Griff Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='Biff Webster' timestamp='1289288726' post='2507693'] Maybe "As bad/Not as bad as MK" will now be in fashion. [/quote] They are well on their way at this rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diogenes Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 On a somewhat unrelated note, I hope that this incident does not result in the rescinding of the MK/NSO buddy-cop proposal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delendum Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='Biff Webster' timestamp='1289288726' post='2507693'] Maybe "As bad/Not as bad as MK" will now be in fashion. [/quote] I hope so, I've always wanted to be fashionable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tygaland Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='rsoxbronco1' timestamp='1289288681' post='2507692'] And I saw at least 1 person try to argue that RV isn't in charge of NSO so the deal is invalid... [/quote] Better known as the "TOP Defence". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeroofTime55 Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='TheNeverender' timestamp='1289288250' post='2507674'] This assessment is far more accurate than your previous. [/quote]You're severely mistaken if you think this in any way justifies your actions even a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delendum Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Griff' timestamp='1289288953' post='2507699'] They are well on their way at this rate. [/quote] Choo-choo! [quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1289289096' post='2507703'] You're severely mistaken if you think this in any way justifies your actions even a little. [/quote] ...and I told Archon that Ivan wasn't trying to justify our actions, but he wouldn't listen Edited November 9, 2010 by delendum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judge X Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 I just read the announcement. too many pages for my ADHD to handle. But on that note it is very shiny. You know you can shine a turd up real nice, but that's all its ever gonna be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tygaland Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='Yevgeni Luchenkov' timestamp='1289288840' post='2507695'] Yeah, except that instead of disbandment, PZI, EZI, viceroys, permanent tech farms or absurd reparations, we're speaking of 15m that they never even bothered trying to negotiate down to begin with. [/quote] Yeah, Shode! They only extorted a little bit of cash and tech, what's your problem? The vanguard of the Karma era got caught with their hands in the till, sure, but they confessed and kept the cash so it's all good. Stop complaining, seriously! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sal Paradise Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 (edited) [quote name='delendum' timestamp='1289288893' post='2507697'] You usually tend to get level headed and rational responses by being level headed and rational yourself, unless you're trying to imply RV's thread was level-headed and rational to begin with. [/quote] This is not a relevant response to my post. I am not discussing the level-headedness of RV. I am discussing the level-headedness of Archon. If you can't respond to me without cliches or totally missing the point, don't bother responding at all. You have struck me so far as the least capable MK poster in this thread, and you've bored me well enough. Edited November 9, 2010 by Sal Paradise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1289288533' post='2507688'] For sure, each of those people lost about 10 million in back collects.... 50mil lost to gain 15mil+250 tech, definitely not very profitable. It's kind of you to think about the real victims in this story, which everyone else seems to be ignoring in favor of the politics. [/quote] The funny thing is that you still think that NSO is the responsible for the nation delete the trade. [quote name='delendum' timestamp='1289288619' post='2507690'] Does that mean that it was profitable 15 million and 250 tech for NSO? And if that's the case, why are people crying about it? [/quote] I'm sure you already heard about win-win situations, well this is one of them: If NSO pays the extortion you look bad if they don't pay the extortion you still look bad and plus that you look weak for the backpedal. Also let me use the Archon words to explain to you why people are "crying" about it: [quote name='TheNeverender' timestamp='1289283280' post='2507403'] I will rather openly admit that the Kingdom erred. We demanded a sum of 15 million and 250 tech (a package of 3 million and 50 tech to each affected nation). It was simply a rather high sum. In fact, I would say it was too high. Perhaps the negotiators expected the Sith to actually negotiate. I believe that expectation has been voiced. That does not defend it. Of course, I am still just recounting events that occurred. And passing my own judgment, as King of the Mushroom Kingdom. The number asked was too high.[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yevgeni Luchenkov Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='Tygaland' timestamp='1289289349' post='2507709'] Yeah, Shode! They only extorted a little bit of cash and tech, what's your problem? The vanguard of the Karma era got caught with their hands in the till, sure, but they confessed and kept the cash so it's all good. Stop complaining, seriously! [/quote] Be my guests if you want to complain because we asked for token reparations but don't use ridiculous hyperbole and compare it to an era of disbandments, viceroys and what not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yevgeni Luchenkov Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 (edited) Edit: Apologies for double post, mods please delete. Edited November 9, 2010 by Yevgeni Luchenkov Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthey Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 (edited) Oh MK, what would you all do without Archon's sweet prose to pull you out of the sling. Edited November 9, 2010 by iamthey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WorldConqueror Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='Shodemofi' timestamp='1289288613' post='2507689'] Archon repeating what was said in the other thread doesn't make MK's extortion any more acceptable. Not to totally NPO-Godwin this thread, but this is the "they agreed to it" logic is the same thing that they used to force alliances to disband. [/quote] Not wanting to derail so I'll just address this quickly and leave it. You really can't force someone to disband. You can push for disbandment in a war, but you can't actually physically make them disband. And you can certainly make disbandment look like the preferable option, but that's not forcing. Probably more semantic than anything, it is an