Oh well, It is what it is...no real proof though

[WorldConqueror]

[quote name='Fernando12' timestamp='1283672997' post='2442437']
I raided some nations lol. I'm told I have to go to the academy and be an initiate for a month. I said no.

I told them it wouldn't end well if they just didn't let my 2 raids go. They didn't listen.

I told them my raids were no big deal, they said rules are rules and I had to be punished.

The same arguments NSO are making here is what I was saying earlier about my raids on nations.

NSO, when I say let it go I mean let it go
[/quote]
Not sure what you're trying to prove with this, any alliance would have disciplined you for breaking the rules. If it was me I would have attacked you when you refused to go back to the academy. That you think employing the 'too cool for school' technique in this situation is a good response to all that NSO has done for you just shows what a piece of #@%! you are.

[heggo]

I think I said this before and I'm pretty sure we can all agree here. Even when fernando's right, he's still wrong.

[Il Impero Romano]

[quote name='heggo' timestamp='1283673943' post='2442446']
Are you Viridian too Polar to....
Actually, I was referring to this: (1:42:19 AM) Sardonic[GOONS]: liable financially, not as an act of war.
My summaries were just of other aspects of the sardonic talks / a prior talk. I'll edit it to avoid confusion.
[/quote]

I'm sorry, so your point is because they would be seeking reps from the individual in question and not using the matter outright as an immediate CB on the alliance in which he resides, you thought he meant they would be taking no military action if he refused to pay? Maybe that's where my confusion lied, because that's just retarded.

[heggo]

[quote name='Il Impero Romano' timestamp='1283674351' post='2442453']
I'm sorry, so your point is because they would be seeking reps from the individual in question and not using the matter outright as an immediate CB on the alliance in which he resides, you thought he meant they would be taking no military action if he refused to pay? Maybe that's where my confusion lied, because that's just retarded.
[/quote]
Well if no agreement about reps were come to, I would fully expect them to roll Dopp. I already said that wouldn't be all that unreasonable. It's just that they were referring to a CB on all of us, which is a clear violation of the agreement. Just read the logs.

[JT Jag]

So, just to be clear, here is everyone's status after this trainwreck of a discussion.

Fernando12: Ragequit his alliance, won't stop complaining. In the wrong.
Corinan: Supported a nuclear rogue and repeatedly lied about it. In the wrong.
NSO Leadership: Vocally backed the wrong horse. In the wrong.
Goons Leadership: Because GOONS . In the wrong.
Methrage: Is a Very Very Special Person. In the wrong.

Me: The finest source of high-quality breaking news and commentary on this issue. In the right.

Does this sound correct to everyone?

[Il Impero Romano]

[quote name='heggo' timestamp='1283674563' post='2442454']
Well if no agreement about reps were come to, I would fully expect them to roll Dopp. I already said that wouldn't be all that unreasonable. It's just that they were referring to a CB on all of us, which is a clear violation of the agreement. Just read the logs.
[/quote]

In those logs I see no such thing, except for the obvious presumption that if you do not release him from your alliance for attack in the event he fails to pay, the owness will then fall to NSO as a group (once again, standard for rogues). Sardonic said he did not make a call on reps yet, not that he was deciding whether or not he would use it as an immediate CB. He also pointed out he never said this would not go to war, and it stands to reason that he said that because you could still very well refuse to release the rogue and the matter would then be between alliances (an interpretation supported by his closing lines pointing out the financial liability). Neither of those things lead one to believe that he is going back on what he said and using this tomorrow night as cause to blitz NSO.

Edited September 5, 2010 by Il Impero Romano

[Sephiroth]

Corinan and anyone else who might want to fight and not involve their entire alliance is welcome to join Kerberos Nexus and enjoy the war, then afterward go back to their previous alliance if they want or stay.

[Beefspari]

I got curious, so I thought I'd post this for everyone saying 90m is extortion.

[quote](1:31:30 AM) Heggo: She stated she couldn't provide specifics, this is true
(1:31:44 AM) Heggo: but giving the general impression of paying for damages, maybe double or triple damages
(1:31:49 AM) Heggo: is completely and utterly different
(1:31:57 AM) Heggo: from demanding either dopp unconditionally surrender
(1:32:03 AM) Heggo: or pay 10x damages.
[b](1:32:05 AM) Doppelganger: like I said I'm willing to go X 10[/b]
(1:32:09 AM) Doppelganger: which is a lot still[/quote]

I asked someone who got nuked to how me his damages.

[quote]Message: Your nation has been attacked with nuclear weapons by Methrage. You lost 8962 soldiers, 323 defending tanks, 0 cruise missiles, 155.325 miles of land, 4.700 technology, 155.325 infrastructure, 75% of your aircraft, and 25% of your nuclear vulnerable navy force. In addition to these losses your nation will experience many days of economic devastation.[/quote]

He had about 1200 infra before, and was nuked down by 155. With his setup, it's over $3m JUST for infra for that ONE nuke on ONE nation. That's not counting his loss in tech, his land, his tanks, soldiers, planes, the destruction and loss from anarchy, the fact that Methrage also built up enough to raid $1.5m off him, the CMs and GAs falling doing more damage or Methrage's 80 planes (which he didn't have before the aid) doing infra damage.

JUST the infra from JUST a nuke is $3m. Three nukes at $3m damage each x10 that Doppel said he'd be willing to do is already $90m. Before you even consider CM/GA/plane damage. Before you even consider anarchy. Before you even consider the loss of military, tech, and land. Before you even consider that the money could've resulted in more than 3 nukes. He's actually launched at least 8 so far. Or money raided in GAs. Or heck even the 20 spies we had to lose to spy Corinan.

