall for it. (finally remembered what alliances) Ya know, the entire reason Sengoku/et al began to dislike/distrust MI6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omniscient1 Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 (edited) It's pretty mind-boggling to me that NPO's logic on this is "crappy stuff happened to us, so what if we do crappy things." Bruce's comments border on illiterate, the path he takes from A to Q makes me think he's probably drunk. And can someone please put one in Mealstrom's throat for smugly saying "you should keep up with the times" about a treaty cancellation that NPO DIDN'T POST, you jackass. Maybe having Caitlyn inside begging to get out was just too much for him to make literate statements? Apparently that's what people do these days. This is the first time I've seen anyone make the biggest bloc in CN and be too ashamed to name their fellow conspirators. They didn't learn anything from 09. :facepalm: Edited October 11, 2015 by Omniscient1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killjoy123 Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 Killjoy: Lets just say it involves a long and extensive history with MI6 that it would take me far to long a time to bother recanting. I been with MI6 a long time and allied for longer. You don't need to tell me anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dochartaigh Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 What are you even talking about? I'm just saying you guys need to learn from your mistakes, and yet you act as if everything you've done has been painstaking and deliberate rather than half assed and impulsive. You can blame everyone else for your problems, that's fine, but the cost of that self certainty is you'll be back here in another year. See the mistakes we made- we have owned up to long ago. The issue is, Occulus and apparently TOP, wants us to own up to shit that others did. Not MI6. Like plotting against Aztec. That was TOP and Sparta but is one of the main reasons Aztec is lined up against MI6 right now. The only other mistakes we have made- not becoming a puppet lackey state like TOP? Sorry, at one point I absolutely loved TOP and now y'all not even a shadow of your former self. You are nothing more than a shadow of Umbrella. MI6 apparently made the mistake of not wanting to be Umbrella's pawn. If that means we will get rolled in a year then so be it. I would rather keep getting rolled while being on my feet, than live on my knees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthey Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 (edited) The whole Aztec plotline that began with TOP/Sparta but somehow MI6 was the one who took the entire fall for it. (finally remembered what alliances) Ya know, the entire reason Sengoku/et al began to dislike/distrust MI6. I mean if you want to really dive into it then you have to remember that there was never anything that can be meaningfully be called a scheme, more a former gov member of sparta took the initiative to have a poorly thought out conversation with members of sengoku, then not tell anyone. After that a former government member of TOP was confronted on the sketchy conversation and was defensive, having no context. Mi6 had their own series of issues with Umbrella and Aztec, these were separate contributing events, coupled with convenience, that set off a cycle bad interactions resulting in a war. What separates you and us, is that we took the time to really think about what was happening on both sides of that communication while you continue to presume basic ill motive.We worked to resolve that enmity while you doubled down. This war has almost nothing to do with what happened before the last one, but like the last one it occurred because you neglected to address bad optics and resolve issues. You accepted the presumption that people were gunning for you, that you would inevitably be rolled, and rather than try to take corrective action you sat and basically did nothing. If you want to call me a lapdog or a stooge for thinking your approach was foolish and a waste of energy then by all means, I'm still right.See the mistakes we made- we have owned up to long ago. The issue is, Occulus and apparently TOP, wants us to own up to !@#$ that others did. Not MI6. Like plotting against Aztec. That was TOP and Sparta but is one of the main reasons Aztec is lined up against MI6 right now. The only other mistakes we have made- not becoming a puppet lackey state like TOP? Sorry, at one point I absolutely loved TOP and now y'all not even a shadow of your former self. You are nothing more than a shadow of Umbrella. MI6 apparently made the mistake of not wanting to be Umbrella's pawn. If that means we will get rolled in a year then so be it. I would rather keep getting rolled while being on my feet, than live on my knees. I'm not asking you to own up to any offense, I'm talking about your basic approach to dealing with other people. Not explicit acts, your toxic manner in public and in private, which has turned so many off to you, has spoiled collaborative efforts in coalitions, and has created a stigma around even being attached to you. I'm talking about the things you have done that have contributed to your political failure. To this point you have accumulated all the vices of MK and yet you lack their ability to compensate with good high quality diplomacy. They didn't thrive simply by making a mess of the OWF, and being a political zoo internally- they had real diplomatic acumen and strong personalities that could clean up the many messes their abrasive elements created. Edited October 11, 2015 by iamthey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown Smurf Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 (edited) I mean if you want to really dive into it then you have to remember that there was never anything that can be meaningfully be called a scheme, more a former gov member of sparta took the initiative to have a poorly thought out conversation with members of sengoku, then not tell anyone. After that a former government member of TOP was confronted on the sketchy conversation and was defensive, having no context. Mi6 had