The Future of Neo-Hegemony ?

[Cortath]

[quote name='Prime minister Johns' date='10 March 2010 - 03:03 AM' timestamp='1268208539' post='2220770']
I wonder how long it will take a neo-karma to emerge and take down the neo-hegemony (Whoever that is)?

Setting out to become a hegemony is playing with fire in my opinion.
[/quote]

Fire is pretty cool though. It makes neat colors.

[Chief Savage Man]

We're all aiming to be the hegemon in some way or another (or at least part of it). If we weren't jostling for dominance, this COMMUNITY would be boring.

edit: oh dear I'm always forgetting that

Edited March 10, 2010 by Chief Savage Man

[shahenshah]

[quote name='Prime minister Johns' date='10 March 2010 - 01:03 PM' timestamp='1268208539' post='2220770']
Setting out to become a hegemony is playing with fire in my opinion.
[/quote]
I agree but..it has started already: http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=82415&st=0

Anyway regarding what ex-heg could do..do principled FA, if there are friends with no strings (we dont like your ...friends.. of friends.......etc), thats nice and well, but if not, then one side is enforcing isolationism indirectly.

Edited March 10, 2010 by shahenshah

[Jack Diorno]

[quote name='shahenshah' date='11 March 2010 - 06:17 AM' timestamp='1268252576' post='2221198']
I agree but..it has started already: http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=82415&st=0
[/quote]
Echelon must be stopped.

[KainIIIC]

[quote name='Working_Class_Ruler' date='10 March 2010 - 03:58 AM' timestamp='1268215408' post='2220808']
Aww MHA, Umbrella, FOK, Sparta, Gre and NSO (?) need to make a bloc - look at us all just floating in the middle there without any pretty circles around us. We could be called the Pound Puppies, or the Raggy Dolls.
[/quote]

I'm sure all of those alliances would get along extremely well, especially NSO and Sparta... and somehow Gre would have to go back the paper route?

I'm still holding out on NPO joining C&G.

In any event, to all those complaining out there, neo-Hegemony is just a lazy, easier way of categorizing the large group of alliances associated with the "Hegemony" pre-Karma, and that side of the treaty web. If you were a participant for the non-Karma, non-SuperComplaints side in any of the last 3 wars, then you're probably part of the neo-Hegemony.

What can be done about it? Well, the easiest would be to hope that SuperComplaints fights itself over. By treaties, they aren't linked very strongly, and creating that link was one of the important steps to establishing the Karma coalition that took down NPO. However, after (and in large part because of) the TPF war and the current conflict, i'd say the two blocs are closer than ever. However, it only took 8 months for three solidly aligned blocs (SF, LEO, Cit) to the NPO to abandon based on the justifications and momentum for war. If you think about the Polar-\m/ conflict, and had IRON/TOP got itself in through more traditional means (through purple or NSO, for example) and peace not been declared, you would have had a very even battlefield, possibly one tilted towards the Polar side. That scenario was not to be, however, as we all know. But given that we probably aren't going to have a war until another 10 months or so, don't be surprised to see significant FA changes, or even a 'Karma Civil War'.

As far as the 'Neo-Hegemony' alliances go, what they really have to do is outgame the other side and connect themselves and 'win' certain alliances over outside of the treaty web. The first of course would be that 'BLUnity 2.0' section, but after that they need to begin winning back over groups like LEO and individual alliances of NOIR (not named Sparta). Or regain MHA/Ex-Citadel. All are really hard tasks. Entrenching yourself to either SF or to C&G though, may turn out disappointing. C&G for example did not bat at all for Polar's side despite being heavily connected to them.

[Rafael Nadal]

[quote name='KainIIIC' date='10 March 2010 - 12:50 PM' timestamp='1268254518' post='2221228']
I'm sure all of those alliances would get along extremely well, especially NSO and Sparta... and somehow Gre would have to go back the paper route?

[b]I'm still holding out on NPO joining C&G.[/b]

In any event, to all those complaining out there, neo-Hegemony is just a lazy, easier way of categorizing the large group of alliances associated with the "Hegemony" pre-Karma, and that side of the treaty web. If you were a participant for the non-Karma, non-SuperComplaints side in any of the last 3 wars, then you're probably part of the neo-Hegemony.