important distinction though. And disbandment doesn't require the opposing government's consent, so your example that we got small alliances to agree to terms and then justified those terms by saying 'they accepted it', would imply that those terms handed down were not disbandment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacapo Saladin Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Yevgeni Luchenkov' timestamp='1289288840' post='2507695'] Yeah, except that instead of disbandment, PZI, EZI, viceroys, permanent tech farms or absurd reparations, we're speaking of 15m that they never even bothered trying to negotiate down to begin with. [/quote] insane demands are still insane, unless you planned to only [i]slightly[/i] attack them Edited November 9, 2010 by Jacapo Saladin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seerow Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote]The funny thing is that you still think that NSO is the responsible for the nation delete the trade. [/quote] Where in my post did I imply at all that NSO was responsible for anything? I was applauding you for recognizing our members losses, and just how unprofitable the settlement ultimately was for them. Doesn't matter where the money came from, it was still a very unprofitable endeavor for them, and I appreciate your recognition of that fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 Was the deal inflated? Yes. Was it stupid? Yes. But whatever it was, you can't accept it then go back on your word. If you say something, stand by that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tygaland Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='Yevgeni Luchenkov' timestamp='1289289538' post='2507717'] Be my guests if you want to complain because we asked for token reparations but don't use ridiculous hyperbole and compare it to an era of disbandments, viceroys and what not. [/quote] I remember attempts to extort me by the NPO and their cronies back in the day and this is not dissimilar at all. Just because you haven't gone full moo yet does mean the comparison is invalid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldr Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1289288533' post='2507688'] For sure, each of those people lost about 10 million in back collects.... 50mil lost to gain 15mil+250 tech, definitely not very profitable. It's kind of you to think about the real victims in this story, which everyone else seems to be ignoring in favor of the politics. [/quote] They only "lost" that much money if they collected without bothering to get anything in their open trade slots. #temptrade would easily fix that. An alliance the size of MK should be able to work out a few temp trades. NSO didn't take that money from them, regardless, and made it clear they would not be defending the nation which accepted the $3M and then left the trade circle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biff Webster Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1289289654' post='2507722'] Where in my post did I imply at all that NSO was responsible for anything? I was applauding you for recognizing our members losses, and just how unprofitable the settlement ultimately was for them. Doesn't matter where the money came from, it was still a very unprofitable endeavor for them, and I appreciate your recognition of that fact. [/quote] You should probably get a new trades guy, he sure let you down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsoxbronco1 Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='iamthey' timestamp='1289289587' post='2507719'] Oh MK, what would you all do without Archon to pull you out of the sling. [/quote] Re-sign the Sectumsempra Treaty. or turn red into a glass parking lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delendum Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='JudgeX' timestamp='1289289263' post='2507707'] I just read the announcement. too many pages for my ADHD to handle. But on that note it is very shiny. You know you can shine a turd up real nice, but that's all its ever gonna be. [/quote] Why did you have to spoil the poor turd's dreams like that. [quote name='Sal Paradise' timestamp='1289289413' post='2507713'] This is not a relevant response to my post. I am not discussing the level-headedness of RV. I am discussing the level-headedness of Archon. If you can't respond to me without cliches or totally missing the point, don't bother responding at all. You have struck me so far as the least capable MK poster in this thread, and you've bored me well enough. [/quote] So what you're saying is that context is irrelevant and we should keep the discussion strictly to our impression of Archon, right? I'm not responding for your sake, I'm responding for mine and several other gentlemans entertainment. It depends how you view competence I guess. While I fail to entertain you, I'm doing pretty well entertaining many others with my replies to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londo Mollari Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='rsoxbronco1' timestamp='1289288681' post='2507692'] I'm not sure if it's worse: RV planned dropping logs or Epiphanus and Yev not expecting RV to drop logs And I saw at least 1 person try to argue that RV isn't in charge of NSO so the deal is invalid...if that's the case then he shouldn't have gone into #mushroom looking for gov or should have declared himself to be an emissary with no formal power when negotiations started. Regardless of the crappy diplomacy, a deal is a deal. brb, raiding KoN do deflect attention from MK. [/quote] Psh. Do something original. Besides, raiding Knights of Ni! now would be in direct contravention of our tech raid policies and I will not permit it. *cough* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delendum Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='iamthey' timestamp='1289289587' post='2507719'] Oh MK, what would you all do without Archon's sweet prose to pull you out of the sling. [/quote] We would likely be left with nothing of value to read in this place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 [quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1289289654' post='2507722'] Where in my post did I imply at all that NSO was responsible for anything? I was applauding you for recognizing our members losses, and just how unprofitable the settlement ultimately was for them. Doesn't matter where the money came from, it was still a very unprofitable endeavor for them, and I appreciate your recognition of that fact. [/quote] I assumed since you are a MK member and MK held NSO responsible for the trade canceled, so you don't think NSO wasn't responsible? Yeah I recognize that the amount of bad PR that MK got from this incident is much worse than the losses your members suffered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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