Ernesto Che Guevara Posted January 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 Double post, sorry about this. [quote name='mythicknight' timestamp='1357869847' post='3074332'] Feel free to show where we ever backed down. We've been in communication with NEW since we heard about the situation, and now that they've stopped aiding we're satisfied. If they are still attacked, I fully intend to defend them in whatever way I can, not try and weasel out of an obligation using a feigned offense, nor try to coordinate a farcical short-term defense with the very people that attacked them and then leave NEW to be "demolished" by the world. That clear enough? [/quote] I personally have absolutely no doubt in my mind that TORN would have supported NEW. Despite the mud-slinging in this thread, my years of working with TORN showed them to be anything [i]but [/i]dishonorable. I'd really appreciate it of that talk were erased from people's minds, thanks. Keep in mind, though, that you in TORN do not hold a mutual aggression pact with them. We do. That is the difference. When they committed [u]an act of war[/u] against NSO, they chained us into that war. They did so without consulting us or warning us. Tell me how this is the mark of an honorable ally and I'll concede the argument to you. And please, tell me where it is BFF Gov's responsibility to baby NEW and make sure they get to school safe. And as I said, if somebody wants to test our resolve to honor the mutual defense part of this agreement, they can feel free to try. [quote name='Robster83' timestamp='1357870304' post='3074347'] Where fight means a full on war, without a specific amount of time, non-nuclear and god knows what other clauses you can think of. [/quote] Go ahead, Robster. Bring in Sentinel against NEW. Hell, we won't even bring in any of our allies. We'll make it BFF/NEW vs. Sentinel, just like old times. Tell me, how is your bloc doing these days? Still in shambles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewie Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Sniper Joe' timestamp='1357870290' post='3074345'] You have to wonder what NG's angle is here considering how cordial they were in working with us through this nonsense. It almost seems like people are just trying to score political points here...that couldn't be true, could it? [/quote] We're just butthurt we don't get a war yet Bit of Blue Balls over here! Edited January 11, 2013 by Stewie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Impero Romano Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='MCRABT' timestamp='1357865398' post='3074266'] I'm certain you will regret making this statement before this thread is over and that amuses me greatly. [/quote] It's been a long while since I've had anything but respect for IRON, so don't mistake my meaning, but I think you're getting a little carried away with that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythicknight Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='longnameislonger' timestamp='1357870225' post='3074342'] You'll fight for NEW's unwarranted aggressions? [/quote] As I told Stewie earlier, I would have hated destroying NG with the power of my mind. But I'd have done it. [quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' timestamp='1357870395' post='3074349'] I'll admit how it looks, and it looks that way, Thickness. I can provide Facebook and IRC logs if I have to showing NEW's blatant desire to cause a larger war with this. I'll address that in a moment.[/quote] I know how those things go. My query is always open Edit: Stop double posting Ernesto I'll respond to your second one above this in a bit. Edited January 11, 2013 by mythicknight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longnameislonger Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' timestamp='1357870395' post='3074349']Previous logs were essentially outdated the minute they were spoken.[/quote] This was beautiful to read. We'll be sure to take BFF seriously from now on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porksaber Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) Nicely done BFF; your overlord approves [quote name='Brehon' timestamp='1357860845' post='3074196'] You all at BFF already know my input on this. Rock and hard place, good on you for doing what is best for [i][b]your [/b][/i]alliance o/ [/quote] fixed that for ya buddy! WHA WHA WEEEEEEEEEEE WAA!!!!!! [img]http://media.cinemasquid.com/blu-ray/titles/dr-strangelove/1150/screenshot-med-01.jpg[/img] Edited January 11, 2013 by porksaber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCRABT Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Emperor Marx' timestamp='1357866780' post='3074286'] Coming from the alliance that canceled on TOP because you see them as colluding with an enemy that only thought of you as potential friends, I should eagerly listen to what you have to say about morality? NEW sold out BFF the moment they decided to deliberately expand a war that would have fizzled out on its own with no unnecessary bloodshed and without putting friends at odds with one another by not consulting with BFF before they acted. NEW deliberately tried to exploit their MADP with BFF because they saw it as a means to expand this war into something it should not be. BFF is being incredibly lenient with them on this and that you would come out of the woodwork so blatantly to attack the difficult decision that I know you would never have the balls to make yourself is quite telling on how you view your own allies and treaty obligations. [/quote] BFF inked MADP with NEW knowing they were stupid. NEW decided to act in character and do something stupid. BFF panicked, struck a deal so it didn't take damage for NEW's stupidity. BFF cancels treaty on NEW but pledges to honour treaty anyway. See what doesn't make sense to me is why didn't they just skip step 3 and cancel the treaty citing quite correctly that it was null and void? If you examine the motives of BFF they are for self preservation and to save face. That leads me to conclude that the only reason BFF pledged to honour the treaty is because they struck a deal to leave NEW high and dry while they take next to no damage, so if NEW now react to this cancellation by going ape !