NPO Annoucement: 2nd Triannual Report of the 6th Year of Order

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='TrotskysRevenge' date='04 May 2010 - 02:04 AM' timestamp='1272953025' post='2286166']
I'm not going to lie[/quote]

Usually the first thing a liar says. Please continue.

[quote]; it has been tough. It isn't easy to stay motivated for an entire year when forced to essentially stay on the sidelines. There is only so much activity one can manufacture at home. [/quote]

I hope you at least had the decency to blush while typing that, considering what you [i]personally[/i] did to FAN.

[quote]But this past year has been a testament not just to the Order as an alliance, but to every single member.[/quote]

You're right. Despite assurances (from you, I should add) of great changes in the way the NPO would conduct itself, there has been no demonstrable change whatsoever. Not only has the NPO not paid for its many crimes, your alliance has displayed zero interest with respect to coming to terms with your appalling past.

The NPO is the same group of double-talkers it was a year ago. All you've done is played musical chairs and said, "Hey, we're different!"

[quote]neither your members nor I couldn't ask for a better or more honorable community of which to be a part. You are the best in the cyberverse. o/[/quote]

Does your definition of honor include hanging numerous allies out to dry? Inventing reasons for war against an alliance nearly out of terms? Compelling alliances to disband? Using the threat of PZI/EZI to drive people from the face of Planet Bob? All of these things (and much more) occurred under your leadership.

Were these the actions of an honorable leader of an honorable alliance?

And yes, that's a real question.

[quote]EDIT: I am not whining, just in case [/quote]

Nope, you're just displaying the kind of intentionally-obtuse hypocrisy that was and remains the hallmark of the New Pacific Order; the same attitude that had people lining up to cheer while you were beaten down.

Sometimes even the brightest students need to repeat a year. Don't be surprised when it happens to you.

[Starfox101]

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='04 May 2010 - 12:28 PM' timestamp='1272972485' post='2286296']
I don't think it's really a matter of some dispute. It's a conspiracy theory for which I have seen no evidence. Even if you accept the fact that C&G and SuperFriends were out to get TOP from the start, that plan would hinge on TOP employing a preemptive attack, and nobody could have predicted such a harebrained attempt.



So you're saying that when you committed these crimes, it was simply how things were at the time. You state that we have changed nothing. And yet these things are no longer the standard?

Oh, one other very important point I forgot last night:
[list]
[*]Suppression of debate. Look at us here, in this thread. Me, a government member of the SuperFriends, and all of you, the membership of the New Pacific Order, the downtrodden enemy under surrender terms. We are having a (mostly) civil argument, other than a few random insults you guys are throwing out. This would never ever have happened during the Pacifican Hegemony. Dissenters that didn't have Continuum to back them up (mainly looking at Gremlins here) were isolated and PZIed, or simply silenced by fear. Like it or not there is way more debate nowadays than under your reign, and that is probably the most important thing of all.
[/list]
[/quote]
To support this statement, I was once put on the NPO PZI List for getting into a verbal spat with Josef Thorne, that concluded with me saying "Don't trust the NPO."

Sorry King Penchuck, it's time for PZI!

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='Starfox101' date='04 May 2010 - 10:49 AM' timestamp='1272984552' post='2286377']
To support this statement, I was once put on the NPO PZI List for getting into a verbal spat with Josef Thorne, that concluded with me saying "Don't trust the NPO."

Sorry King Penchuck, it's time for PZI!
[/quote]
We really need to start an "NPO ex-PZI/EZI Club". Hmmm....perhaps with a less-unwieldy name.

Ignoring for a moment the fact that it would bring together some of the best people on Planet Bob, I kinda miss talking to some of you.

*sniff*

[Letum]

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' date='04 May 2010 - 03:36 PM' timestamp='1272983784' post='2286375']
Not only has the NPO not paid for its many crimes
[/quote]

Well, since one year is just a slap on the wrist, why don't you try again, and go for 2 this time?

[The AUT]

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' date='04 May 2010 - 04:03 PM' timestamp='1272985377' post='2286389']
We really need to start an "NPO ex-PZI/EZI Club". Hmmm....perhaps with a less-unwieldy name.

Ignoring for a moment the fact that it would bring together some of the best people on Planet Bob, I kinda miss talking to some of you.

*sniff*
[/quote]

I was on it, let's not do what they did.

[quote]I will never trust the NPO. Nor should anyone else. [/quote]

I said the same thing of Polaris.

Edited May 4, 2010 by The AUT

[Proxian Empire]

[quote name='The AUT' date='04 May 2010 - 04:09 PM' timestamp='1272985733' post='2286394']
I said the same thing of Polaris.
[/quote]
Yes, but you are also a traitorous clown.

