Announcement from the New Sith Order

[Heyman]

tl:dr

IRON: So... we actually never liked this treaty.
NSO: Really? Us neither.
IRON + NSO: Well, that settles it.

[andrew734]

[quote name='Heyman' timestamp='1284355257' post='2452019']
tl:dr

IRON: So... we actually never liked this treaty.
NSO: Really? Us neither.
IRON + NSO: Well, that settles it.
[/quote]


Yea . . . no not at all. A lot of us at IRON liked you guys but were not happy with the way NSO had been acting recently so we had asked gov to go and talk about how we felt. Some of us wanted a cancellation but some did not. It was really split 50/50

[Heyman]

[quote name='andrew734' timestamp='1284355659' post='2452025']
Yea . . . no not at all. A lot of us at IRON liked you guys but were not happy with the way NSO had been acting recently so we had asked gov to go and talk about how we felt. Some of us wanted a cancellation but some did not. It was really split 50/50
[/quote]

tl:dr

IRON: So... half of us don't like this treaty.
NSO: Really? Us neither.
IRON + NSO: Well, that settles it.

Fixed?

Edited September 13, 2010 by Heyman

[Alfred von Tirpitz]

Its good you lot did not have any kids, this divorce is messy.

[Ivan Moldavi]

[quote name='andrew734' timestamp='1284355659' post='2452025']
Yea . . . no not at all. A lot of us at IRON liked you guys but were not happy with the way NSO had been acting recently so we had asked gov to go and talk about how we felt. Some of us wanted a cancellation but some did not. It was really split 50/50
[/quote]
Just to clarify, I believe it was expressed by your government that the overwhelming majority supported cancellation based on some ongoing discussion topic. Which is fine, alliances should be free to align to whomever they wish. Just saying.

[Owney OSullivan]

There are some absolutely ridiculous and flat-out false accusations in this thread. How does DVDCCHN stating [i]"If R&R attacks NSO, then IRON would be forced to be neutral"[/i] equate to [i]we want/hope R&R attacks NSO so we can stay out of it[/i]? Our former SoS seems to only be making a statement, not making suggestions of any kind. It seems you misunderstood his intent and took this statement out of context. IRON did NOT want R&R to attack NSO, in fact many IRON members and at least a few government members that I know of were disappointed with R&R for attacking our treaty partner, I know I was. If you actually believe we wanted that to happen, you are just plain stupid. We NEVER ONCE asked R&R to attack you, plain and simple.

Secondly, saying we never planned on helping you rebuild isn't true. Council informed us that we would be helping NSO rebuild, and created a sign-up thread for donors. [i]Many[/i] IRONers happily pledged slots to aid NSO without question, I signed up for 2 slots per cycle myself. I find it highly unlikely that nobody in the NSO was informed that we were going to aid you. I'm not going to come out and call anybody here a liar, in the event that [i]not one[/i] NSO member or government official was told about this, but again I find that highly unlikely.


Fact is, many IRON members were displeased with NSO's shenanigans as of late, what with the aiding a "rogue" which got you rolled and then aiding Methrage. So council tried to address those concerns with you, and perhaps indicated that we may want to cancel the treaty? And then you got offended, jumped the gun and canceled first, and then spun it to try to make IRON look as bad as possible(making untrue statements, calling us bad allies, etc). Sound about accurate, RV?

I've always supported NSO, even through the ROK drama,(though I did think that methrage business was terribly stupid) but how some NSO members conducted themselves in this thread is making me rapidly lose all respect for your alliance.

We did not want to potentially cancel this treaty to "be loyal to SF" or avoid getting rolled or any other such BS that's been suggested here. We just had concerns about how your alliance was acting.

Sorry it had to be like this, good luck NSO.

EDIT: Obviously this is just my interpretation of events, not an official IRON opinion ETC ETC.

Edited September 13, 2010 by Owney OSullivan

[Fernando12]

[quote name='Creeping Death' timestamp='1284353584' post='2451983']
So... RV got the paddle huh?
[/quote]
It opens the door for RV to go on one of his F.A.I.L. crusades.

[Kalasin]

What? But I was so looking forward to RV as Sith Emperor!

[Smooth]

Congrats, IRON.

[Rampage3]

Hmnn...I will admit that I did not see this coming, especially considering IRON's support of the Sith in our...situation (at least as I read it).


Good luck errbody?

Edited September 13, 2010 by Rampage3

[shahenshah]

--- Regarding R&R Situation and wether IRON would honor the treaty:
(tl;dr) IRONers werent happy about the situation that R&R attacked another ally, things were heating up in R&R embassy, involving more than just simple members. Regarding going to war, if NSO activated the treaty, we'd answer the call, there isnt much science to it.


[quote name='Haflinger' timestamp='1284335154' post='2451702']
The gist is that IRON leaked it to Hoo that as long as R&R was in the initial attacking force, they would stay neutral.
[/quote]

I think you missed this part:

[quote name='Van Hoo III' timestamp='1284334741' post='2451685']
I have never claimed that R&R were approached by IRON. As far as I know, they were not.
[/quote]
What's interesting is, right now, you're basing an argument on Hoo's words..just couple weeks a back, many were blasting Hoo for not keeping his word.
Also, DVD is in Presidium, which is a non-Govt position.

R&R seems to have no idea either. Infact things appeared to heat up in R&R embassy because of the attack on NSO..and it just didn't involve simple members. There were many people in IRON that supported NSO, many people vocally made that support obvious, within and without. One member, perhaps he was younger, not sure, I recall asked a question on what would happen if NSO activates the treaty....the answer was obvious that IRON would honor the treaty, there isn't much science to it really.

