IYIyTh Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Gibsonator21' timestamp='1357882663' post='3074594'] Suggestion, and one that at least Chax will agree with: Blame everything and anything on SniperJoe. [/quote] Really this should have been the tldr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sardonic Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Joe Stupid' timestamp='1357883302' post='3074603'] Quality post from a quality poster. [/quote] Nah, I'm gonna have to agree with the DT member on this one. [quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1357883683' post='3074610'] Not sure what universe you're in buddy. [/quote] Get out. Seriously. Stop promising to leave and actually do it. [quote name='Robster83' timestamp='1357874366' post='3074424'] For the benefit of everyone bar NEW, who they are supposedly assisting? Yeah because that makes sense. They completely sold out their ally. [img]http://i.imgur.com/Lcl2Yh.png[/img] [img]http://i.imgur.com/GCgyEh.png[/img] [/quote] OOC: Guess somebody couldn't find the text box button in paint... heh Edited January 11, 2013 by Sardonic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibsonator21 Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Sardonic' timestamp='1357884034' post='3074613'] Man, this is some timecube !@#$. OOC: Guess somebody couldn't find the text box button in paint... [/quote] Tbh, I feel like that's fitting, so I'll allow it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodFury Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 Ah, I love hypocrisy from some of the members of alliances voicing their opinions about all of this, I recall certain alliances running and attempting to run as fast as they could during Karma from NPO. Now they are here calling out an alliance that is still willing to do something for their ally, but when your alliances were in this position in the past they tried to get out so they didn't have to do anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Black Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 It saddens me that this was cancelled the way it was, though I'd like to think NPO will be attacking as soon as this grace period expires so in that regard it's completely expected. Today the honor of two of the alliance that made up BFF dies, but I suppose that's to be expected as well given the company they are keeping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernesto Che Guevara Posted January 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1357883683' post='3074610'] Not sure what universe you're in buddy. [/quote] You misunderstand me. Real cowards are lower than dirt. People you declare cowards because your delusional, attention-seeking brain thinks it has a grasp on the situation when in reality you know $%&@ all are not real cowards. From just about anybody else, I would take your post to heart, but coming from you it means nothing more than a gentle breeze in the wind. Your only contribution to this planet is to act as the lowest common denominator, the bottom of the food chain. GOONS trains their new members by letting them fight RUKUNUNUKUKUNUK or whatever his name is. We, the rest of the planet, train our members by teaching them how not to be like you. What I'm trying to say to you, good sir, is that I couldn't give less of a fraction of a !@#$ about you, your opinion, your thoughts or your ideas in this situation. Before you jump up and say "lol why'd you post that then", I want you to realize that while I don't give a $%&@ about you, I do give one about keeping my community free from pollution and the spread of moronic behavior. Consider this my community service for the month. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hereno Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 Oh man, this thread is juicy. I mean, I really don't want to join in on !@#$ting all over BFF because I actually kind of like them, but I wish people on this planet would stop signing treaties at levels higher than they intend to honor. BFF are absolutely right - best case scenario, NEW screwed up and forgot to inform their allies about something really !@#$@#$ important. Worst case scenario, they're straight up using BFF. Thing is, that's the chance you take when you sign MDP+ level treaties - the chance that your allies are going to $%&@ up, do something stupid, and drag your alliance into a massive curb stomp. This trend of "well, it's a mandatory treaty, but if y'all $%&@ up you're on your own" lately is !@#$@#$ stupid. I really and truly get that BFF are totally between a rock and a hard place here, and again I don't mean to jump on the bandwagon, but I really do disagree with what you're doing here. If you sign the treaty, you ought to man up and take your lumps when the time comes. That's just how I feel about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernesto Che Guevara Posted January 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Hereno' timestamp='1357884939' post='3074619'] Oh man, this thread is juicy. I mean, I really don't want to join in on !@#$ting all over BFF because I actually kind of like them, but I wish people on this planet would stop signing treaties at levels higher than they intend to honor. BFF are absolutely right - best case scenario, NEW screwed up and forgot to inform their allies about something really !@#$@#$ important. Worst case scenario, they're straight up using BFF. Thing is, that's the chance you take when you sign MDP+ level treaties - the chance that your allies are going to $%&@ up, do something stupid, and drag your alliance into a massive curb stomp. This trend of "well, it's a mandatory treaty, but if y'all $%&@ up you're on your own" lately is !