[NationRuler]

[quote name='Rebel Virginia' date='04 May 2010 - 01:20 AM' timestamp='1272954021' post='2286183']
[color="#0000FF"]There are too many alliances these days anyway. Quite frankly we could do with less. Mainly the ones with no flash or style. Alliances like your own, for example.[/color]
[/quote]

Oh hey, thanks Rebel Virginia.

You know, you're currently residing in an alliance that is one of CSNs greatest allies. RIA has stood by CSN for almost 4 years. RIA, CSN, and TTK were ONOS's greatest allies. I find it pretty disturbing that you would talk about these alliances in such a way if you are truly a RIer now. (and for people who are going to say "why didn't GUARD help ONOS?"...ONOS told them not to help. ONOS told them not to help. ONOS told them not to help. ONOS told them not to help. Did you get that?)

Anyway, to skip a bunch of useless angry typing, I hope you leave soon so we're on opposite sides of the next war. I can't imagine the idea of fighting on your behalf.

And CSN, no flash or style? Classiest alliance 2008 was it? I can't remember. I suppose it's difficult to formulate an opinion of an alliance when you're kickbanned from all of our channels. Edit: View sig for lols

Edited May 4, 2010 by NationRuler

[The AUT]

[quote name='King Penchuk' date='04 May 2010 - 04:23 PM' timestamp='1272986615' post='2286405']
Yes, but you are also a traitorous clown.
[/quote]

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAMmUhHeT1I"]Yes, I know how you feel about clowns.[/url]

I also know you're a two-faced "friend" but I understand you take after your alliance. I guess we can agree not to trust each other.

As for me, Pacifica is far more trustworthy than Polaris. Easily.

[TrotskysRevenge]

[quote name='King Penchuk' date='04 May 2010 - 07:16 AM' timestamp='1272982597' post='2286366']
I will never trust the NPO. Nor should anyone else.
[/quote]


That certainly opens the door to closer relations. Thanks for saving us the trouble.

[Proxian Empire]

[quote name='TrotskysRevenge' date='04 May 2010 - 04:29 PM' timestamp='1272986971' post='2286412']


That certainly opens the door to closer relations. Thanks for saving us the trouble.
[/quote]
You are most welcome.

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='Letum' date='04 May 2010 - 11:07 AM' timestamp='1272985660' post='2286393']
Well, since one year is just a slap on the wrist, why don't you try again, and go for 2 this time?
[/quote]

Sadly, apart from my run-in with Mary the Ridiculous -- which very nearly brought yet another group of alliances into the war against you -- I had no role in the Karma War beyond that of chortling spectator.

But please, the next time you're getting your face rubbed in a mess that you have created, attack another Nordreich member and I'll do my very best to make all your dreams come true.

[TrotskysRevenge]

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' date='04 May 2010 - 07:36 AM' timestamp='1272983784' post='2286375']
You're right. Despite assurances (from you, I should add) of great changes in the way the NPO would conduct itself, there has been no demonstrable change whatsoever. Not only has the NPO not paid for its many crimes, your alliance has displayed zero interest with respect to coming to terms with your appalling past.

The NPO is the same group of double-talkers it was a year ago. All you've done is played musical chairs and said, "Hey, we're different!"[/quote]

It is rather difficult to demonstrate true change while not being part of the cyberverse. There have been many changes, both in personnel and in policy. The time to demonstrate that is when the terms are over. I don't expect you, Kingzog, ever to acknowledge anything that goes against your hate-driven view of the NPO, so I won't hold my breath for any acknowledgment any time soon.

And not paid for our crimes? While I might argue that many of these crimes were also committed by some of those who determined our terms, the time for that has passed. However, I remember it being said over and over that our terms were not draconian, but rather in keeping with the nature of our offenses against Planet Bob, that our reparations were punishment for our crimes. And, as Letum pointed out, a year under terms is quite a price to pay.

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='TrotskysRevenge' date='04 May 2010 - 11:29 AM' timestamp='1272986971' post='2286412']
That certainly opens the door to closer relations. Thanks for saving us the trouble.
[/quote]

....says the guy who slammed the door in the first place.

You're on a roll today.

[quote name='TrotskysRevenge' date='04 May 2010 - 11:41 AM' timestamp='1272987655' post='2286422']
It is rather difficult to demonstrate true change while not being part of the cyberverse. There have been many changes, both in personnel and in policy. The time to demonstrate that is when the terms are over. I don't expect you, Kingzog, ever to acknowledge anything that goes against your hate-driven view of the NPO, so I won't hold my breath for any acknowledgment any time soon.[/quote]

The day the New Pacific Order demonstrates genuine change, I will be among the first to congratulate you for it.

