This Week in GATO

[HeroofTime55]

A shining example of what you're supposed to do in bizarro world, maybe. I'm privy to information that I could use to categorically disprove every statement you've just made, but I'll refrain from airing dirty laundry in public.

As for your respect, keep it. We're not interested.

 

Oh no, by all means, please do.  Your claims are ludicrous, arguing literally that VE schemed to get out of making sacrifices by... making huge sacrifices.  Your arguments are false not because facts happen to not line up your way, they are false because they are logically inconsistent with themselves.

Feel absolutely free to actually attempt to contradict this, instead of shouting a really vague and ambiguous "I have stuff that proves my case but I'm not sharing! Na na bo bo!"

 

As far as not being interested in respect, that's why you're currently getting your asses kicked.  It's a pretty piss-poor FA strategy, but to each his own.

[D34th]

I expressed the desire that Schatt pursue D34th's noble goal of making the Cyberverse a better place. This thread, like much of the Schatt that dirties up this locale, does not contribute to that goal at all.

 

Depends of your concept of what you consider a better place. For me a better OWF is a more active place where people fight with arguments not personal insults or inane arguments like "We don't care" or "You're irrelevant". This thread and its 18 pages obviously helped the OWF to become more active and therefore a better place, your posts however did not since instead of use arguments to debate and refute Schatt, all you did was question his character  in fact I'm right now taking a look at your last 25 posts and you directly mention Schatt's name in 8 of them and in all the 8 instead of counter his argument all you do some is some comment about his personality. Quoting some of your last posts:

"Have you not encountered Schatt before? Of course that is what it is. But he does try so hard to amuse, and sometimes succeeds, so he's worth the occasional stroke."

 

"Yes. You understand that it was a joke. Please explain it to Schatt, who seems to be struggling with it."

"O lawd. How out of touch do you have to be to imagine that he was making a serious offer? ODN will not be paying reps on our own behalf or anyone else's. The serious players understand this very well. I don't know when Schatt lost his touch quite this badly."

 

"I was thinking more of something like Schatt gazing lovingly in the mirror while typing bizarre fantasies. Hard to capture in an image, I suppose."

 

And the last one is my favorite:

"We are Schatt's particular obsession. I won't bother to psychoanalyze him. He no doubt has some soi-disant strategic justification for his Schatt-stirring in our peaceful little corner of Bob to cover whatever the real source of his fascination is. We are content to take his fumbling attentions as a sort of inept compliment."

 

Ironic huh? Taking a look at your posts one would say that you're the one obsessed with something. Now, please note that I'm not trying to defend Schattenmann here, he is big enough to defend himself, what I'm trying to make you realize is that if you want a better OWF, please start changing the way you comment here, after fixing it you can start to point fingers.

"Be the change you want to see in the world" 

Edited March 26, 2013 by D34th

[Banned]

I wouldn't call Pingu's fascination an obsession.  Being an enemy of Schattenman is a huge PR boost.  First, he puts new members in your alliance boosting your overall alliance strength, then he messages all your applicants to let them know that there's a war going on.  Do you have any idea how thankful our MoD was that he was able to get all his messages out in one day because he didn't have to send messages to our applicants, knowing that Schattenman would handle that for us? 

 

And that's just from ODN's perspective.  I mean, did you read this episode of TWiG?  Clearly, magicninja was upset and ranting about people embarrassing GATO, so Schattenman writes up a lovely article for the OWF in an attempt to confirm magicninja's original argument, as a way to bolster up the activity of some of the less serious GATOans. 

 

Only war opponent I've ever known who makes your job fighting him easier.  Class act as always!

Edited March 26, 2013 by Banned

[WorldConqueror]

Just so I don't rush to conclusions, be concise. Take a deep breath, relax, now rewrite that comment in comprehensible words so we can understand them.
 
What you list here are 2 possible scenarios for why we fought this way, unless I'm mistaken of course.
 
1. We didn't co-ordinate with our coalition for a war of attrition that will last this long.
2. We wanted an easy way out by losing in excess of 75% of our NS.
 
Well, to answer both, we haven't bowed out yet, have we? Despite losing most of our strength we're still fighting for our allies. So much for not fighting a long fight and for wanting an easy way out. Fighting like this and remaining in the fight till now speaks so much for the alleged coalition strategy. PM was not needed to fight a long war, we're the living proof of it.
 
