Mirreille Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 [quote name='The MVP' timestamp='1297228808' post='2626652'] You dislike TOP? You realized TOP was going to give you victory last war until you stabbed them in the back, with you walking off fairly unscathed, only to now be put to the sword by those you helped ensures victory right?[/quote] I don't know if this is revisionism, you trying to kiss up to TOP, or you simply wearing the thickest rose colored glasses I've ever seen, but even if NpO had not did their turnabout trick and TOP's plan went off without a hitch, that side would probably have still lost the war. You can debate it being fought to a draw if you want, you can say the post war situation would have been better, but TOP & friends were not going to win that war all by themselves. The war would have been more destructive but the end results would have been the same, and the terms would likely have been much harsher as a result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monster Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 [quote name='Mirreille' timestamp='1297373525' post='2628299'] I don't know if this is revisionism, you trying to kiss up to TOP, or you simply wearing the thickest rose colored glasses I've ever seen, but even if NpO had not did their turnabout trick and TOP's plan went off without a hitch, that side would probably have still lost the war. You can debate it being fought to a draw if you want, you can say the post war situation would have been better, but TOP & friends were not going to win that war all by themselves. The war would have been more destructive but the end results would have been the same, and the terms would likely have been much harsher as a result. [/quote] Not really. The side switch turned it into an absolute victory for the other side as opposed to a potentially more pyrrhic victory. You can't demand as much if you can't beat down the opposition as effectively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickenzilla Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 [quote name='Jens of the desert' timestamp='1297362836' post='2628135'] I wouldn't be suprised if you let them go with white peace... [/quote] I'd be pissed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branimir Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 [quote name='Chickenzilla' timestamp='1297374078' post='2628308'] I'd be pissed. [/quote] You will get nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Greenberg Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 (edited) [quote name='The MVP' timestamp='1297228808' post='2626652'] You dislike TOP? You realized TOP was going to give you victory last war until you stabbed them in the back, with you walking off fairly [b]unscathed[/b], only to now be put to the sword by those you helped ensures victory right? How did Crymson lie? Not that Crymson isn't a bare faced liar, but I don't think he'd lie to get his alliance gang banged. That makes no sense. [/quote] I could careless honestly. TOP never cared about us and I will never care about TOP. Also..."unscathed"? We may have not fought a whole bloc, but \m/, PC, FOK, Stickmen(they're a bloc actually...), GOD, Kronos, VE, wF, the Ninjas, Misfit Nations, and TOP isn't exactly a fight that left anyone "unscathed". Edited February 10, 2011 by Ryan Greenberg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The MVP Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Mirreille' timestamp='1297373525' post='2628299'] I don't know if this is revisionism, you trying to kiss up to TOP, or you simply wearing the thickest rose colored glasses I've ever seen, but even if NpO had not did their turnabout trick and TOP's plan went off without a hitch, that side would probably have still lost the war. You can debate it being fought to a draw if you want, you can say the post war situation would have been better, but TOP & friends were not going to win that war all by themselves. The war would have been more destructive but the end results would have been the same, and the terms would likely have been much harsher as a result. [/quote] Even when TOP was alone in its war with the entire coalition crumbling around them, MK nearly capitulated to TOP had TOP not been put under pressure from its allies still in the war to give in. That's the type of situation we're talking about, when a single alliance is taking on an entire coalition and giving them a run for their money. Had they not been betrayed and abandoned? Let's say MK did what it did using Polaris because they didn't want to see it happened. I was there on the front lines, unlike you leading a pitiful alliance that doesn't even get off its chairs doing anything. Let people who fought the wars, and I don't know aren't afraid to fight in wars, tell the story. Go converse with GPA or something. Edited February 10, 2011 by The MVP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monster Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 (edited) Well, there's an obvious trend in terms of how people perceive Polar after that: those that got really beat down like Duckroll/TOP hate Polar, while those that didn't take as much damage were willing to accept them again as the great blue hope they saw at the start of NpO-\m/ and make excuses for why they've forgiven the betrayal. NSO is the exception given they did suffer heavy damage, but didn't pay reps and were one of the biggest movers in trying to reconnect the Orders. Edited February 10, 2011 by Antoine