their own series of issues with Umbrella and Aztec, these were separate contributing events, coupled with convenience, that set off a cycle bad interactions resulting in a war. What separates you and us, is that we took the time to really think about what was happening on both sides of that communication while you continue to presume basic ill motive. We worked to resolve that enmity while you doubled down. This war has almost nothing to do with what happened before the last one, but like the last one it occurred because you neglected to address bad optics and resolve issues. You accepted the presumption that people were gunning for you, that you would inevitably be rolled, and rather than try to take corrective action you sat and basically did nothing. If you want to call me a lapdog or a stooge for thinking your approach was foolish and a waste of energy then by all means, I'm still right. The issue is much more basic. The problem is that MI6 believes a rolling absolves you of all sins whereas the aggressors want to see an apology and surrender and frankly have their dick sucked. Postwar those mentalities persisted and MI6s FA policy basically was "ok I lost some infra, ally me now so we can scheme together" when they should've been saying "okay scheming was bad, I'm not going to do that again, give me a second chance" Which isn't a huge issue as there are plenty of schemers who have contemplated allying MI6 for their NS/fighting ability but then when you couple that with the fact that their membership entirely consists of pompous morons that consistently rub in their flaws with their personalities... well get an Umbridge level of decrees. tl;dr That is to say I agree the problem is due to mi6s approach as you said, but that is a symptom of their personalities rather than anything they can actually take control of. Edited October 11, 2015 by Unknown Smurf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 Can we keep all talk about MI6's various failures in the first DoW? This DoW is about the engagement of TPF which has much wider strategic implications than how stupid MI6 is or isn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vol Navy Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 Not really. Response to presence of enemy of any size is simply, "Stomp it flat." Hell, I don't get any target. If this had any thing to do with "e-peens" I'd be getting blue-balled. Oh wait..... Someone find me a target! For the love of admin! Find me a target! :P ... Alright I proved his point on MI6, moving on now. I will say this, I am not like other Pacificans, please do not hold my weakness.. against the Order. I didn't get staggered until 1 pm server time or so this afternoon. I was in your range, you clearly weren't looking that hard for 14 hours or so, otherwise you can sell down and fight all you wish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebirth Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 Which isn't a huge issue as there are plenty of schemers who have contemplated allying MI6 for their NS/fighting ability but then when you couple that with the fact that their membership entirely consists of pompous morons that consistently rub in their flaws with their personalities... well get an Umbridge level of decrees. I just want to say that stereotypes are harmful and that's only half our membership. The other half just find Oculus to be a blight on Bob and find the morons fun to be around. We're quite fun when you get to know us. More to the point, I'd like to add my voice to the "Really NPO?" chorus and welcome TPF to glorious combat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibsonator21 Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 I mean if you want to really dive into it then you have to remember that there was never anything that can be meaningfully be called a scheme, more a former gov member of sparta took the initiative to have a poorly thought out conversation with members of sengoku, then not tell anyone. After that a former government member of TOP was confronted on the sketchy conversation and was defensive, having no context. Mi6 had their own series of issues with Umbrella and Aztec, these were separate contributing events, coupled with convenience, that set off a cycle bad interactions resulting in a war. What separates you and us, is that we took the time to really think about what was happening on both sides of that communication while you continue to presume basic ill motive. We worked to resolve that enmity while you doubled down. This war has almost nothing to do with what happened before the last one, but like the last one it occurred because you neglected to address bad optics and resolve issues. You accepted the presumption that people were gunning for you, that you would inevitably be rolled, and rather than try to take corrective action you sat and basically did nothing. If you want to call me a lapdog or a stooge for thinking your approach was foolish and a waste of energy then by all means, I'm still right. I'm not asking you to own up to any offense, I'm talking about your basic approach to dealing with other people. Not explicit acts, your toxic manner in public and in private, which has turned so many off to you, has spoiled collaborative efforts in coalitions, and has created a stigma around even being attached to you. I'm talking about the things you have done that have contributed to your political failure. To this point you have accumulated all the vices of MK and yet you lack their ability to compensate with good high quality diplomacy. They didn't thrive simply by making a mess of the OWF, and being a political zoo internally- they had real diplomatic acumen and strong personalities that could clean up the many messes their abrasive elements created. We spent the last year trying to make friends with people, not plotting. Everyone we talked to said they didn't trust us, or they liked us but their allies didn't trust us. We refuse to apologize for things we didn't do, and we refuse to let people walk on us. If these are the consequences of having a backbone then so be it. I'd much rather be in my situation than yours. That said, this is the