A Joint Announcement from the Mushroom Kingdom and the Viridian Entente

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Rush Sykes' timestamp='1320622328' post='2840676']
Point 1. Yes you advocated that it be a short 2 week war. You know what the problem with that was? NPO allies counter. Our allies counter their counter. There is absolutely, and you KNOW it, no way to enforce that a war on THAT massive of a front would just "end in 2 weeks." And there is absolutely ZERO chance that we could have enforced so many wars to end on a "schedule." Hence what YOU wanted to do, would have achieved nearly the exact same thing that DH achieved. A long drawn out war with NPO and allies.
[/quote]
The DH - NPO War didn't drag on for months because NPO's allies countered. It dragged on for months because Doom House demanded 5 billion dollars and tens of thousands of tech in reparations, forced member exchanges, public humiliation, and apologies for statements of fact made on the OWF from defensive parties in an aggressive war with no justification. If you can prove that Londo's war on Francoism plans included extortion afterwards then you can keep trumpeting it as a thought crime on Londo's part while the rest of us continue to understand the gulf between thinking and doing to begin with.

Edited November 7, 2011 by Schattenmann

[Rush Sykes]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1320624086' post='2840702']
The DH - NPO War didn't drag on for months because NPO's allies countered. It dragged on for months because Doom House demanded 5 billion dollars and tens of thousands of tech in reparations, forced member exchanges, public humiliation, and apologies for statements of fact made on the OWF from defensive parties in an aggressive war with no justification. If you can prove that Londo's war on Francoism plans included extortion afterwards then you can keep trumpeting it as a thought crime on Londo's part while the rest of us continue to understand the gulf between thinking and doing to begin with.
[/quote]

It dragged on for months, because for months, MOST of them didnt bother to fight. Lets at least be honest about facts. The peace mode strategy had much more to do with dragging it out, than any demand for reps. Its a chicken or egg argument. The reps were asked for because high nations spent the war in PM, low nations dogpiled on GOONS. Had the large nations fought early, the need for reps would not have been what they were. The initial discussion was to end the war with no terms.

[Rush Sykes]

[quote name='Londo Mollari' timestamp='1320623754' post='2840698']
I seem to recall the OWF mostly cheering when Thriller attacked AcTi. If you don't see the difference between an aggressive smacking around of people you dislike (and then often making up with them later) and a widespread pattern of convoluted thread elimination like what NPO practiced, then you are being rather insensitive to even the most obvious of distinctions in my opinion. However, having known you for a long time, I am sure that what I perceive as deliberate intransigence for political reasons is in fact a genuine misunderstanding on your part.
[/quote]

So you equate a threat of an aggressive smacking around of people that people dont like (NSO and Legion), as worse than an actual smacking around of people you dont like. Makes sense to me. As for being cheered for something on the OWF, if that is your idea of what makes something popular and right, you have a short memory. Most of old NPOs reasonless smack downs on others, we roundly hailed and portrayed as great and honorable by far more of the OWF than opposed them. That is literally the worst measure of right or wrong, good or bad, you can put forward.

[WarriorConcept]

Clearly this didn't work and we rolled Legion and NSO didn't accept peace to let it happen etc etc etc.


What happened to all the conspiracy theorists?

[Gibsonator21]

[quote name='Rush Sykes' timestamp='1320624363' post='2840704']
It dragged on for months, because for months, MOST of them didnt bother to fight. Lets at least be honest about facts. The peace mode strategy had much more to do with dragging it out, than any demand for reps. Its a chicken or egg argument. The reps were asked for because high nations spent the war in PM, low nations dogpiled on GOONS. Had the large nations fought early, the need for reps would not have been what they were. The initial discussion was to end the war with no terms.
[/quote]
GOONS claims to take reps from any alliance that attacks them. So for them, the PM strategy had nothing to do with it.

