New Sith Order Announcement

[Melancholy Culkin]

PR stunt or no, it's certainly working.

[2burnt2eat]

[quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1309836641' post='2749063']
Every war does have its own justification to the one declaring it, just because other do not agree with it does not make it any less justifiable in the aggressor's eyes, merely makes the reasoning appear weak in comparison to the norm of what's deemed "acceptable."

Certain people believe tech raiding is justified while others do not, does that mean that when someone raids it's not justified?
[/quote]

Right, justifications in our own eyes. Which is why, despite NSO not thinking Legion posting is CB-worthy, is not acting on it. And it'd be rather pointless for anyone to make the decision for us if it's a CB or not, isn't it? Last I checked, NSO fought on the side of karma to remove such ideas as censorship.

And a raid is just what it is: a raid, and not a war.

It's completely ridiculous for someone to argue that "I'm justified in rolling you for cash, money, land, ethnicity, your face looks funny, etc." with a straight face. It's even more ridiculous that I have to argue such a basic concept. It's irrelevant that it seems right in someone's mind: of course that would be the case, otherwise we'd never see one genocidal war. No one does anything thinking they're wrong.

War for such shallow sentiments? Go on and tell me there's a shred of "reasoning" or "justification" behind that to constitute that as a CB. But it's quite obvious that there is a callous disregard and expedient rejection of its very definition, not to mention the disregard in how the term became popularized and by who.

[quote name='Jaiar' timestamp='1309837069' post='2749072']
Do you believe in valid or invalid CBs? If you do then there is where you're not understanding what a CB is. There are no such things as vaild or invalid CBs.

In this case of Legion accusing Varianz. That is the act or the CB that NSO could use if it wanted to go to war. It cannot be argued to be valid or invalid.

You have a CB. You won't use it though will you.
[/quote]

I love how we're rewriting the definition of a word for convenience's sake. You're picking the wrong position. Rather than trying to whip-up a CB that NSO has on Legion out of your ass to make us seem like the cowards and not them, Legion should work on not being cowards themselves to begin with. This whole "okay by association" idea isn't working out, so stop ruffling their hair. The argument here is silly just on a literal interpretation of definitions.

Let's think here: a CB cannot be argued valid or invalid. Where were you during the last war for that charming sentiment?

Legion has a CB, but they won't use it will they? At this point this is a desperate straw hunt, and I'd have to redirect you to what I've said previously with Mr. Celestial.

[quote name='Rotavele' timestamp='1309838986' post='2749094']
If you have a CB against Legion, then go for it and stop biqouring.
[/quote]
...And it comes out of the woodwork once some opposition develops!

Point me to it darling. I'm still waiting on that rebuttal.

[EpsilonPhoenix]

As much as I like NSO, you spied. Yeah sure Legion was trying to prove they were better fighters than NSO, but we all know that's bull!@#$. You went the extra mile to prove them wrong. In doing so, you spied. End of story.

[Varianz]

[quote name='EpsilonPhoenix' timestamp='1309841486' post='2749135']
As much as I like NSO, you spied. Yeah sure Legion was trying to prove they were better fighters than NSO, but we all know that's bull!@#$. You went the extra mile to prove them wrong. In doing so, you spied. End of story.
[/quote]
Good sir, there is no evidence to prove that NSO spied outside of circumstantial speculation. In fact, I, [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=103229"]the person originally accused of spying[/url], have decided that in the interests of deflating tensions that I will post a screenshot of my spy-ops page.

[img]http://oi51.tinypic.com/25swmew.jpg[/img]

As you can see, there are no spy ops against Legion there- just the two rogues I recently fought (also wtf I did a destroy infra spy op? Dunno whatsup with that.)

[kevin32891]

Hail the Emperor and his glorious vision!

[Canik]

[quote name='Varianz' timestamp='1309841897' post='2749138']
Good sir, there is no evidence to prove that NSO spied outside of circumstantial speculation. In fact, I, [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=103229"]the person originally accused of spying[/url], have decided that in the interests of deflating tensions that I will post a screenshot of my spy-ops page.

[img]http://oi51.tinypic.com/25swmew.jpg[/img]

As you can see, there are no spy ops against Legion there- just the two rogues I recently fought (also wtf I did a destroy infra spy op? Dunno whatsup with that.)
[/quote]

That settles that. What now Legion? ATTACK!

[Jake Liebenow]

There's a reason why, in America, the burden of proof lies on the accuser, and a man is innocent until proven guilty. It is to defend against baseless accusations, and that no matter how much someone is disliked, they still have their day to defend themselves, and prove their innocence.