@#$ they are covered anyway. To suggest it's because they value the relationship is laughable, I'm sure BFF's leadership would love to see someone destroy them for putting them in this situation. I don't lay claim to morality but I have a good nose and can smell !@#$%^&* a mile off and the honourable BFF is reeking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K1L1O Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1357869860' post='3074333'] I like how people are trying to chew out BFF while they were NEW's only ally committed to actually doing anything for them (despite how retarded NEW is and how no one could fault them for not enabling that crap). [/quote] Oh really we didn't do anything for BFF? Before the merger, it was NEW as shield for those alliances. Never once we intervened their FA, even tough some decisions of them we didn't like, still we kept our dislike hidden. We're keep supporting them no matter what. But that was the past, let's start brighter tomorrow with the glows of nukes. As the initial war started between KasKus-NSO, we're actually wanted to drop all our treaties, but we hold back until last minute to see which are truly friends. Still BFF friends for me personally Good luck for both of us, no need to e-lawyering since it needs to be done. Let's watch what future lies on next few days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Umar ibn Abd al-Aziz Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='porksaber' timestamp='1357870871' post='3074356'] Nicely done BFF; your overload approves fixed that for ya buddy! WHA WHA WEEEEEEEEEEE WAA!!!!!! [img]http://media.cinemasquid.com/blu-ray/titles/dr-strangelove/1150/screenshot-med-01.jpg[/img] [/quote] I !@#$@#$ love you man e: (in a purely hetero platonic way, of course) Edited January 11, 2013 by Umar ibn Abd al-Aziz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groucho Marx Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='longnameislonger' timestamp='1357870853' post='3074355'] This was beautiful to read. We'll be sure to take BFF seriously from now on. [/quote] Such hostility to a party that kept you from potentially being against some of your friends. You really should be more grateful instead of this ridiculous behavior we're seeing from you now. Oh boo-hoo you don't get to fight in a senseless war. Get over it and act like adults for once. Edited January 11, 2013 by Emperor Marx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AirMe Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='K1L1On1Mr4' timestamp='1357870937' post='3074358'] Oh really we didn't do anything for BFF? Before the merger, it was NEW as shield for those alliances. Never once we intervened their FA, even tough some decisions of them we didn't like, still we kept our dislike hidden. We're keep supporting them no matter what. But that was the past, let's start brighter tomorrow with the glows of nukes. As the initial war started between KasKus-NSO, we're actually wanted to drop all our treaties, but we hold back until last minute to see which are truly friends. Still BFF friends for me personally Good luck for both of us, no need to e-lawyering since it needs to be done. Let's watch what future lies on next few days [/quote] This doesn't make sense. You know how politics work. You knew that once you got into a conflict it would be impossible for you to cancel treaties without getting those allies massively screwed over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCRABT Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' timestamp='1357870395' post='3074349'] Now, regarding the allegations thrown in this thread: I'm an honest guy, and I won't hide facts or lie to cover up for myself. Regarding NEW causing a larger war, to be quite frank, we too were hungry for a war. We were sick of waiting for one to happen. If NEW had come to us with a proposal to create an almighty cluster$%&@, there's a very good chance BFF would have happily jumped on board. Unfortunately, they acted without talking to us, playing us like pawns in their game. Breach of treaty is generally regarded as grounds for immediate termination. If you doubt our resolve to honor our agreement, you may feel free to test it. Regarding logs that have been discussed, yes, there were shady dealings. We discussed things such as organized wars, pre-planned strategies, things like that. I won't deny that, and I'm sure you've got more logs than a public bathroom full of me saying things like that. The fact is, Sniper Joe and I have spent the last 48-60 hours working on this situation. Personally, I stayed up and have yet to sleep since I got into the situation early on the 9th. There were many ideas floated regarding how to deal with this, some of them shockingly more stupid than anything I can imagine. However, this is the solution we have now. Previous logs were essentially outdated the minute they were spoken. In the words of many a valley girl, what you know is [i]so [/i]five minutes ago. [/quote] That's cool it would have been easier if you had just said $%&@ NEW they are ridiculous, they $%&@ed us over so we're !