What can be done about it? Well, the easiest would be to hope that SuperComplaints fights itself over. By treaties, they aren't linked very strongly, and creating that link was one of the important steps to establishing the Karma coalition that took down NPO. However, after (and in large part because of) the TPF war and the current conflict, i'd say the two blocs are closer than ever. However, it only took 8 months for three solidly aligned blocs (SF, LEO, Cit) to the NPO to abandon based on the justifications and momentum for war. If you think about the Polar-\m/ conflict, and had IRON/TOP got itself in through more traditional means (through purple or NSO, for example) and peace not been declared, you would have had a very even battlefield, possibly one tilted towards the Polar side. That scenario was not to be, however, as we all know. But given that we probably aren't going to have a war until another 10 months or so, don't be surprised to see significant FA changes, or even a 'Karma Civil War'.

As far as the 'Neo-Hegemony' alliances go, what they really have to do is outgame the other side and connect themselves and 'win' certain alliances over outside of the treaty web. The first of course would be that 'BLUnity 2.0' section, but after that they need to begin winning back over groups like LEO and individual alliances of NOIR (not named Sparta). Or regain MHA/Ex-Citadel. All are really hard tasks. Entrenching yourself to either SF or to C&G though, may turn out disappointing. C&G for example did not bat at all for Polar's side despite being heavily connected to them.
[/quote]
Whoever leaked that is getting pzi'd.

[Banksy]

[quote name='KainIIIC' date='11 March 2010 - 08:50 AM' timestamp='1268254518' post='2221228']
I'm still holding out on NPO joining C&G.[/quote]
Already a member. The OdN joined a while back.

[D34th]

[i]Summa sedes non capit duos.[/i](The highest seat does not hold two.)

After finish with old-hegemony soon or later CnG-SF will fight, it's just a matter of time.

[Haflinger]

[quote name='supercoolyellow' date='09 March 2010 - 01:28 AM' timestamp='1268116398' post='2219019']
So what do I think Neo-hegemony should do to avoid a curb stomp? Clever remarks about proxy spying protectorates, and preemptive attacks aside, I think neo-hegemony alliances should reach out and make new friends outside of their power sphere so they aren't so isolated.
[/quote]
It'd be a little easier if people we signed treaties with didn't get visits from C&G government reminding them of how we're supposed to stay isolated.

[Alterego]

[quote name='Haflinger' date='10 March 2010 - 10:29 PM' timestamp='1268260490' post='2221320']
It'd be a little easier if people we signed treaties with didn't get visits from C&G government reminding them of how we're supposed to stay isolated.
[/quote]
Smells like MK

[Sandwich Controversy]

[quote name='Haflinger' date='10 March 2010 - 05:29 PM' timestamp='1268260490' post='2221320']
It'd be a little easier if people we signed treaties with didn't get visits from C&G government reminding them of how we're supposed to stay isolated.
[/quote]
If we were actually doing this you wouldn't have any treaties at all

[supercoolyellow]

[quote name='Alterego' date='10 March 2010 - 04:43 PM' timestamp='1268261355' post='2221337']
Smells like MK
[/quote]

nah, I'm sure FoB and GR go around telling ppl not to sign treaties with other people

[Cotillion]

[quote name='supercoolyellow' date='10 March 2010 - 11:13 PM' timestamp='1268263107' post='2221380']
nah, I'm sure FoB and GR go around telling ppl not to sign treaties with other people
[/quote]

They do what ODN tells them to, as does the rest of C&G.

[joracy]

[quote name='Haflinger' date='10 March 2010 - 05:29 PM' timestamp='1268260490' post='2221320']
It'd be a little easier if people we signed treaties with didn't get visits from C&G government reminding them of how we're supposed to stay isolated.
[/quote]

Oh my, look at the time. I almost missed my appointment, thanks Haf!