The fact of the matter is that Legion has zero concrete evidence that we spied on their nations. If they did have concrete proof, they'd have declared rather than posting an opinion topic of whether or not they should.

The fact of the matter is that Legion used this to besmirch Sith Lord Varianz, and in turn NSO's name, with very little to back themselves up on it. If you're talking about PR stunts, understand first that Legion made the first strike, and Legion was proven false.

To assume we are guilty without any evidence to back it up is to sentence an innocent man with a shadow, nay a singularity, of guilt hanging over the matter.

For shame, Legion.

[Griff]

Thanks for playing, Legion.

[Bob Ilyani]

This is a legendary thread. Keep on trainwrecking, Legion.

[Azaghul]

Good job on calling out the Legion's bluffs, NSO.

[Systemfailure]

[quote name='Azaghul' timestamp='1309842856' post='2749150']
Good job on calling out the Legion's bluffs, NSO.
[/quote]
there has to be some doubt on the outcome for it to be a bluff, i think the NSO has a good idea what Legion's plans are since they are holding their cards wrong way round and upside down...also Legion is playing Go-Fish at a poker table

[Rebel Virginia]

[quote name='nutkase' timestamp='1309828284' post='2748915']
Also considering NSO is asking for a apology, what happens if you don't get it?

You going to "do something about it"?
[/quote]
[color="#0000FF"]Legion asked us to stop posting information after the anonymous rebels sent it to us, and we want an apology for the slanders against us. Legion may refuse us an apology, in which case we'll continue our postings.[/color]

[Dilber]

I shall be a crotchety old man until we receive an apology!

[FearUnited]

[quote name='Rebel Virginia' timestamp='1309844603' post='2749172']
[color="#0000FF"]Legion asked us to stop posting information after the anonymous rebels sent it to us, and we want an apology for the slanders against us. Legion may refuse us an apology, in which case we'll continue our postings.[/color]
[/quote]
[color="#FF0000"]I totally Agree. You can't just accuse an alliance and its' members if something that isn't true. NSO deserves an apology from Legion. They made a false actuation and should apologize for their actions, otherwise, NSO may continue as they please as its Freedom of Speech. In this case, i support it.[/color]

[AtheistRepublican]

[quote name='Rebel Virginia' timestamp='1309844603' post='2749172']
[color="#0000FF"]Legion asked us to stop posting information after the anonymous rebels sent it to us, and we want an apology for the slanders against us. Legion may refuse us an apology, in which case we'll continue our postings.[/color]
[/quote]

I'm trying to wrap my head around how one guy, who is not Legion gov, somehow represents all of Legion and their government; and Legion should apologize over what one of their guys posts in World Affairs. If NSO is not responsible for what their members post, and does not censor their membership, why are you asking Legion to apologize for their members' posts and thus censor their membership?

Edited July 5, 2011 by AtheistRepublican

[PMoses]

[quote name='Rotavele' timestamp='1309823631' post='2748856']
U mad? Then avoid each other.
[/quote]


[quote name='Rotavele' timestamp='1309823872' post='2748864']
You spied on the Legion and people should feel sympathy for NSO?
[/quote]


[quote name='Rotavele' timestamp='1309838986' post='2749094']
If you have a CB against Legion, then go for it and stop biqouring.
[/quote]

I find it funny that an alliance that can not do anything themselves and leave there friends out to dry until they have no choice but to fight themselves, and do poorly at it seems to feel the need to weigh in on this situation so heavily. I understand that Legion and TPF are the only alliances in this world that haven't grown up and started thinking for themselves, and still choose to be mindless Pacifican puppets means you should stand up for them, but you should have started 3 threads ago, not at the tail end of the last thread to the little war. I mean honestly the little Pacifican beating there chest thing is funny.. we all know if war breaks out your gonna hide behind everyone else till you have no one to hide behind, then claim wrong doing when you get slammed in a war.. so save the talk.

[Vol Navy]

[quote name='PMoses' timestamp='1309846855' post='2749195']
I find it funny that an alliance that can not do anything themselves and leave there friends out to dry until they have no choice but to fight themselves, and do poorly at it seems to feel the need to weigh in on this situation so heavily. I understand that Legion and TPF are the only alliances in this world that haven't grown up and started thinking for themselves, and still choose to be mindless Pacifican puppets means you should stand up for them, but you should have started 3 threads ago, not at the tail end of the last thread to the little war. I mean honestly the little Pacifican beating there chest thing is funny.. we all know if war breaks out your gonna hide behind everyone else till you have no one to hide behind, then claim wrong doing when you get slammed in a war.. so save the talk.
[/quote]


Good grief. Yep, we are just mindless puppets to Pacifica. Sorry we can't all be world shaking trendsetters like you TORNers.

