Enamel32 Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Penlugue Solaris' timestamp='1326483496' post='2898963'] MHA admitted defeat ("1) MHA, KofN, PPO, Apparatus, and TuR admit defeat and surrender to the alliances of GATO, MK, ODN, TPE, TLR, NG, Umbrella, VE, TFD, Hooligans, and Alchemy." http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=108046). [/quote] Interesting, considering Superfriends didn't admit defeat. They surrendered, but did not admit defeat. I suppose you could argue that surrendering implies admission of defeat, but it wasn't explicitly stated. EDIT: The way that announcement reads, the author implies surrendering and admission of defeat are quite different. EDIT2: poor wording Edited January 13, 2012 by Enamel32 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yevgeni Luchenkov Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 Then: -TIDTT(F). do a preemptive strike. -Sparta enters to support the defender. -TOP& co. have to pay huge reps. -Sparta demands reps, finding it totally logical/justified to ask for them (despite entering late, strategically or not). Now: -Fark/FAN do a premptive strike. -Sparta enters to support the attacker. -Fark/FAN/Sparta are offered generous peace terms, no reparations, simply an admission of defeat. -Sparta whines against the wording of the "defeat". You're lucky, greek boys, that you're not dealing with us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krack Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 I'd just like to point out that, ITT, Crymson, Feanor, Bob Janova and Chairman Hal all essentially gave you the same advice. If that's not a flashing warning sign of "what not to do" I don't know what is. It's like the Four Horsemen of CN FAIL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enamel32 Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 Go manufacture another war, yevgeni. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monster Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Yevgeni Luchenkov' timestamp='1326491003' post='2899035'] Then: -TIDTT(F). do a preemptive strike. -Sparta enters to support the defender. -TOP& co. have to pay huge reps. -Sparta demands reps, finding it totally logical/justified to ask for them (despite entering late, strategically or not). Now: -Fark/FAN do a premptive strike. -Sparta enters to support the attacker. -Fark/FAN/Sparta are offered generous peace terms, no reparations, simply an admission of defeat. -Sparta whines against the wording of the "defeat". You're lucky, greek boys, that you're not dealing with us. [/quote] Honestly, the reps would have just gone to C&G instead. It was always C&G's decision to let Sparta have some and Hyp was actually concerned about Sparta not needing it as much. edit: Hm, I remember getting all the black alliances to switch to indirect so the peace deal could go through. Edited January 13, 2012 by Roquentin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorponok Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1326473799' post='2898811'] Why wait for next war? They clearly preempted you, and you won. They don't appreciate the white peace offers, I say start adding on 50 tech per member for every day they avoid taking peace. [/quote] This is what we suggested. But seriously, I don't get it FARK. Your members hardly know most of this, I'd like to see what they'd say if they found out gov had rejected White Peace with no reps. Edited January 13, 2012 by Scorponok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcortell Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 The curious thing to me is what the end game is for FARK, FAN, and Sparta. I feel like they either don't have that in mind, or are too ignorant or oblivious to what it will be. Do they think they are going to continue fighting until pure white peace is reached? They're clearing losing this war and prolonging it will only hurt them more if reps are to be instituted as it continues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Enamel32' timestamp='1326488548' post='2899013'] Interesting, considering Superfriends didn't admit defeat. They surrendered, but did not admit defeat. I suppose you could argue that surrendering implies admission of defeat, but it wasn't explicitly stated. EDIT: The way that announcement reads, the author implies surrendering and admission of defeat are quite different. EDIT2: poor wording [/quote] It doesn't matter the way it is said, admitting defeat or surrendering still have the same meaning. You lost. Edited January 13, 2012 by Penlugue Solaris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerschbs Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 [quote name='Krack' timestamp='1326491246' post='2899040'] I'd just like to point out that, ITT, Crymson, Feanor, Bob Janova and Chairman Hal all essentially gave you the same advice. If that's not a flashing warning sign of "what not to do" I don't know what is. It's like the Four Horsemen of CN FAIL. [/quote] This post should not be overlooked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berbers Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 Yay more war! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChairmanHal Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 [quote name='Krack' timestamp='1326491246' post='2899040'] I'd just like to point out that, ITT, Crymson, Feanor, Bob Janova and Chairman Hal all essentially gave you the same advice. If that's not a flashing warning sign of "what not to do" I don't know what is. It's like the Four Horsemen of CN FAIL.[/quote] You being the Fail-Christ? We're all saying the same thing because only a [url="http://data.whicdn.com/images/15117349/Blind+Fool+Love+BFL_large.jpg"]blind fool[/url] or Charlie Sheen would look at what Fark and FAN are doing and think they are "winning" or at least fighting this out to a draw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Whimsical Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 [quote name='Enamel32' timestamp='1326488548' post='2899013'] Interesting, considering Superfriends didn't admit defeat. They surrendered, but did not admit defeat. I suppose you could argue that surrendering implies admission of defeat, but it wasn't explicitly stated. EDIT: The way that announcement reads, the author implies surrendering and admission of defeat are quite different. EDIT2: poor wording [/quote] It is clear to us who was the victors, and none of us are denying it over here. Mjolnir and Co. earned their win, fair and square. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derantol Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 [quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1326491443' post='2899043'] Honestly, the reps would have just gone to C&G instead. It was always C&G's decision to let Sparta have some and Hyp was actually concerned about Sparta not needing it as much. edit: Hm, I remember getting all the black alliances to switch to indirect so the peace deal could go through. [/quote] On top of that, I know that Sparta forgave at least a portion of the reps owed them by IRON. Before Karma, I remember IRON doing similar things because those who wanted reps demanded a total amount of reps, and if IRON took a portion, we could forgive it soon afterward and lighten the load a little bit. I've never been privy to surrender negotiations, but that's what I remember hearing at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varianz Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 Fark would love to make NPO the bad guy again. By refusing the entirely reasonable terms you've offered them, they hope to provoke you into demanding reps and making the world fear the "ebil NPO" again. Unfortunately for them, the entire world recognizes how !