That's a promise, and I trust you will hold me to it.

As to my 'hate-driven view', you could not be more wrong. The day I turned against the NPO was the day Dilber explained to me in great detail how he had been working to undermine Polaris for [b]months[/b], all while you, he and others sang a very different tune in public.

Edited May 4, 2010 by Ashoka the Great

[TrotskysRevenge]

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' date='04 May 2010 - 08:43 AM' timestamp='1272987771' post='2286424']
....says the guy who slammed the door in the first place.

You're on a roll today.
[/quote]


Actually, you are.

It's not like Polar's actions in the months preceding didn't cause it to happen. Oh wait. Nothing is ever anyone's fault other than the NPO. Excuse me if I haven't gotten your mantra down.

[Bob Janova]

No-one should trust either Order considering their respective history, but Pacific is the better of the two I would say. It does not often betray its allies and it has never pulled out of a war it started to leave its coalition partners to be rolled.

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='TrotskysRevenge' date='04 May 2010 - 11:50 AM' timestamp='1272988211' post='2286426']Actually, you are.[/quote]

I was just "NoU'd" by the Imperator Emeritus of the New Pacific Order. I can now die in peace, my mission complete.

[Letum]

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' date='04 May 2010 - 04:43 PM' timestamp='1272987771' post='2286424']
The day the New Pacific Order demonstrates genuine change, I will be among the first to congratulate you for it.

That's a promise, and I trust you will hold me to it.
[/quote]

You didn't specify which direction the change should be in

[kerschbs]

[quote name='Branimir' date='04 May 2010 - 12:54 AM' timestamp='1272948822' post='2286098']


No, its also about time. You can send as much as you can at one point. So if the sum is astronomical enough, you can take out alliances for a year out of it.

I do not care what you think, am not to change your opinion I have a good grip on what that is, I just stated all this to the objective viewer.

Night all.
[/quote]

Ok sorry, I had to interject here. You want to talk about time? How about the year you put GATO under a viceroy. From the start of GATO-1v to the end of the viceroy was almost two years worth of time for our alliance. You think that affected our growth and development much?

[Letum]

[quote name='kerschbs' date='04 May 2010 - 05:20 PM' timestamp='1272990024' post='2286454']
You think that affected our growth and development much?
[/quote]

Was the highlight of your CN life logging in every 10 days to send out 300 tech during that time?

[Branimir]

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' date='04 May 2010 - 05:43 PM' timestamp='1272987771' post='2286424']
The day the New Pacific Order demonstrates genuine change, I will be among the first to congratulate you for it.

That's a promise, and I trust you will hold me to it.[/quote]

For that, one must show a level of open mind, which you didn't show in regards to us.
Nobody is holding our breath to ever change your attitude towards us. Nobody cares, haters gonna hate and your little alliance is of no relevance anyway.

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' date='04 May 2010 - 05:43 PM' timestamp='1272987771' post='2286424']As to my 'hate-driven view', you could not be more wrong.[/quote]

No, its backed by now more then a year of hate speech you have directed towards us, as also by atrocities aimed at us, as in example: forcing NPO nations into deletion by sanctioning +18 days inactive ones.

This debate can only be fruitless. Maybe we should not wonder too much off the topic subject.

Edited May 4, 2010 by Branimir

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='Letum' date='04 May 2010 - 12:18 PM' timestamp='1272989871' post='2286452']
You didn't specify which direction the change should be in
[/quote]
I'll make you a deal.

If the change is positive, I will not only applaud you publicly but will insist that I am assigned as NoR's Ambassador over there. That will serve as [i]my[/i] punishment for having doubted your sincerity.

If the change is negative I can still applaud it, albeit for a very different reason. (I call it 'schadenfreude in advance'.)

[quote name='Branimir' date='04 May 2010 - 12:24 PM' timestamp='1272990257' post='2286458']
No, its backed by now more then a year of hate speech you have directed towards us, as also by atrocities aimed at us, as in example: forcing NPO nations into deletion by sanctioning +18 days inactive ones.[/quote]

I forgot how I'd personally visited all of those people and removed their hands.

You're right. I'm a monster.

And, just to be clear, I did not fire the first shot in the sanction war.

Edited May 4, 2010 by Ashoka the Great

[Branimir]

[quote name='kerschbs' date='04 May 2010 - 06:20 PM' timestamp='1272990024' post='2286454']
Ok sorry, I had to interject here. You want to talk about time? How about the year you put GATO under a viceroy. From the start of GATO-1v to the end of the viceroy was almost two years worth of time for our alliance. You think that affected our growth and development much?
[/quote]
There was a statement from our Emperor at the time, of our apology for this act and recognition of our error.
You can take it as genuine or not, but it is there.