@#$@#$ stupid. I really and truly get that BFF are totally between a rock and a hard place here, and again I don't mean to jump on the bandwagon, but I really do disagree with what you're doing here. If you sign the treaty, you ought to man up and take your lumps when the time comes. That's just how I feel about it. [/quote] You're right. The wording and level of the treaty did not accurately reflect the current state of affairs. We take the blame for that, because it's our responsibility to adjust our treaties as a relationship changes. In terms of taking the lumps, let me again repeat that should NEW come under attack, the lumps shall be taken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Black Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' timestamp='1357885198' post='3074623'] You're right. The wording and level of the treaty did not accurately reflect the current state of affairs. We take the blame for that, because it's our responsibility to adjust our treaties as a relationship changes. In terms of taking the lumps, let me again repeat that should NEW come under attack, the lumps shall be taken. [/quote] Doesn't count when you've rigged it so you wouldn't have too. Edited January 11, 2013 by Muddog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sniper Joe Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Muddog' timestamp='1357884717' post='3074617'] It saddens me that this was cancelled the way it was, though I'd like to think NPO will be attacking as soon as this grace period expires so in that regard it's completely expected. Today the honor of two of the alliance that made up BFF dies, but I suppose that's to be expected as well given the company they are keeping. [/quote] What a bunch of melodramatic and childish drivel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Black Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Sniper Joe' timestamp='1357885294' post='3074625'] What a bunch of melodramatic and childish drivel. [/quote] Call it what you want, but it doesn't change the fact that it's true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walshington Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 I hereby proclaim this thread over. Crap times and crap situations at crap hours of the day sometimes lead to crap decisions. And here we see one. Question is, do we need to drag anyone over the coals for it? Seems to me only if they are hiding it or pretending it didn't happen. Seems like no one is doing that -- it's all out in the open now, and look: not only has someone taken responsibility, they've also offered a remedy: [quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' timestamp='1357880823' post='3074567'] On a final note, as the senior Ayatollah of BFF, I accept the full blame and responsibility for this fiasco. I never intended for things to get this ugly, but my actions in the last two days, as Don said, were not becoming of an alliance leader or a steadfast ally. In terms of alliance policy, and let me make this abundantly clear, [b]Should NEW find themselves under attack at any point in the next seven days, the entirety of BFF will burn to ZI if that's what it takes. [/b]We declared intent to back our allies, and that's what we intend to do. [/quote] Pretty tough tough to pile on a guy who admits his mistakes without reservations. Kinda makes this whole issue not much of an issue anymore. Even put some stuff in bold print, which almost makes up for the comic sans in the OP. [i]Almost. [/i] Time to pop some popcorn and watch what happens for the next week. Interesting times, people -- interesting times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdnss69 Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Muddog' timestamp='1357885409' post='3074627'] Call it what you want, but it doesn't change the fact that it's true. [/quote] You had an opinion and are now trying to justify it by declaring it to be true in your own frivolous, pretty little head. Yea no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Black Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='mdnss69' timestamp='1357885999' post='3074633'] You had an opinion and are now trying to justify it by declaring it to be true in your own frivolous, pretty little head. Yea no. [/quote] Have we meet? You must be new to BFF, I'm the guy who likes to stir the pot when I can. If you don't already know this, I'm looking for a war and all this does is mean that I won't get to see that sexy DoW from BFF ( I know Chax had one cooking) Edited January 11, 2013 by Muddog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KainIIIC Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Sardonic' timestamp='1357884034' post='3074613'] Nah, I'm gonna have to agree with the DT member on this one. [/quote] It's a terrible idea to be in agreement with shiru on anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardus Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 NEW deserves nothing. BFF: you're all blithering idiots to have (1) signed that treaty in the first place and (2) retained it even after NEW threatened to mass rogue people. That was a prime opportunity to end the relationship and instead you kept on. You've brought the whole thing on yourselves. I'm sure you realized once the aid went out that there wasn't a good way out of this. But damn if I'm not tickled hard watching the President of the Coward Coalition Flagship "IRON" give grief to other people about what the hell honor is. NG wants to shoot their mouths off, well God bless 'em. But you transparent flakes haven't changed a bit, and that just warms my very deepest humors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tehmina Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 Wow. Unexpected! [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUis9yny_lI"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUis9yny_lI[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shahenshah Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' timestamp='1357882203' post='3074590'] If NEW had approached us with a plan to get this war started, we'd have tweaked it, gotten our allies ready, and honestly we'd have supported it. Hell, we might very well have gone it alone with NEW. The thing is, we'll never know that now.