At 5x damages this would still easily pass 90m. Even at 3x damages I have no doubt it'd hit 90m. 90m is not extortion. That money went into nukes which was easily peeling off that in just infra.

Also I know I'm not the "rep person" but we're currently mulling this over for options while we're discussing internally. This isn't a final thing and we're still just talking it over. But to give you an idea:

* 90m OR 600t (payable to who we indicate)
* Decommission of FAC which can't be rebuilt for 160 days
* A nice little poem or picture or something which our High Adjudicator will come up with

Edited September 5, 2010 by Beefspari

[JT Jag]

I for one back the "coupled pair of sonnets in iambic pentameter on the topic of your favorite powertool" option.

[nutkase]

[quote name='Fernando12' timestamp='1283672997' post='2442437']
I raided some nations lol. I'm told I have to go to the academy and be an initiate for a month. I said no.

I told them it wouldn't end well if they just didn't let my 2 raids go. They didn't listen.

I told them my raids were no big deal, they said rules are rules and I had to be punished.

The same arguments NSO are making here is what I was saying earlier about my raids on nations.

NSO, when I say let it go I mean let it go
[/quote]

Wow this really shows your attitude and your belief that you are above rules and regulations, how pathetic.

[Alfred von Tirpitz]

RV did i tell you back when you guys let in Fernando that it was one of the all time dud moves? Worse than what Dopp did right now. If i did not tell you then, i apologize, i meant to tell you.

[Vanilla Napalm]

o/ GOONS
we were coming dangerously close to running out of fresh "unfair discrimination against NSO" in Alliance Announcements.

[Haflinger]

How many nukes did Methrage buy with Dopp's aid?

For the record, the one time Invicta took reps for a nuclear attack, it was 300 tech for five nukes, for which we incidentally paid 6M.

Remember, we support horrible, crippling reps; we're a part of the Hegemony after all. So try setting your reps demands below ours.

[Ashoka the Great]

Well now, this is a party I'm sad to have missed. But, having read the whole danged thing, I do have some observations:

1. Fernando is a terrible person to have in one's alliance. I said that when he was in FAR, again when he almost got FAR rolled, a third time when he joined the NSO and multiple times during the RoK/NSO conflict.

2. The NSO doesn't actually care about this, beyond avoiding war. If you read their posts at the beginning and compare with later ones, they're now almost at the point of defending what their idiot member has done. A sensible alliance would have expelled VikDoppCor publicly along with a short "Do what you will" statement directed at GOONS. Now they're arguing over numbers.

3. I dearly hope GOONS rolls the NSO over this. It's obvious that 'Hallowe'en NPO' haven't learned their lesson yet.

4. I doubt GOONS will actually roll NSO, although I wouldn't mind being wrong. Seriously, guys. You have your CB on a silver freaking platter, and the only people who will fault you for using it are those you'd expect to complain.

5. Coming up next: An NSO 'We Will Not Be Asking For Our Allies' Help' thread?



Please don't disappoint me, GOONS.

[Marneus Calgar]

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' timestamp='1283690230' post='2442523']
5. Coming up next: An NSO 'We Will Not Be Asking For Our Allies' Help' thread?
[/quote]
Do you think they'd help after two blunders?

[thaone]

This thread delivers

I really meant that most of you are really crazy !@#$%^&*.

[shahenshah]

[quote name='Davian Thule' timestamp='1283690395' post='2442525']
Do you think they'd help after two blunders?
[/quote]

What he thinks is of no concern.

This matter can be resolved diplomatically, but this is Bob

Edited September 5, 2010 by shahenshah

[Poyplemonkeys]

When GOONS aided a nuclear rogue in a war against Nemesis with 50 tech we were offered 50 tech in compensation by them. Inflation's a !@#$%*...

Destroying wonders is terribly lame too.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='Poyplemonkeys' timestamp='1283691316' post='2442533']
When GOONS aided a nuclear rogue in a war against Nemesis with 50 tech we were offered 50 tech in compensation by them. Inflation's a !@#$%*...

Destroying wonders is terribly lame too.
[/quote]


Don't listen to this hippy $%&@. GOONS, please take this opportunity that has been gifted to you.

[thaone]

[quote name='Davian Thule' timestamp='1283690395' post='2442525']
Do you think they'd help after two blunders?
[/quote]

I think my definition of blunder is somewhat different from yours.

[potato]

[quote name='shahenshah' timestamp='1283690710' post='2442529']
What he thinks is of no concern.
[/quote]

Why not? KingZog's word is much more important and relevant than your inane drivel.

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='potato' timestamp='1283692646' post='2442544']
Why not? KingZog's word is much more important and relevant than your inane drivel.
[/quote]
Awwww!

/me hugs potato

Of course, in a way he's right. I don't have a dog in this fight, so it doesn't particularly matter to me.

That being said, I expect NSO will get away with it....again. Despite repeated examples, folks have yet to figure out that the NSO does all of this on purpose. (And then they laugh about it and get their allies to pick up the tab.)

They need to be put down, but I doubt GOONS will do it.

[MagicalTrevor]

Literally more retarded than \m/ pre UJW


Good job NSO, that's a hefty title to take.

[Ardus]

You're doing it again.

[b]You're doing it again.[/b]

How daft are you?

[_GunneR_]

[quote name='shahenshah' timestamp='1283690710' post='2442529']
What he thinks is of no concern.

This matter can be resolved diplomatically, but this is Bob
[/quote]
Bob just doesn't learn. Lessons just don't sink in.