[infinite citadel]

[quote name='Haflinger' date='10 March 2010 - 06:29 PM' timestamp='1268260490' post='2221320']
It'd be a little easier if people we signed treaties with didn't get visits from C&G government reminding them of how we're supposed to stay isolated.
[/quote]

Who leaked our Post-War Strategy? Come on guys

[Chickenzilla]

MK, can Vanguard treaty with them? PLEASE!

[Denial]

[quote name='Rafael Nadal' date='11 March 2010 - 06:36 AM' timestamp='1268255494' post='2221242']
Whoever leaked that is getting pzi'd.
[/quote]
No, no. Eternal ZI. You'll never be a hegemonist with that attitude [img]http://thecastlehall.com/boards/Smileys/kickass/colbert.gif[/img]

[quote name='Haflinger' date='11 March 2010 - 07:59 AM' timestamp='1268260490' post='2221320']
It'd be a little easier if people we signed treaties with didn't get visits from C&G government reminding them of how we're supposed to stay isolated.
[/quote]
... Where do you even get this stuff? Really.

[Augustus Autumn]

At this point the former Hegemony (the remnants of The Continuum and One-Vision among others) appear to be headed off in different directions, some because of perceived political benefits in avoiding one another, some over bad blood and still others because of some utterly baffling ideas about attempting to be sneaky and manipulative. Whatever. Unless there's some [i]very[/i] good plan out there in the works which would bring the level of competance among alliance leadership up several scales in my eyes you're probably not going to see some sort of resurgence any time soon.

That being said, for the remnants it makes the most sense to sit back and wait. As much as people like to say things about Superfriends and C&G being best buds right now, historical data shows that at some point one of them will object to the other one playing on their lawn and bust out the twelve-gauge. The shooting will start, the nukes will fly and another round of bitterness will begin. Sure, the finger pointing as the formerly usual suspects like Pacifica is possible in order to stave off the drift but, honestly, that won't work for too long, especially if they fail to actually provide a reason. The same goes for any of those other alliances - I just use Pacifica because they have an arousing flag. What does it arouse? Patriotism. Perverts.

So, when does the shooting start? Hell if I know. Might take a year, might take two, might happen tomorrow if someone steps on someone else's lawn, but it'll happen eventually. On that note, I've got a TAR-21 to tend to.

[Haflinger]

[quote name='Denial' date='10 March 2010 - 07:57 PM' timestamp='1268269373' post='2221556']
... Where do you even get this stuff? Really.
[/quote]
From my treaty partners. Duh.

[Chickenzilla]

[quote name='Haflinger' date='10 March 2010 - 10:29 PM' timestamp='1268282063' post='2221787']
From my treaty partners. Duh.
[/quote]
My treaty partners told me Invicta and UPN told them that wanted TOP and IRON to perma ZI all of C&G and make us tech farms.

[Lincongrad]

I don't liked being grouped into 'Neo-Hegemony'. The Legion follows her own road and these artificial groupings are just that... artificial. There's no neo-hegemony bloc, just like there's no Karma bloc.

[Banksy]

We could get always get freaky

[img]http://i39.tinypic.com/t5lnrc.jpg[/img]

Or even worse

[img]http://i44.tinypic.com/28rpeyq.jpg[/img]

Drawing circles around alliances is very simplistic. Just because you can draw some around one group does not mean they will 'roll' together in the future.

Edited March 11, 2010 by Banksy

[janax]

You need to draw the circle under TOP and get us out from that grouping.

We were part of the "make the world a better place" faction of Karma.

[flak attack]

[quote name='janax' date='11 March 2010 - 01:28 AM' timestamp='1268289215' post='2221910']
You need to draw the circle under TOP and get us out from that grouping.

We were part of the "make the world a better place" faction of Karma.
[/quote]
How funny that TOP ended up fighting a war against free speech almost a year later.

[supercoolyellow]

[quote name='Banksy' date='11 March 2010 - 12:02 AM' timestamp='1268287672' post='2221878']


Drawing circles around alliances is very simplistic. Just because you can draw some around one group does not mean they will 'roll' together in the future.
[/quote]

It is simplistic, but thats the purpose of models, to make sense of more complex systems. I hope you aren't trying to deny that there are different spheres of power in CN. To say that would just be noobish.