Roquentin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manis B Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 its strange times to see my support for an alliance I swore as an enemy NPO, and be confused by actions of those I swore to die for (o/ LUE). But that being said, my opinion of the NPO these days is one of nostalgia. I hold no hatred, but the respect that we both gave each other a hell of a run. As for polar, after the OoO was canceled I retired and so I didnt keep up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LOLtex Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 [quote name='Ryan Greenberg' timestamp='1297374355' post='2628318'] I could careless honestly. TOP never cared about us and I will never care about TOP. [/quote] I'm sure you've been brainwashed into this opinion, but there was a time where TOP actually did care about the NpO. Several of our members even temporarily joined your alliance to fight for your cause, and an entire coalition was formed to help from that care. We had let bygones be bygones, and it seemed Polar did too. ... It was about that time a knife was plunged into our back by your alliance. You probably won't believe me; your alliance doesn't even recognize today's basic political landscape and continues to keep it's head buried far down in the sand. But that's that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='Chickenzilla' timestamp='1297374078' post='2628308'] I'd be pissed. [/quote] I really would like to see Doom House request reparations after starts a aggressive war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Chocolate Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='Henry' timestamp='1297366939' post='2628191'] This entire statement is preachy and has a side dish of infra hugging. It doesn't take any skill to use selective honesty. Picking your battles doesn't make you a good guy. You don't fight the battles you can't win, which would make you a pragmatist.[/quote] I don't recall saying that I would only fight battles that I could win. Also, one can be ethical and a pragmatist. The pragmatist name I will embrace. Beyond that, it's more of a matter of only fighting battles where I care enough about the reason for the fight to risk losing. Those are few and far between, but they exist (OOC: and provide the most entertainment for me). Also, I define "preachy" as telling others what to do or that they should be this way or that, which I try to avoid. Maybe my comments came off as conceited. Welcome to the OWF [quote name='Henry' timestamp='1297366939' post='2628191']What would you do if someone you disliked asked you if you respected them? Just don't say anything?[/quote] Well, there are people I actually DO respect and also dislike. If someone I did not respect asked if I respected them I'd probably say no. They asked. However, if they never asked, I wouldn't mention it. If someone I disliked asked me if I liked them, I'd probably say something like "I like most people" (which is true). Whether or not I like someone is - well - more my issue than theirs in that it's a matter of preference for certain types of people over others. [quote name='Henry' timestamp='1297366939' post='2628191']I don't really have a problem if you rule that way, but I don't see how that would make you "good." More like a shade of gray [/quote] I picked the name White Chocolate with that idea in mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Stuart Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='D34th' timestamp='1297388729' post='2628607'] I really would like to see Doom House request reparations after starts a aggressive war. [/quote] [sarcasm]They still will not be as evil as NPO[/sarcasm] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonte Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 (edited) We really can't ask for reps after starting an aggressive war. War is fun and our reward is the fight. Let them rebuild in peace and hopefully they can have a swing at us next time. Edit: spelling Edited February 11, 2011 by jonte Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor Noldorin Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='Charles Stuart' timestamp='1297394362' post='2628784'] [sarcasm]They still will not be as evil as NPO[/sarcasm] [/quote] They've yet to make an alliance disband or to make an enemy accept a viceroy. They would need to do these things a few times before people can claim that they have lived up to your past reputation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='Feanor Noldorin' timestamp='1297405632' post='2629042'] They've yet to make an alliance disband or to make an enemy accept a viceroy. They would need to do these things a few times before people can claim that they have lived up to your past reputation. [/quote] Well TOP used to support this kind of behavior so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogeWilliam Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='D34th' timestamp='1297388729' post='2628607'] I really would like to see Doom House request reparations after starts a aggressive war. [/quote] Haha. I think you will get your wish. The winning side can set whatever terms they want if they are willing to keep fighting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heft Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 So long as the Orders remain independent, a sizable contingent of folks will continue to revile and ostracize them. This war and the lead-up to it has demonstrated that quite clearly. There are simply too many people