@#$@#$ them back, moral claims in CN are terrible. Edited January 11, 2013 by MCRABT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rush Sykes Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 Things I have learned so far in this thread..... 1) The word honor is still the most overused useless word in CN history. Just stop it. 2) mythicknight is so clueless he thinks that there was a snowballs chance in hell that TORN would have hit NPO if NPO had hit NEW (they wouldnt have, and I have logs that show exactly that.) 3) I like Chax more and more. 4) What Scorponok meant when he said "[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]That answers that. Shame to see you leave your ex BFF brothers on their own, though." is "It is a shame you didnt go all out and force C&Gs hand in fighting against NPO and give us our Doomhouse war."[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]5) Berbers and I are in agreement on BFF did the right thing, and that should scare everyone.[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]6) MCRABT's comments make literally 0 sense, and that is a shame, because I think he is generally a pretty decent leader.[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]7) Something....something... something....[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]8) ???????[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]9) Profit?!?!?! [/font][/color] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pingu Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Sniper Joe' timestamp='1357870290' post='3074345'] You have to wonder what NG's angle is here considering how cordial they were in working with us through this nonsense. It almost seems like people are just trying to score political points here...that couldn't be true, could it? [/quote] Hush your foolish talk - remember where you are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewie Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Emperor Marx' timestamp='1357871145' post='3074360'] Such hostility to a party that kept you from potentially being against some of your friends. You really should be more grateful instead of this ridiculous behavior we're seeing from you now. Oh boo-hoo you don't get to fight in a senseless war. Get over it and act like adults for once. [/quote] No, it's a case of 150 million in aid was dumped from a 3rd party to someone engaged in war with one of our MD level allies. For us, this war is not senseless. We are well within our right to declare war on NEW as a case of an aggressive act performed against our ally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IYIyTh Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 Hm. Interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baltus Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Rush Sykes' timestamp='1357871319' post='3074365'] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]7) Something....something... something....[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]8) ???????[/font][/color] [/quote] He's finally reached the point where he's starting to forget. It's a shame really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robster83 Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' timestamp='1357870395' post='3074349'] Please Robster, go home. I know you hate me, I know you hate BFF. Considering UPN's history as one of the biggest jokes in all of CN, you should be careful before you speak up again. Now, regarding the allegations thrown in this thread: I'm an honest guy, and I won't hide facts or lie to cover up for myself. Regarding NEW causing a larger war, to be quite frank, we too were hungry for a war. We were sick of waiting for one to happen. If NEW had come to us with a proposal to create an almighty cluster$%&@, there's a very good chance BFF would have happily jumped on board. Unfortunately, they acted without talking to us, playing us like pawns in their game. Breach of treaty is generally regarded as grounds for immediate termination. If you doubt our resolve to honor our agreement, you may feel free to test it. Regarding logs that have been discussed, yes, there were shady dealings. We discussed things such as organized wars, pre-planned strategies, things like that. I won't deny that, and I'm sure you've got more logs than a public bathroom full of me saying things like that. The fact is, Sniper Joe and I have spent the last 48-60 hours working on this situation. Personally, I stayed up and have yet to sleep since I got into the situation early on the 9th. There were many ideas floated regarding how to deal with this, some of them shockingly more stupid than anything I can imagine. However, this is the solution we have now. Previous logs were essentially outdated the minute they were spoken. In the words of many a valley girl, what you know is [i]so [/i]five minutes ago. [/quote] I don't hate BFF... and as for UPN; hey, at least we are able to cut the crap out and be straightforward. ( I don't think you are in a position to question our loyalty either. ) I am still confused by what you are saying. What was the need to propose the termed war if you felt let down by NEW? Why not just publicly say that you consider the treaty void. As I said, to me it seems like a cheap attempt to save face. It was a !