wrong DoW for that. If you wanna have a full conversation, PM me. But you won't. Back to your regularly scheduled "NPO are scum!" posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dochartaigh Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 I mean if you want to really dive into it then you have to remember that there was never anything that can be meaningfully be called a scheme, more a former gov member of sparta took the initiative to have a poorly thought out conversation with members of sengoku, then not tell anyone. After that a former government member of TOP was confronted on the sketchy conversation and was defensive, having no context. Mi6 had their own series of issues with Umbrella and Aztec, these were separate contributing events, coupled with convenience, that set off a cycle bad interactions resulting in a war. What separates you and us, is that we took the time to really think about what was happening on both sides of that communication while you continue to presume basic ill motive. We worked to resolve that enmity while you doubled down. This war has almost nothing to do with what happened before the last one, but like the last one it occurred because you neglected to address bad optics and resolve issues. You accepted the presumption that people were gunning for you, that you would inevitably be rolled, and rather than try to take corrective action you sat and basically did nothing. If you want to call me a lapdog or a stooge for thinking your approach was foolish and a waste of energy then by all means, I'm still right. I'm not asking you to own up to any offense, I'm talking about your basic approach to dealing with other people. Not explicit acts, your toxic manner in public and in private, which has turned so many off to you, has spoiled collaborative efforts in coalitions, and has created a stigma around even being attached to you. I'm talking about the things you have done that have contributed to your political failure. To this point you have accumulated all the vices of MK and yet you lack their ability to compensate with good high quality diplomacy. They didn't thrive simply by making a mess of the OWF, and being a political zoo internally- they had real diplomatic acumen and strong personalities that could clean up the many messes their abrasive elements created. Most of MI6 stayed off of the OWF for several months, myself included after last war. Our gov did everything possible to try and resolve issues only to be met with far more abrasive attitudes than anything MI6 has portrayed. Did we believe we would be rolled. Hell yes we did, we aren't stupid. The writing was blatantly visible for all to see. You want toxic manners in public and private, look at the shit pulled by NG and then get off of that little high horse right there. Because if having such a toxic attitude means you have no allies, then NG would have 0. So yeah, we all know that is just some sort of convenient excuse particularly since we have enjoyed rather good talks with various alliances. Now, if you come over to MI6, talk shit and then expect us to apologize for your actions (I mean you in the general sense) then yeah, you will get a big fat Fuck You from MI6. But as others have said, this is not a thread on MI6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maelstrom Vortex Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 So Pacifica is free to ally NG, NSO, and Umbrella, all alliances TPF considered enemies, and that's kosher, but when TPF does the same thing, it's a valid reason to cancel on them and roll them? Work on your propaganda. Work on yours. You're like the 20th person to repeat that same dry line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogar Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 Work on yours. You're like the 20th person to repeat that same dry line. Considering not a single person from your alliance has been able to rationalize why it was ok for you to buddy up to TPF's enemies, but not ok for them to ally yours... I predict you'll keep hearing it, but I know that actually owning up to the reality TPF didn't continue to behave as a good dog so they are brought around back of the shed is a bit hard for some of the body republic to admit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Buscemi Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 We spent the last year trying to make friends with people, not plotting. Everyone we talked to said they didn't trust us, or they liked us but their allies didn't trust us. We refuse to apologize for things we didn't do, and we refuse to let people walk on us. If these are the consequences of having a backbone then so be it. I'd much rather be in my situation than yours. That said, this is the wrong DoW for that. If you wanna have a full conversation, PM me. But you won't. Back to your regularly scheduled "NPO are scum!" posts. Yea, I spent about the same time pre-Disorder. Sorry, it's been too late for a long time. Wars are set 6-12 months in advance, if not more. It's why Planet Bob sucks. As to TPF, I'm glad they are getting rolled. They should've just stayed out of Disorder since they clearly didn't want to defend their ally in NPO, and did a piss-poor job, and exited early. It would've been better had they just stayed out. Now they are getting what they deserve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USMC123 Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 This thread is spinning so fast it's making me sick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IYIyTh Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 (edited) NPO are snakes, Umb are snakes, news at 11 Edited October 11, 2015 by IYIyTh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezeriel Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 See the mistakes we made- we have owned up to long ago. The issue is, Occulus and apparently TOP, wants us to own up to !