[Vanilla Napalm]

Odd, i assumed new threads on this topic required a poll to be legitimate.
I'll register my vote for option B.

[Alterego]

To any member of the legion who is @$&*#% off by situations like this and want to go to war to defend the honour of your alliance but is blocked by your gov. Find an alliance who will not let you keep looking like the biggest joke on bob. Find an alliance who would do something about situations like this so you dont have to live in shame. There are other alliances on purple.

Edited July 5, 2011 by Alterego

[Groucho Marx]

[quote name='Rush Sykes' timestamp='1309816566' post='2748715']
We take our lead from Legion. We will not act until they do.
[/quote]

Then you have nothing to worry about.

[Burnsey]

[quote name='AtheistRepublican' timestamp='1309846007' post='2749186']
I'm trying to wrap my head around how one guy, who is not Legion gov, somehow represents all of Legion and their government; and Legion should apologize over what one of their guys posts in World Affairs. If NSO is not responsible for what their members post, and does not censor their membership, why are you asking Legion to apologize for their members' posts and thus censor their membership?
[/quote]
There is a difference between making fun of someone and someone accusing you of spying.

Edited July 5, 2011 by Anger

[kriekfreak]

[quote name='Alterego' timestamp='1309855307' post='2749254']
To any member of the legion who is @$&*#% off by situations like this and want to go to war to defend the honour of your alliance but is blocked by your gov. Find an alliance who will not let you keep looking like the biggest joke on bob. Find an alliance who would do something about situations like this so you dont have to live in shame. There are other alliances on purple.
[/quote]

Listen to this man and join iFOK.

[KagetheSecond]

[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1309857655' post='2749270']
Listen to this man and join OMFG.
[/quote]
Thanks for the vote of support.

[Rayvon]

[quote name='youwish959' timestamp='1309815759' post='2748685']
Furthermore The Legion requested that the New Sith Order pressure our members to not post spy reports. I being a reasonable man would have been able to accept this slight degradation of our strong held ideals of freedom of information and freedom of speech, if only we could put this issue to rest with a simple apology for the blatant, baseless, false slander of Sith Lord Varianz. Even though The Legion has admitted to the wrong they have as of yet been unable to publicly admit that wrong and apologize for said wrong; [b]as such in the interests of freedom of information the New Sith Order considers this matter closed.[/b][/quote]
[quote name='nutkase' timestamp='1309828284' post='2748915']
Also considering NSO is asking for a apology, what happens if you don't get it?

You going to "do something about it"?
[/quote]

Read the OP.

They want to make baseless accusations, beg for mercy from our information machines, and then refuse to rescind the accusations? Fine. Their choice is made. Our point is made. We attempted to meet ground on them, NATO even helped with mediation. Legion government flat out refused to apologize for the accusations against Varianz - therefore we make no effort to lean on our machines.


[quote name='Jaiar' timestamp='1309834652' post='2749025']
Take into account NSO's track record. Van Hoo says don't aid said nation or it will be war, NSO sends aid anyway. GOONS is at war with Methrage and NSO decides to aid Methrage. So you see, jumping to the conclusion that NSO would do something stupid isn't completely out of line here.

Have your fun. In the end it will accomplish nothing for you.
[/quote]

Track record train of throught, in this sense of it, is flawed. Your examples are all times where we've made choice to interject in an existing incident. And we took the '$%&@ you' route. This situation, Legion brought to us. They came at us accusing our government, and other !@#$. They're getting a bigger '$%&@ you' response, but this one ended with this post. Unless Legion wishes to take their balls out of their purse.


[quote name='AtheistRepublican' timestamp='1309846007' post='2749186']
I'm trying to wrap my head around how one guy, who is not Legion gov, somehow represents all of Legion and their government; and Legion should apologize over what one of their guys posts in World Affairs. If NSO is not responsible for what their members post, and does not censor their membership, why are you asking Legion to apologize for their members' posts and thus censor their membership?
[/quote]

We didn't say we aren't responsible. We said we will not gag them.

Also - we aren't asking them to censor anyone. An apology does not equal a censorship. You can take that 'thus' out of there.

Freedom of information/speech applies to truth and fact. To spread around lies, destroys the entire institution of the act.

To throw around, or to stand by and support, slanderous comments against another government in no way has any sort of kinship to exercising freedom of speech or information.

Edited July 5, 2011 by Rayvon

[kriekfreak]

[quote name='KagetheSecond' timestamp='1309861429' post='2749279']
Thanks for the vote of support.
[/quote]

Sure, if some Legion nations join OMFG they can finally compete with you for most mediocre nation in OMFG