[Master Hakai]

[quote name='Emperor Whimsical' timestamp='1320623844' post='2840700']
Jeez, did you reroll?
[/quote]

Yeah I guess so, pretty bored already but we'll see how long it lasts. I'm all for VE and MK attacking right NOW

[Londo Mollari]

[quote name='Rush Sykes' timestamp='1320624387' post='2840705']
So you equate a threat of an aggressive smacking around of people that people dont like (NSO and Legion), as worse than an actual smacking around of people you dont like. Makes sense to me. As for being cheered for something on the OWF, if that is your idea of what makes something popular and right, you have a short memory. Most of old NPOs reasonless smack downs on others, we roundly hailed and portrayed as great and honorable by far more of the OWF than opposed them. That is literally the worst measure of right or wrong, good or bad, you can put forward.
[/quote]

Because clearly, my fanciful whims cause just as much fear as the combined might of the Continuum in the OWF population, and they adjust their posts accordingly.

[flak attack]

[quote name='Dochartaigh' timestamp='1320620831' post='2840653']
You missed the thread where Legion and NSO/Tetris peaced out thus ensuring MK's/VE's blueballs explode.
[/quote]
You missed the part where the point of the threat was to end the war.

[mrwuss]

[quote name='Gibsonator21' timestamp='1320627075' post='2840731']
GOONS claims to take reps from any alliance that attacks them. So for them, the PM strategy had nothing to do with it.
[/quote]

so for the alliance that was dog piled by the awful tacticians
the PM statehy didn't matter, but fir everyone else it did.

If people had fought instead of whatever it is that they did instead, the reps GOONS demanded would have been much lower

[Seerow]

[quote name='flak attack' timestamp='1320633901' post='2840811']
You missed the part where the point of the threat was to end the war.
[/quote]

Well that and/or get Drai back. Really, no matter how it turned out we'd have accomplished that goal.

[mrwuss]

Everyone knows MK and VE were going to fight each other, right?

You all ruined it, jerks.

[Logan]

[quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1320626439' post='2840729']
Clearly this didn't work and we rolled Legion and NSO didn't accept peace to let it happen etc etc etc.


What happened to all the conspiracy theorists?
[/quote]

I don't know. I had other things to attend to today, but it was funny to come back and see the wild speculation from the bottom feeders after peace had been agreed to hours prior. I told you, if you wanted answers you should have simply asked your government, they would have told you if they wanted you to know.

[Ch33kY]

Congrats VE and MK for defeating Legion, Tetris and NSO

[Unknown Smurf]

[quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1320626439' post='2840729']
Clearly this didn't work and we rolled Legion and NSO didn't accept peace to let it happen etc etc etc.


What happened to all the conspiracy theorists?
[/quote]

Oh we got what we wanted. Didn't you get the memo? The whole thing was a rouse to get you to mess up collections and spend money on militarizing

[mdnss69]

[quote name='Leet Guy' timestamp='1320423022' post='2838393']
[center][img]http://i.imgur.com/shlVA.gif[/img][img]http://i.imgur.com/4nzaS.png[/img][/center]

Lately, this forum has degraded into one of the most despicable cesspools of posturing and e-peen waving we have ever seen...
...whining of the New Sith Order...
...their far-too-inflated egos[/quote]


I was going to call it irony but irony implies that it is feigned. Sadly, this is naught but blatant hypocrisy.

[IYIyTh]

[quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1320626439' post='2840729']
Clearly this didn't work and we rolled Legion and NSO didn't accept peace to let it happen etc etc etc.


What happened to all the conspiracy theorists?
[/quote]

You paired with an alliance that suggested if NSO would not agree to surrender terms Legion would have to surrender to NSO.
You also threatened an alliance(s) and by application their allies for offering more than fair surrender terms with attack if it did not account for the stupidity of one of your allies' treaty partners who in no uncertain terms was involved in the original dispute that started the war. In doing so, you essentially raised the prospect of an escelating war over the actions of an alliance that you personally have stated were quite out of bounds. While I respect VE in having a horse in Tetris still on the field (Notwithstanding their refusal to withdraw because NSO found admitting reality unsavory,) pairing with the alliance you did whom for a period of time prior to this stunt had been attempting to find a way to escalate this war privately and publicly made little sense, especially with the motives provided in the OP.

To me, it's not surprising that many are not exactly ecstatic or rushing to give you a gold star for this endeavor.

Edited November 7, 2011 by IYIyTh

[Ironfist]

Whose turn is it now?