@#$ that others did. Not MI6. Like plotting against Aztec. That was TOP and Sparta but is one of the main reasons Aztec is lined up against MI6 right now. The only other mistakes we have made- not becoming a puppet lackey state like TOP? Sorry, at one point I absolutely loved TOP and now y'all not even a shadow of your former self. You are nothing more than a shadow of Umbrella. MI6 apparently made the mistake of not wanting to be Umbrella's pawn. If that means we will get rolled in a year then so be it. I would rather keep getting rolled while being on my feet, than live on my knees. I feel like we are all missing a golden moment here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vol Navy Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 Yea, I spent about the same time pre-Disorder. Sorry, it's been too late for a long time. Wars are set 6-12 months in advance, if not more. It's why Planet Bob sucks. As to TPF, I'm glad they are getting rolled. They should've just stayed out of Disorder since they clearly didn't want to defend their ally in NPO, and did a piss-poor job, and exited early. It would've been better had they just stayed out. Now they are getting what they deserve. We for sure should have stayed out of it and this proves it. As it was, we went in and fought our butts off for over a month because NPO got into trouble due to having treaties and plotting with the alliances we told them we didn't want anything to do with. We also told them we wanted nothing to do with the war the three of you were plotting, you were essentially targeting another of our allies. Even through all of that we still fought for NPO when everyone assumed we'd fight on the winning side for FARK. Instead we entered for NPO and by extension your alliance and fought over a month. Also bringing along STA with us because they're that great of allies. We and STA dished out and took more damage than many alliances that fought the entire war. We had 629 wars in our time on the front and STA over 500. We took more damage per nation that war than NPO, RnR, NATO, ODN, Invicta, TIO, TLR, and Anarchy Inc. So you can kindly jump off the nearest bridge with your "piss-poor job" bs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the rebel Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 All TPF had to do was ally themselves with someone.. NOT our enemy. Is that REALLY asking for a kissup? Really? You hear that TIO just sit and wait Oculus is a coming for you... No wait someone with half a brain is in leadership and not the Tywin Lannister of NPO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles the Tyrant Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 (edited) Killjoy: Lets just say it involves a long and extensive history with MI6 that it would take me far to long a time to bother recanting. Do tell. I love a good piece of well thought out fiction. Edited October 11, 2015 by Charles the Tyrant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles the Tyrant Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 Rather than blaming your problems on former allies, and external parties, you should consider what you all have done to get yourselves here. It is true, you are unfortunate victims, but victims of unfit candidates calling themselves your leaders. You know who I'm talking about, the sort of people that impress others with the notion that your alliance is composed entirely of tactless reprobates. Fix that problem, and change your approach.When founded, you guys presented yourselves as a bold experiment, well it pains me to say it, but so far it's a failed one- do something about it. Does such logic also apply to TOP? Is TOP's current position and fall from grace also due to the actions of its leaders? Or should I say inaction? MI6 is in its position because they did what TOP refused to do. Namely call umbrella out for their betrayal of our entire sphere. MI6 is paying the price for that but I can't help but notice that TOP has also paid the price for deciding to remain tied to Umbrella, that price bring irrelevance and your current size of membership. Got nothing but love for TOP as these amongst your membership who talk with me regularly will be able to confirm but you of all people should know better than to throw stones whilst living in a glass house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Perry Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 You guys try so !@#$@#$ hard to wash your hands of all blame. lmao .. Something else NG sits idly by allowing .. Again makes me feel we should be watching our backs pretty close too .... We have, afterall, been talking to MI6 too about increased relations just like TPF .. So we must have put ourselves in the path of Oculus by now. And as it is clearly stated, Oculus acts as a whole and with no individual care - so thus, we are completely vulnerable to the supremacy clause ... We know not to be surprised when it happens anyways .... I struggle to foresee any circumstances in which NG would tolerate NSO being rolled, unless you really did something stupid... which I presume you guys won't do.If legitimately have concerns then please hit me up about these. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimaera Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 (edited) Rather than blaming your problems on former allies, and external parties, you should consider what you all have done to get yourselves here. It is true, you are unfortunate victims, but victims of unfit candidates calling themselves your leaders. You know who I'm talking about, the sort of people that impress others with the notion that your alliance is composed entirely of tactless reprobates. Fix that problem, and change your approach. When founded, you guys presented yourselves as a bold experiment, well it pains me to say it, but so far it's a failed one- do something about it. Edit: You know what, that's too mean. Sorry you feel that way, IAT. Edited October 11, 2015 by Chimaera Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Uruk Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 lmao @ MI6 crying "B-but TOP!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franz Ferdinand Posted October 11, 2015 Report Share Posted October 11, 2015 lmao @ MI6 crying "B-but TOP!" That's a good point... where is The Order of the Paradox these days? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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