[/quote] Well at-least we know of your good intentions. Anyway, thanks for the drama. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taget Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) BFF have nothing to prove. Throughout their history going back to the alliances that make up the bloc that spawned the alliance they have shown their repeated willingness to take a beating to defend their allies. They've handled this with more aplomb, tact, and patience than just about any other alliance in the game would have. And perhaps even should have. Edited January 11, 2013 by Taget Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Buscemi Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='goldielax25' timestamp='1357877492' post='3074504'] They did not offer it to you, [b]it was offered to them[/b]. Stop confusing the two. [/quote] [quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1357877603' post='3074510'] double edit to make this post useful: I apologize for mispeaking earlier, it was not NPO who proposed no nukes but [b]neither was it BFF[/b]. [/quote] It was confirmed to me that Chax offered us the deal, not any outside allies. Any offer would've had to come from NG, NPO, or BFF anyway. Yes, a bunch of ideas where thrown out there, no-nukes being OSRavan's, but Chax was the one to offered us the deal. No one else offered us the deal but BFF/Chax. So I'll say this again: [i]Neither NG or NPO offered the deal. BFF offered us the deal.[/i] I would be critical of [i]any [/i]alliance setting up non-nuke deals to look "honorable". For the record, in the future, if my alliance ever agrees to a non-nuke deal, I'll be very critical and disappointed in them as well. I know that VE wants to ride to it's allies' reputation defense. Kudos for being good allies. But facts remain facts. Edited January 11, 2013 by Steve Buscemi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Chele Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1357886657' post='3074645'] NEW deserves nothing. BFF: you're all blithering idiots to have (1) signed that treaty in the first place and (2) retained it even after NEW threatened to mass rogue people. That was a prime opportunity to end the relationship and instead you kept on. You've brought the whole thing on yourselves. I'm sure you realized once the aid went out that there wasn't a good way out of this. But damn if I'm not tickled hard watching the President of the Coward Coalition Flagship "IRON" give grief to other people about what the hell honor is. NG wants to shoot their mouths off, well God bless 'em. But you transparent flakes haven't changed a bit, and that just warms my very deepest humors. [/quote] Somebody seems to have had a bad day at work... I agree, though, that alliances should not in general sign treaties that include the word "mandatory" since the terms rarely are. I also agree that alliances in general should probably cancel treaties when they become aware that the relationship is no longer something they desire. As far as whether either of these general principles apply here, I'll defer to others, but I certainly don't think any of the comments in this topic rise to the level of being tickled hard... that just seems hyperbolic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vespassianus Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 What's the old saying? Brilliant political move? Sooner FEAR-NEW was one of the few real treaties, sad to see that the spirit of that treaty is gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1357886657' post='3074645'] NEW deserves nothing. BFF: you're all blithering idiots to have (1) signed that treaty in the first place and (2) retained it even after NEW threatened to mass rogue people. That was a prime opportunity to end the relationship and instead you kept on. You've brought the whole thing on yourselves. I'm sure you realized once the aid went out that there wasn't a good way out of this. But damn if I'm not tickled hard watching the President of the Coward Coalition Flagship "IRON" give grief to other people about what the hell honor is. NG wants to shoot their mouths off, well God bless 'em. But you transparent flakes haven't changed a bit, and that just warms my very deepest humors. [/quote] I really looks forward for a day when you're not allied or in the same side with GOONS/VE/Umbrella/ODN/GATO/etc just to see your sincere opinion about them, seriously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthey Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1357886657' post='3074645'] But damn if I'm not tickled hard watching the President of the Coward Coalition Flagship "IRON" give grief to other people about what the hell honor is. NG wants to shoot their mouths off, well God bless 'em. But you transparent flakes haven't changed a bit, and that just warms my very deepest humors. [/quote] The argument follows that BFF's actions are inconsistent with its stated values, or that BFF's actions are inconsistent with an interpretation offered by others; neither position depends on the character of the critic supplying them. I'll leave the immaterial discussion of MCRABT/IRON's record to the more easily distracted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarxistBOZG Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='D34th' timestamp='1357874775' post='3074430'] The International, you now had real challenge for being the worst ally ever. [/quote] Nevermind Godwin, we should have a D34th's Law with INT as the trigger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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