[WarriorConcept]

[quote name='IYIyTh' timestamp='1320660523' post='2840982']
You paired with an alliance that suggested if NSO would not agree to surrender terms Legion would have to surrender to NSO.
You also threatened an alliance(s) and by application their allies for offering more than fair surrender terms with attack if it did not account for the stupidity of one of your allies' treaty partners who in no uncertain terms was involved in the original dispute that started the war. In doing so, you essentially raised the prospect of an escelating war over the actions of an alliance that you personally have stated were quite out of bounds. While I respect VE in having a horse in Tetris still on the field (Notwithstanding their refusal to withdraw because NSO found admitting reality unsavory,) pairing with the alliance you did whom for a period of time prior to this stunt had been attempting to find a way to escalate this war privately and publicly made little sense, especially with the motives provided in the OP.

To me, it's not surprising that many are not exactly ecstatic or rushing to give you a gold star for this endeavor.
[/quote]

Where did government say that, exactly?

The only thing about the NSO-Legion front that mattered was that the stagnation of peace between them was forcing Tetris into a situation where they were taking damage well beyond what we found acceptable. If we had only threatened either Legion or NSO with war, then you may have a claim as the bias of our decision, but the fact of the matter is that both were the targets of our announcement.

If MK wanted this to escalate why wait until now, and do so in a way that forced the combatants to peace?

Ultimately this has all just been conspiracy theories that were ultimately proven false.

[mrwuss]

[quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1320674971' post='2841041']
Where did government say that, exactly?

The only thing about the NSO-Legion front that mattered was that the stagnation of peace between them was forcing Tetris into a situation where they were taking damage well beyond what we found acceptable. If we had only threatened either Legion or NSO with war, then you may have a claim as the bias of our decision, but the fact of the matter is that both were the targets of our announcement.

If MK wanted this to escalate why wait until now, and do so in a way that forced the combatants to peace?

Ultimately this has all just been conspiracy theories that were ultimately proven false.
[/quote]


You won't convince them of this, they will simply turn it into fuel to further fan the fire under the theory.

[kolsara]

[quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1320674971' post='2841041']
Where did government say that, exactly?

The only thing about the NSO-Legion front that mattered was that the stagnation of peace between them was forcing Tetris into a situation where they were taking damage well beyond what we found acceptable. If we had only threatened either Legion or NSO with war, then you may have a claim as the bias of our decision, but the fact of the matter is that both were the targets of our announcement.

If MK wanted this to escalate why wait until now, and do so in a way that forced the combatants to peace?

Ultimately this has all just been conspiracy theories that were ultimately proven false.
[/quote]

i think the main argument against this, is that tetris could have had a seperate peace but chose not to, essentially keeping themselves in the war. I don't believe tetris was forced into anything.

[WarriorConcept]

[quote name='kolsara' timestamp='1320683861' post='2841128']
i think the main argument against this, is that tetris could have had a seperate peace but chose not to, essentially keeping themselves in the war. I don't believe tetris was forced into anything.
[/quote]

And them being our ally, we decided to help them out by forcing both alliances to come to a conclusion in the war.

[Isaac MatthewII]

well blue balls is no fun

[GoddessOfLinn]

[quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1320689272' post='2841178']
And them being our ally, we decided to help them out by forcing both alliances to come to a conclusion in the war.
[/quote]

You mean you forced Legion to give NSO the white peace that they wanted. What you did was not in any way balanced! It was not noble and it was not necessary in order for Tetris to get peace.

But I am sure that you know this. I see/saw this as an attempt to escalate the conflict in order to roll our friends.

[Buzz Lightyear]

[quote name='GoddessOfLinn' timestamp='1320691701' post='2841197']
You mean you forced Legion to give NSO the white peace that they wanted. What you did was not in any way balanced! It was not noble and it was not necessary in order for Tetris to get peace.

But I am sure that you know this. I see/saw this as an attempt to escalate the conflict in order to roll our friends.
[/quote]
so whyd you agree then? This is the era of legion standing up for itself right?

[Isaac MatthewII]

i really would have gained alot of respect for Legion if they had fought.....but this war has still givin me respect for them...ive lost respect for all other parties involved even the ones that poke their noses in late in the war....