Just out of of curiosity though, are you speaking your own views or echoing MK's?

Sorry, this is not a long war. It's been about 2 months since the DoW, I was expecting at the very least another month. And had the whole coalition stuck to the plan, we could have easily continued fighting up to and past that. Your strategy has worked out in a sense, because peace is coming earlier than expected, but it's a bit of a chicken-egg situation. Did your strategy work because peace was always assumed to be coming now, or did peace come now because your strategy got you wrecked? As for the bold part, not for lack of want!

[Prodigal Moon]

"We are Schatt's particular obsession. I won't bother to psychoanalyze him. He no doubt has some soi-disant strategic justification for his Schatt-stirring in our peaceful little corner of Bob to cover whatever the real source of his fascination is. We are content to take his fumbling attentions as a sort of inept compliment."

 

Ironic huh? Taking a look at your posts one would say that you're the one obsessed with something.

Hahaha excellent. Some would call this particular brand of irony "projection." Schattenmann is just so irrelevant that I can't stop schattenmanning and did I mention Schattenmann?

 

I think we all crave more intrigue and excitement in this political scene, and I know of few people who do more to bring it then the Shadow Man himself. I guess it's not fair to expect the target(s) to appreciate it on that level, but deep down they know this sort of thing makes the world a much better place indeed.

Edited March 26, 2013 by Prodigal Moon

[Pingu]

I have said before that we in ODN, and probably C&G as a whole, have a particular affection for Schatt. His attentions complete us, including in some of the ways described above by Banned. Knowing that we keep him so busy and happy adds to our enjoyment of life. That is different from saying that a thread like this makes Planet Bob or the Cyberverse a better place. I am not so selfish as to consider my own enjoyment of his attentions the measure of what makes the world better. If making me happy, or C&G happy, is what makes the world better, then I can lay out a plan for you all to follow. But I can easily see that C&G's interests might not be identical with the interests of the planet as a whole.

[Diogenes]

Oh no, by all means, please do.  Your claims are ludicrous, arguing literally that VE schemed to get out of making sacrifices by... making huge sacrifices.  Your arguments are false not because facts happen to not line up your way, they are false because they are logically inconsistent with themselves.

Feel absolutely free to actually attempt to contradict this, instead of shouting a really vague and ambiguous "I have stuff that proves my case but I'm not sharing! Na na bo bo!"

 

As far as not being interested in respect, that's why you're currently getting your asses kicked.  It's a pretty piss-poor FA strategy, but to each his own.

 

I'm interested in being respected, just not by you.

 

Out of a desire to not derail this discussion any further, I'll clarify my implication as being that VE has avoided making huge sacrifices in the last two wars by making smaller ones, and leave it at that. 

[enderland]

 Being an enemy of Schattenman is a huge PR boost.

 

I think things average out just fine.

[mmansfield68]

Everybody knows that utilizing Peace Mode is cowardice when your opponent does it, and strategy when you do it.

 

This well known paradigm predates the Bible.

 

Gongratulations to everyone, since much like masturbation, we all do it.

Edited March 26, 2013 by mmansfield68

[Mugiwara]

Everybody knows that utilizing Peace Mode is cowardice when your opponent does it, and strategy when you do it.

 

Funny how people can talk shit when they aren't on the receiving end of a curbstomp right?

Edited March 26, 2013 by Mugiwara

[keeology]

Everybody knows that utilizing Peace Mode is cowardice when your opponent does it, and strategy when you do it.

 

This well known paradigm predates the Bible.

 

Gongratulations to everyone, since much like masturbation, we all do it.

 

Amen. 

[d3mon]

I'm interested in being respected, just not by you.

 

Out of a desire to not derail this discussion any further, I'll clarify my implication as being that VE has avoided making huge sacrifices in the last two wars by making smaller ones, and leave it at that. 

 

VE has lost significantly more than most alliances on DH side, I am not sure how their actions are impacting the peace negotiations but stating that VE didn't give it all is ridiculous.

 

Both GATO and VE are fighting honorably, and with good intent.  They just have widely different, and incompatible, views of what the best strategy is and was.