-- Regarding ROK war, Methrage and internal discussions.

I think from the posts that were made in this medium, you could make it very obvious where the things stood when RoK declared war on NSO. Many IRONers believed the war was excessive and diplomacy was not given the chance + it involved Heft..and the dirty hippo is a figure that we will always admire and respect. There were still concerns being raised by some, anyway then Methrage thing happened and alot of NSO supporters suddenly got caught in a bad situation, lost of alot of traction there and as that event unfolded, there was more 'wth' moment. Many suggested cancellation, tho what my understanding was Govt taking notice of the concerns and to discuss the situation over a cup of tea.


-- Regarding Aid Stuff

[quote name='Rayvon' timestamp='1284334768' post='2451687']
Must be a pretty big .. puppet hole ..
[/quote]
Yes bigger than the hole where I (think it was you) sent you 3m ahead of the aid fall, I had to randomly contact you as I think you're govt member was away while I wanted to ask for directions of the flow.

Please understand that we're paying alot of reps and things couldn't move as fast compared to some of your other allies due to the reps situation, but things were setup, members allotting there slots, forums being setup, the usual stuff you do when you plan to move capital. It is not a matter of 'if' or 'when', it appears to be a simple matter of miscommunication as one side claims that the govt wasnt aware while the other side specifically suggests which govt members were aware.

Again, I'm just a member and this appears to be how things unfolded from my view. I will also ask IRONers to not view posts of a few members as a representation of the whole alliance and I'll only request the same from NSO too.

Also Fernando, keep making yourself look pathetic, you look cute.

Edited September 13, 2010 by shahenshah

[Banksy]

What I find funny is that R&R has happily gone along with this plan by SF leaders to bloc IRON attacking them by declaring on an IRON treaty partner for two wars in a row. It's rather discourteous of R&R. But what makes it truly funny is that when their treaty partners attack each other in order to manipulate IRON, this doesn't seem to bother IRON in the slightest.

[Wabooz]

Best of luck to you, IRON. O/

[Tygaland]

[quote name='cookavich' timestamp='1284320061' post='2451249']
And so the treaty that wrecked Frostbite disappears.
[/quote]


The NSO-IRON treaty did not break up Frostbite.

[Marneus Calgar]

[quote name='Smooth' timestamp='1284360340' post='2452078']
Congrats, IRON.
[/quote]
Thanks

[Sir Keshav IV]

Congratulations IRON!

[elpadrino]

what kind of ally attacks your treaty partner to prevent their friends from helping their allies?
and they already did it in the bi-polar war, RnR looks like an awesome an loyal allie to have (no, it´s just sarcasm)

[oinkoink12]

So IRON doesnt like their meatshield position but are too scared to cancel.

After summing it all up, I must say o/ NSO, atleast you do what's needed, instead of cheating your way out of your treaty's.
I hope TOP realises this soon.

[Ardus]

Everybody's better off without this treaty. I don't see any reason for controversy.

[Kalasin]

[quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1284378702' post='2452199']
Everybody's better off without this treaty. I don't see any reason for controversy.
[/quote]

What controversy? This thread is mostly just NSO and IRON arguing about the details of their relationship, but that's to be expected really.

[notadolfhitler]

Good luck NSO, I have no doubt that you will be a good emperor Heggo.

[Wes Walz Pants]

[quote name='Banksy' timestamp='1284365070' post='2452102']
What I find funny is that R&R has happily gone along with this plan by SF leaders to bloc IRON attacking them by declaring on an IRON treaty partner for two wars in a row. It's rather discourteous of R&R. [b]But what makes it truly funny is that when their treaty partners attack each other in order to manipulate IRON, this doesn't seem to bother IRON in the slightest.[/b]
[/quote]
It certainly helps to read the post directly above yours.

[quote][b]IRONers werent happy about the situation that R&R attacked another ally, things were heating up in R&R embassy, involving more than just simple members[/b].[/quote]

That note from Shah doesn't seem to jive with your impression of the situation.

As for the rest of the situation, good luck to my friends Heft and Lennox over at NSO. Better luck on government retirement to RV, and I hope IRON can find a better use for those millions/billions that were planned for NSO's future. Shame to see miscommunication ruin all the work Theophilos and the IRON vault had put forth towards assisting your ally.

[StevieG]

Well, there certainly was a load of unsubstantiated claims made in this topic, the irony was mind boggling. IRON doesn't plot to betray anyone, I thought we made that clear to you, NSO.

[James IV]

Congrats to the Sith on this one.

[Jrenster]

[quote name='andrew734' timestamp='1284355659' post='2452025']
Yea . . . no not at all. A lot of us at IRON liked you guys but were not happy with the way NSO had been acting recently so we had asked gov to go and talk about how we felt. Some of us wanted a cancellation but some did not. It was really split 50/50
[/quote]

We were not told 50/50 by your government. We were explicitly told majority. Whether that was true or not remains to be seen.

As for those talking about DVD hinting to RoK to get RnR to hit us; we were directly told by IRON government that DVD was acting on his own. We understood this fact. It became a talking point in the meetings because IRON was trying to use the logic of how the recklessness of our government members was a cause for concern and was used as a basis for a cancellation. We used IRON's situation with DVD and turned it on their government members as a counter for their claims. NSO does not actually believe that IRON sought to betray us, as much as it might appear to be that case in this thread.