Proof of Allegations

[Stewie]

Yes, Arexes is an active SoaB, he kicks our tri in the ass when they go inactive for more than a day. He's also our forum administrator alongside the current Triumvirate.


I fail to see how he runs the AA? We've got government ministers for that.

[Wilhelm the Demented]

[quote name='Rush Sykes' timestamp='1329270971' post='2920785']
Well, they could take the Sparta gov route, and just call it all fakes and call it a day and pretend like nothing happened. Seemed to work out ok for you !@#$%bags.
[/quote]
"QUICK! Throw them a red herring!"

The Spartan Government Route: Don't know about it until it's used against you publically... and then learn that it doesn't actually exist after doing some digging. What an incredible bunch of !@#$%bags!

Edited February 15, 2012 by Wilhelm the Demented

[Rush Sykes]

[quote name='Wilhelm the Demented' timestamp='1329271343' post='2920788']
"QUICK! Throw them a red herring!"

The Spartan Government Route: Don't know about it until it's used against you publically... and then learn that it doesn't actually exist after doing some digging. What an incredible bunch of !@#$%bags!
[/quote]

At least you get it.....

[Jgoods45]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1329270357' post='2920771']
Well they're only treatied to MK and not Non Grata.

I heard the International doesn't like MK. Please pull out of C&G or kick TLR out.
[/quote]

wow dude Why would you suggest such a terrible thing?

also, lol this is greeeat.

[Ayatollah Bromeini]

[quote name='Rush Sykes' timestamp='1329271218' post='2920786']
This post made me LOL.
[/quote]

You don't think we could kick you out if we wanted to, boy? You feeling tough!?

We MK-haters don't take to kindly to your type around here.

[Augustus Autumn]

[quote name='ktarthan' timestamp='1329269707' post='2920755']
There is a clear difference between lauding a post and highlighting its strengths and whatnot, as that itself can add to the discussion. But putting words into the opposition's mouth (justified or not (I say not, but I don't care enough to argue it)) is one of the most annoying possible ways to do so.
[/quote]

It was less to put words into the mouth of the opposition, as it were, and more a general commentary. Were I or anyone to take the time to find them, every thread has a post which could be used to point out the community's trend of ignoring fact in favor of point-scoring and hype.

[enderland]

[quote name='LordDarknessOfLight' timestamp='1329270598' post='2920779']
Is it just me or did anyone notice this..? How could you accept Intel from someone but be the only one to know about it?

That leads to.. Who gave you the information?
[/quote]

Blackstone is stirring in its grave.

[Vol Navy]

[quote name='Zoomzoomzoom' timestamp='1329270110' post='2920766']
Their activity, wonder ratios, and top tier make them anything but a paper tiger.

Just looking at MK's forum I can see that they've had 60% of their alliance check in today. That's probably better than every alliance in the game except maybe one.

Stop being ridiculous.
[/quote]


MK may have forum activity, but it didn't translate in their wars. At least it didn't when we fought them during PB/DH. I've spent a lot of days fighting a lot of MK members the past few years. The fall off from Karma to DH/NPO was stunning.

They went from over 200 nations to under 150 during the war, mostly people just going 25 days and deleting after a few rounds of war. Several sat at ZI with multi-billion dollar war chests and never bothered fighting back at all. This was fairly wide spread in the 20-60k ns range for MK. They finally got a good portion of that area in PM but I was still allowed free reign with no counters from MK after the 1st round. Several of their members spent the entire war turtling in nuke anarchy and collecting on day 20-25. I fought Rafal Nadal 3 different rounds. I had an easier time getting in and out of PM than he did despite being vastly outnumbered. I literally fought from the 1st of Feb til late May with only a couple of 5 day PM stops to restock and got countered once the whole rest of the war, that by a GOON.

I was also never countered by any LOST or Athens members even though they'd DOW'd us. I did declare on several of them too. The guy from LOST was one of the few who actually fought back despite me having double his tech.

MK took similar damage during that war that most losing alliances would take. Which seems to be one of the complaints that had with Roq from what I can tell. I'm honestly not sure what Roq/Umb was supposed to do about it. They ran me from 100k to 50k in a round. After that I was only in Legend of the Skies from UMBs range and I fought a round against him. I think he at least nuked back a few times.