@#$% move. Edited January 11, 2013 by Robster83 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Stewie' timestamp='1357870787' post='3074352'] We're just butthurt we don't get a war yet Bit of Blue Balls over here! [/quote] We both know this turning global was in yours and NPO's hands, so you complaining seems kind of silly. [quote name='MCRABT' timestamp='1357870876' post='3074357'] BFF inked MADP with NEW knowing they were stupid. NEW decided to act in character and do something stupid. BFF panicked, struck a deal so it didn't take damage for NEW's stupidity. BFF cancels treaty on NEW but pledges to honour treaty anyway. See what doesn't make sense to me is why didn't they just skip step 3 and cancel the treaty citing quite correctly that it was null and void? If you examine the motives of BFF they are for self preservation and to save face. That leads me to conclude that the only reason BFF pledged to honour the treaty is because they struck a deal to leave NEW high and dry while they take next to no damage, so if NEW now react to this cancellation by going ape !@#$ they are covered anyway. To suggest it's because they value the relationship is laughable, I'm sure BFF's leadership would love to see someone destroy them for putting them in this situation. I don't lay claim to morality but I have a good nose and can smell !@#$%^&* a mile off and the honourable BFF is reeking. [/quote] Completely contradictory. If it was self-preservation, they would have skipped step 3 as TORN did. They don't need to save face at all here, NEW was obviously retarded and deserved nothing. Committing to taking on a much larger opponent for even a short term is more honorable than most other alliances would have done and more than NEW deserves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldie Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 I'm sure each person here puffing their chest and/or crapping on NEW/BFF for this has found themselves in the situation of being the alliance that ends up putting their ally in a bad place or has had an ally put you in a ridiculous situation that you didn't want to be in (in some alliance's cases having that ally be NEW itself!), and I absolutely feel that many alliances in CN don't have the courage to stare that situation in the face and still be there for their ally like we all know BFF will be. BFF, you know where we stand, and best of luck to you guys cleaning this up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AirMe Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='goldielax25' timestamp='1357871721' post='3074373'] I'm sure each person here puffing their chest and/or crapping on NEW/BFF for this has found themselves in the situation of being the alliance that ends up putting their ally in a bad place or has had an ally put you in a ridiculous situation that you didn't want to be in (in some alliance's cases having that ally be NEW itself!), and I absolutely feel that many alliances in CN don't have the courage to stare that situation in the face and still be there for their ally like we all know BFF will be. BFF, you know where we stand, and best of luck to you guys cleaning this up. [/quote] This. 100% this. We have all been in crap positions before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rush Sykes Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Baltus' timestamp='1357871586' post='3074369'] He's finally reached the point where he's starting to forget. It's a shame really. [/quote] You wound me sir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgoods45 Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 I have no idea whats going on here nor do I really care but good luck to all involved parties and thank you for giving me something to read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewie Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1357871685' post='3074372'] We both know this turning global was in yours and NPO's hands, so you complaining seems kind of silly. [/quote] Yes, this going global is in our hands. And I personally at present see no reason for it to expand out and start causing unnecessary damage to allies on both sides of the conflict who honestly have no desire to burn or be burned fighting over Kaskus. That said NEW has a price to pay. I would have much preferred BFF to have not made this thread because now you are in the position of for the next 7 days NEW can go off and do something completely off the reserve and then BFF will be dragged with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Fingolfin Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 [quote name='Comrade Craig' timestamp='1357866462' post='3074281'] UPN? Is that still an alliance? -Craig [/quote] Is that a question? Also, I'll succinctly sum up my thoughts on this situation by saying $%&@ that noise, watching people's mouths water over the prospect of finally getting to roll the people they want because the resident ignorant island natives in loin cloths couldn't keep their dick in their pants and blew a load all over NSO's face is really quite entertaining, and $%&@ burning for those retards. I'll sleep soundly knowing that the powers that be will pull the classic CN move and back-room smother the !@#$ out of this fire. #ThatsThat!@#$IDon'tLike #!@#$%!@#$%*esJustAttackUsAlready #MissedYouLosers #NotActuallyThough #WhereHaveAllTheOWF!@#$%sGone #SteppingUp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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