 

As long as everyone in the iC was on the same page, I agree that this is probably the most correct and respectful assessment of the situation. Which one was more honorable is rather debatable.

[Enamel32]

Gongratulations to everyone, since much like masturbation, we all do it.

Whoa buddy. Speak for yourself. Nobody masturbates in Stachyland. Nobody. :ph34r:

 

OOC: forum quote system sucks a massive one.

[LordSlop]

Sorry, this is not a long war. It's been about 2 months since the DoW, I was expecting at the very least another month. And had the whole coalition stuck to the plan, we could have easily continued fighting up to and past that. Your strategy has worked out in a sense, because peace is coming earlier than expected, but it's a bit of a chicken-egg situation. Did your strategy work because peace was always assumed to be coming now, or did peace come now because your strategy got you wrecked? As for the bold part, not for lack of want!

 

I'm sure MK's warmongering horde of 42 fighting nations out of 94 (45%) really forced Equilibrium to the table due to the tantamount damage done by MK's said staggering numbers.

[WorldConqueror]

I'm sure MK's warmongering horde of 42 fighting nations out of 94 (45%) really forced Equilibrium to the table due to the tantamount damage done by MK's said staggering numbers.

You're really showing your lack of a basic grasp of war tactics. Our nations cycle in and out to restock nukes, that is common sense in any war. Besides which, you're forgetting about our off-AA nations, like mine. Nice to see that you decided to go for the weak deflection rather than counter anything I said though! Please attempt a defense of your alliance's decision to go full retard.

[LordSlop]

You're really showing your lack of a basic grasp of war tactics. Our nations cycle in and out to restock nukes, that is common sense in any war. Besides which, you're forgetting about our off-AA nations, like mine. Nice to see that you decided to go for the weak deflection rather than counter anything I said though! Please attempt a defense of your alliance's decision to go full retard.

 

Damn, that was too easy, drawing this out of you was no challenge, I expected at least 3 more comments before you actually spoke your mind (MK's?) concerning VE. Thank you.

 

Back to the original topic though.

 

1. We put our money where our mouth is, we don't hide behind Umb, which is more than I can say for some others *cough* MK *cough*

2. Well, you haven't replied to WC's first paragraph yet. I've quoted it for you below so you don't need to scroll through tiresome posts to find it.

 

Actually, neither of those are true. The original strategy was to force a ton of hurt from the DH front on AI that it would force a peace for the overall coalition the quickest since we were all hugely outnumbered to begin with. IRON and NPO however did and continue to do a great job of staggering us while several alliances adopted a peace tier strategy/focused on other fronts leaving us locked in for the whole war.

 

To be honest, I'm not really complaining. I've always been a proponent of an all out war between opposing sides for a month or 2 before being able to shake hands and do it again a few months later. That's when this game was at its peak and most fun, when we had constant wars. However, the constant use of peace tactics delay war closures for months (effectively making the game unplayable for their peace mode nations) and proceed to make the next "peace" period last longer, possibly making a wait for another war be another year. 

 

Just my 2 cents.

 

We went in according to the original plan, only, someone failed to follow.

[WorldConqueror]

Damn, that was too easy, drawing this out of you was no challenge, I expected at least 3 more comments before you actually spoke your mind (MK's?) concerning VE. Thank you.
 
Back to the original topic though.
 
1. We put our money where our mouth is, we don't hide behind Umb, which is more than I can say for some others *cough* MK *cough*
2. Well, you haven't replied to WC's first paragraph yet. I've quoted it for you below so you don't need to scroll through tiresome posts to find it.
 
 
We went in according to the original plan, only, someone failed to follow.

I've never been one to hide my feelings. And since you guys decided to come out and lambast GATO, I thought it was only fair to reply in kind. And my mind, not MK's, I am but a cog in the great MK machine.

You are ridiculous. Are you actually basing your first point on anything, or are you just throwing shit around and hoping something will stick?

As for WarriorConcept's post, I have never heard even a murmur that that was the plan. It has always been acknowledged that this would be a war of attrition. We dug in for the long war, then you guys decide to go over the top and get yourselves slaughtered. Brilliant.

[Tick1]

You're really showing your lack of a basic grasp of war tactics. Our nations cycle in and out to restock nukes, that is common sense in any war. Besides which, you're forgetting about our off-AA nations, like mine. Nice to see that you decided to go for the weak deflection rather than counter anything I said though! Please attempt a defense of your alliance's decision to go full retard.