who apparently can't bear the thought that none of the Orders will ever be brought to heel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azaghul Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='Charles Stuart' timestamp='1297394362' post='2628784'] [sarcasm]They still will not be as evil as NPO[/sarcasm] [/quote] NPO used to do it all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoskia Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='NewPoseidon' timestamp='1297370827' post='2628250'] I respect the NpO membership for it's fighting ability. But overall it's membership and gov are downright insulting. Their refusal to admit the obvious makes the game less entertaining. [/quote] We are insulting the VE, thus stating the obvious. FOK are good fighters and iFOK is not bad too (and nice guys actually, most of us have exchanged friendly PMs with them during the war). The VE are pathetic liars who can't even believe their own lies themselves. I do expect to see the hate that the VE feels for Polaris getting highly increased after we defeat the VE in this pathetic war that Impero started. It is an honor to be disliked by such a horrible Alliance like the VE (funny, you're losing the battle against Polaris). I have a perfect viceroy for the VE, a guy that will REALLY destroy you... his name is Impero Romano. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raider Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 NPO: I dislike them and always will. NpO: I'm more neutral toward them, never really disliked them, and respect them to a degree. I even sent Grub a PM wishing them good luck during the noCB War. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fallen Fool Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 I've always loved Polar. As for NPO, well I loved them before I was furious with them and nowadays I have a generally positive opinion about them. [quote name='DictatatorDan' timestamp='1297217058' post='2626391'] [color="#FF0000"]Also, Dajobo would make a better Emperor than Random. He might sanction spying, but he is straightforeward and friendly[/color].[/quote]Random's almost always straightforward and he has the ability to be nice. [quote name='DictatatorDan' timestamp='1297312960' post='2627683'] [color="#FF0000"]The Orders will always be the same. If they get peace, they will once again consort in their little click of alliances that follow them like ducklings, and attempt the same little tricks and expect different results. Hence, I support Perma-War. Either the Orders will disband, or they will change the way they do buisness. If neither happens, we will have a nearly identical war in another year, over stupid reasons, and over the same grudges. That's boring.[/color] [/quote]What I always found amusing about you was the way you attempted to be, or least attempted to appear to be, insightful and intelligent when you never had the ability to do either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potato Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='The MVP' timestamp='1297374730' post='2628324'] Even when TOP was alone in its war with the entire coalition crumbling around them, [b]MK nearly capitulated to TOP[/b] had TOP not been put under pressure from its allies still in the war to give in. That's the type of situation we're talking about, when a single alliance is taking on an entire coalition and giving them a run for their money. Had they not been betrayed and abandoned? Let's say MK did what it did using Polaris because they didn't want to see it happened. I was there on the front lines, unlike you leading a pitiful alliance that doesn't even get off its chairs doing anything. Let people who fought the wars, and I don't know aren't afraid to fight in wars, tell the story. Go converse with GPA or something. [/quote] Where did you get that from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Quebec Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 I'm as open minded to NPO as Dilber and Bilrow were to me. Will be more than one year of quiet survive to change my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor Noldorin Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='D34th' timestamp='1297406487' post='2629053'] Well TOP used to support this kind of behavior so... [/quote] Where have I said anything about TOP? My point is that DH isn't as "bad" or "evil" when compared to the past actions of the NPO. DoomHouse hasn't forced anyone to submit to a viceroy nor have they disbanded any alliances. That is fact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solaris Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='zoskia' timestamp='1297409654' post='2629116'] We are insulting the VE, thus stating the obvious. FOK are good fighters and iFOK is not bad too (and nice guys actually, most of us have exchanged friendly PMs with them during the war). The VE are pathetic liars who can't even believe their own lies themselves. I do expect to see the hate that the VE feels for Polaris getting highly increased after we defeat the VE in this pathetic war that Impero started. It is an honor to be disliked by such a horrible Alliance like the VE (funny, you're losing the battle against Polaris). I have a perfect viceroy for the VE, a guy that will REALLY destroy you... his name is Impero Romano. [/quote] I'm sure your currently displayed narrative is very comforting, considering currently prevailing conditions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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