My point though was, that the self proclaimed "changers of standards" didn't change a thing. Was just a propaganda jingle from their side.

Though I firmly stand that it was not from ours. After our apology and recognition of error there, I do not expect us ever issuing terms that would be put over alliances for such a long period of time.

Time shall set the record on that, I suppose.

Edited May 4, 2010 by Branimir

[jimbacher]

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' date='04 May 2010 - 12:11 PM' timestamp='1272989460' post='2286446']
I was just "NoU'd" by the Imperator Emeritus of the New Pacific Order. I can now die in peace, my mission complete.
[/quote]

Heil, Well then at least I can one up you by getting kick-banned by Moo (and let us not forget mary <3). I personally hope to see some tech from NPO. I heard there former allies are entitled to some of the interest generated by the K.A.R.M.A. war bonds.

[Ashok]

[quote]I'll make you a deal.

If the change is positive, I will not only applaud you publicly but will insist that I am assigned as NoR's Ambassador over there. That will serve as my punishment for having doubted your sincerity.

If the change is negative I can still applaud it, albeit for a very different reason. (I call it 'schadenfreude in advance'.)[/quote]

What is positive in your mind and negative? Those are very subjective words

[Lord Brendan]

[quote name='applesauce59' date='04 May 2010 - 08:12 AM' timestamp='1272975115' post='2286309']
To be honest i think that's because we were just plain stronger than you. We didn't hold sanction alliances under reps we beat them down much further. I actual believe its the same reason you guys have not done cuberstoppings, your base of power is to weak for it. The Athens situation with the tech raid is a good example of a failed attempt.
[/quote]

No it isn't. The tech raid on KoNi was never meant to be damaging; it was, after all, a tech raid. Even if there had been no outcry (speaking of which, you all realize that Penkala was the whistleblower, right? If not for him the raid might have gona unnoticed), it would almost certainly have ended after a single round of war.

Not sure what you're trying to prove by saying that you beat down sanctioned alliances. Aren't you supposed to be arguing [i]against[/i] me?

I think the core of the Hegemony had a similar amount of strength as SF, C&G and LEO do today. Power is surely less concentrated, but I think our ability to start wars of aggression is quite comparable. There are less sheep today than there were then as well, another upside.

[quote name='Haflinger' date='04 May 2010 - 09:12 AM' timestamp='1272978725' post='2286333']
This thread isn't the appropriate place for this argument, there are plenty other threads where it's on topic. However, Archon has mentioned that the attack was leaked to him.
[/quote]

Oh, I'm willing to give [i]that[/i] theory the benefit of the doubt. Taking advantage of a blunder by your opponents is nowhere close to being the same thing as plotting the war in order to set up the blunder.

[quote name='Branimir' date='04 May 2010 - 09:17 AM' timestamp='1272979025' post='2286336']
2, 3 or even 4 years ago, things were different and everybody acted as such. Not just NPO. What was "crime" or not, was subject to different definition. For example, before spying was a CB universally accepted, now-- not so much.

Debates before were far more lively and fun then now. Your are stretching it thin.

We didn't held "shark weeks", go talk to neutral shoving, or mpol for his famous "one more post and I will dow you". I suppose both of those, are NPO's fault, right?

Good day.
[/quote]

"Everybody did it" is no excuse. My alliance is nearly 4 years old itself, and we have never committed such things. Your alliance is one that has set the standards for many things on this planet, you have nobody to blame but yourselves for the actions you took when you were on top.

Are you [b]actually[/b] suggesting that debates were more lively during the Pacifican Hegemony? Really? Honestly? "Debates" in that era consisted of "o/ o/ o/ NPO" for a few pages, then one guy saying "I disagree because:..." and then one of your attack dogs like The Big Bad would throw in a "Shut up or we'll PZI you". And then either the dissenter would shut up and we'd get back to the scheduled hails, or he would keep talking and get put on a PZI list.

I'm not sure what GOONS or FAN have to do with anything. The period I'm talking about is from the formation of Continuum until the War of the Coalition, the time when Pacifica's dominance was absolute. During that time, debate was infinetely worse than it is now.

As for the earlier assertion that life under SuperGrievances is more boring, I'm not sure I agree but even if it were true, that's not what we're discussing. The argument is about which was more aggressive, more vengeful, more cruel, more draconian. And the Pacificsn Hegemony is unrivalled in those respects.