@#$@#$ retarded Fark are, and would have no sympathy for them if you levied reps. Hell, most would applaud you after they spit your offer back at you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monster Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 [quote name='Derantol' timestamp='1326493481' post='2899057'] On top of that, I know that Sparta forgave at least a portion of the reps owed them by IRON. Before Karma, I remember IRON doing similar things because those who wanted reps demanded a total amount of reps, and if IRON took a portion, we could forgive it soon afterward and lighten the load a little bit. I've never been privy to surrender negotiations, but that's what I remember hearing at the time. [/quote] The only alliance they really wanted reps from was Legion because of the whole surrender fiasco. A lot of them were upset about the TOOL terms. C&G gave Olaf the negotiating power for TIDTT and he was Olaf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omniscient1 Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 [quote name='ChairmanHal' timestamp='1326493124' post='2899053'] You being the Fail-Christ? We're all saying the same thing because only a [url="http://data.whicdn.com/images/15117349/Blind+Fool+Love+BFL_large.jpg"]blind fool[/url] or Charlie Sheen would look at what Fark and FAN are doing and think they are "winning" or at least fighting this out to a draw. [/quote] You know, this post made me chuckle. I don't normally say this, but good post, Chairman Hal. [quote name='Varianz' timestamp='1326493876' post='2899058'] Fark would love to make NPO the bad guy again. By refusing the entirely reasonable terms you've offered them, they hope to provoke you into demanding reps and making the world fear the "ebil NPO" again. Unfortunately for them, the entire world recognizes how !@#$@#$ retarded Fark are, and would have no sympathy for them if you levied reps. Hell, most would applaud you after they spit your offer back at you. [/quote] This was my thought too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enderland Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 [quote name='bcortell' timestamp='1326492160' post='2899048'] The curious thing to me is what the end game is for FARK, FAN, and Sparta. I feel like they either don't have that in mind, or are too ignorant or oblivious to what it will be. Do they think they are going to continue fighting until pure white peace is reached? They're clearing losing this war and prolonging it will only hurt them more if reps are to be instituted as it continues. [/quote] It's entirely possible this [i]is[/i] their end game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artigo Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 Sparta whining? This has never happened before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alterego Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 This whole war for Sparta was about swallowing whatever pride they have and minimising damage by picking the smallest targets available and keeping most of their NS in peace mode. I find it hard to believe they are now putting pride ahead of an easy exit by refusing to admit defeat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EViL0nE Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 (edited) So ITT we learn 1) Fark/FAN are ruining CN because the next war will have massive reps due to their reluctance to accept white peace. So they should just admit defeat. 2) Fark/FAN are ruining their alliances and making them politically irrelevant because they will just be destroyed or sit in DLT mode while everyone else outgrows them. So they should just admit defeat. 3) Fark/FAN should be charged massive reps for (1) and (2). So they should just admit defeat. I'm not quite sure how (1) affects Fark/FAN if (2) is true, though. Can someone explain that? If they are taking themselves out of the chess game of life on planet Bob by not accepting your terms, why would they care about the poor !@#$%^& who receives crippling reps? Or are you saying they should admit defeat now so the next time they are involved in a war you can offer them crippling reps? I'm also curious how (3) is any sort of logical conclusion to the current situation. They aren't willing to accept the current peace offer, so offering them harsher terms is somehow going to change their mind? It seems at this point, the plethora of alliances that bandwagoned onto Fark/FAN for the sake of talking crap about how they are terrible at war when fighting a coalition many, many times their size have simply created a monster of nations at relatively small NS levels with a ton of tech and WCs that will not be matched by people who are legitimately within their range. I'd tell those fighting them to have fun with that, but it's already been stated that Fark/FAN are ruining everyone's fun by not admitting defeat. Edited January 14, 2012 by EViL0nE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enderland Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 [quote name='EViL0nE' timestamp='1326499647' post='2899122'] So ITT we learn [snip] [/quote] You clearly didn't actually learn anything from this thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander shepard Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 (edited) Sparta still has 291 nations. This war has only just begun. Edited January 14, 2012 by Commander shepard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardus Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 Clearly kindness has failed. Be cruel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groucho Marx Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 Let's bring back forced disbandment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monster Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Alterego' timestamp='1326499457' post='2899119'] This whole war for Sparta was about swallowing whatever pride they have and minimising damage by picking the smallest targets available and keeping most of their NS in peace mode. I find it hard to believe they are now putting pride ahead of an easy exit by refusing to admit defeat. [/quote] lol. If you really think they didn't think they'd get countered through oA chains, you're dreaming. Hitting NG would bring in VE/FOK in on them. BAPS and Oly are also elite fighting alliances. I'm oh so sorry they didn't play into your hand instead. You might have a legit point if they just hit TIO. It'd be like if IRON declared on Argent and Gre and everyone said "Well, they sure picked an easy fight." I don't really care about the surrender/defeat thing since I didn't really like it when RoK did it. You all cheered it on, so reap what you sow. Edited January 14, 2012 by Roquentin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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