 

 

I've never been one to hide my feelings. And since you guys decided to come out and lambast GATO, I thought it was only fair to reply in kind. And my mind, not MK's, I am but a cog in the great MK machine.

You are ridiculous. Are you actually basing your first point on anything, or are you just throwing shit around and hoping something will stick?

As for WarriorConcept's post, I have never heard even a murmur that that was the plan. It has always been acknowledged that this would be a war of attrition. We dug in for the long war, then you guys decide to go over the top and get yourselves slaughtered. Brilliant.

 

I heard replying to people makes them see your opinion and validate it as true, maybe you'll prove this theory correct again?

Edited March 26, 2013 by Tick1

[WorldConqueror]

I heard replying to people makes them see your opinion and validate it as true, maybe you'll prove this theory correct again?

Would be a dull place without a bit of back-and-forth, no?

[Tick1]

Would be a dull place without a bit of back-and-forth, no?

What good is back and forth when neither of the two participants have anything of value to contribute to the conversation? If you really want to blame VE for a faulty front go ahead, however I'd direct my efforts in a different location if I were in your position.

[Frederico Rodriguez]

Hey, Freud Squad, it's a thread about GATO's inability to get more than 42% out of PM to fight a war, MagicNinja is the MoD.  fluff. Mystery solved.

 

I like the determination to consistently say the wrong thing and pass it off as 'fact'. Don't let inaccuracies get in the way of a good humour piece. Now you just need the good humour!

[WorldConqueror]

What good is back and forth when neither of the two participants have anything of value to contribute to the conversation? If you really want to blame VE for a faulty front go ahead, however I'd direct my efforts in a different location if I were in your position.

What conversation would that be? The circlejerk over Schatt's latest emission? Sorry for ruining it for you!

Anyway w/e, I've made my point, give VE a pat on the bum for a job well done I guess.

[Tick1]

What conversation would that be? The circlejerk over Schatt's latest emission? Sorry for ruining it for you!Anyway w/e, I've made my point, give VE a pat on the bum for a job well done I guess.

More or less I was talking about the entire conversation between VE members and MK/GATO members which has had nothing insightful brought forth.

[mosfunky]

Considering how well IRON/AI/NPO have staggered, especially after the first few rounds, I don't see how VE could have utilized this PM strategy.  Certainly, we could have kept 40% of our nations in PM from the start, allowing the rest to burn, but cycling in and out of PM would have required a nation not be engaged for at least the five seconds it takes to make the switch, and our opponents have done well to keep us blanketed. 

 

On a related note, kudos to our opponents for always finding nations willing to declare and redeclare, every single day.  We would do the same if some of us could get out of anarchy. :ehm:

[Lurunin]

i will say that some of the VE nations that we fought were quite good fighters with the odds stacked against them. some, but not all, did turtle even with large warchests but that's to be expected when being on the receiving end of a beatdown.

 

if i remember right, they went into the war with a whopping 9 nations in PM. the number that are currently in dove right now were just lucky enough to escape when they could. hell, throughout the war, even those who were in/escaped to PM have come back out for a round or two of wars.they just keep getting swarmed as soon as they stick their heads out and there's nothing anyone can do to change that save adding pressure onto NPO/IRON pretty much. (especially IRON, there's a reason they consistently held the most declared wars during all of this o.O. made us search through targets repeatedly before we could assign anyone those warmongering bastards)

 

VE of all alliances has the right to bitch when GATO, the alliance who didn't put much on the line this war whatso ever other than, *ahem* certain peoples' postings even after their own alliance tells them to stfu, tries to say how they were integral in the decimation of not one, not two, but apparently 4 alliances top tiers. and for what ever reason, are being lauded for their war efforts. 

 

Even if your alliance wasn't receiving that much in terms of nations filling your slots, should you not have redeployed in an effort to take pressure off your own allies' backs? we all know INT needed it for sure for one. just because "we're prepared for the long fight" doesn't necessarily mean that you can utilize what you have. you don't need to hide over 100 of your nations in order to still fight a long war.

 

Again, VE is still fighting back even with 3-5 wars at a time on particular nations. what's your excuse this time?