[Stewie]

Lots of people just stop caring after 2-3 rounds of war. I'm sure many members of MK are only there now for the social aspect rather than the nation development.

[Charles Stuart]

Oh no..MK isn't as awesome as their lackeys would have us believe..say it isn't so!

[Avery du Troiseau]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1329270357' post='2920771']
Well they're only treatied to MK and not Non Grata.

I heard the International doesn't like MK. Please pull out of C&G or kick TLR out.
[/quote]


I herd u liekd mudkips.

One must refrain from espousing such vulgarities as one might not haveth the monies for wence the debt for which one has espoused are to be collected.

[Zoomzoomzoom]

[quote name='Vol Navy' timestamp='1329271901' post='2920797']
snip
[/quote]

Hardly an argument for paper tiger status.

That's like saying TPF is still a paper tiger after being drained from everyone fleeing Slayer. Don't even try to argue you folks weren't a paper tiger after PC, the NEW members, and D34th's AA all left. TPF was absolute !@#$ after that.

Alliances reach their peaks. It has happened with alliances like TPF, TOP, and MK. Are you really willing to argue that these alliances all suck though? In comparison to their glory days they are all weaker, but MK and TOP are still nimble and organized fighting forces. I really can't judge how to categorize TPF because it was never in the same 'elite' category as TOP/MK.

[Seerow]

People lack the attention span to fight at their full attention for months straight? Say it ain't so!

Even at our most innactive, we still fought harder than the vast majority of alliances involved in that war. Anyone who decides to believe the line that MK are paper tigers is welcome to try their hand at it, but don't be surprised when you pull a stump back.

[Drai]

[quote name='Roadie' timestamp='1329270422' post='2920773']
Thing is though, the few upper tier (obviously became mid tier in a hurry - and that was Umbrellas doing, not MKs) and mid tier nations that we had out of PM were greatly outnumbered by the DH coalition in that range, yet were running over MK nations that entire war. It was like they just didn't care.
[/quote]
That is absolutely false. I worked with most of our mid-upper tier that war as Baron of the Vanguard and nearly every single person in that range was on IRC daily to coordinate. The 50k+ range was a cakewalk on our side. Perhaps you had the one or two nations that were too lazy to get online regularly, but when I was assigning targets I was giving them out to whoever was online at the time because we had an excess of capable and competent fighters for the targets available in that range. Don't pretend to know what you're talking about and call it 'facts' in attempt to prove some point that is non-existent.

Edit: We had deletions throughout a lot of 2010 after the TOP war and during early 2011 but those weren't the people on the battlefield and I can assure you that nearly everybody who still has a nation in MK is ready to fight. And yes, the lower tier was an uphill battle since it was constantly being spammed with higher-tech wonderheavy nations that the mid and upper tiers had beaten down.

@volnavy, we took heavy damage that war because we were often fighting 3v1s or 3v2s in the upper tiers which puts us at a nuclear disadvantage. Also how did you have an easier time getting to peace mode than Rafael if you only were in peace mode twice throughout nearly 3 months. Your post is filled with stats that are proving a different point than what you're wanting them to say.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Drai

[Charles Stuart]

[quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1329272520' post='2920809']
People lack the attention span to fight at their full attention for months straight? Say it ain't so!

Even at our most innactive, we still fought harder than the vast majority of alliances involved in that war. Anyone who decides to believe the line that MK are paper tigers is welcome to try their hand at it, but don't be surprised when you pull a stump back.
[/quote]

I can talk tough under my Umbrella too!

Edited February 15, 2012 by Charles Stuart

[Sir Humphrey]

[quote name='Stewie' timestamp='1329272127' post='2920802']
Lots of people just stop caring after 2-3 rounds of war. I'm sure many members of MK are only there now for the social aspect rather than the nation development.
[/quote]
Woah, if this assessment was for any other alliance not on MK's "side", it would be used as evidence of that alliance's awfulness or military incompetence.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Sir Humphrey

[Zoomzoomzoom]

[quote name='Sir Humphrey' timestamp='1329272891' post='2920812']
Woah, if this was for any alliance not on MK's "side", it would be used as evidence of that alliance's awfulness or military incompetence.
[/quote]

That's because most alliances can't get off more than 20 wars in one hour

[infinite citadel]

[quote name='Drai' timestamp='1329272553' post='2920810']
That is absolutely false. I worked with most of our mid-upper tier that war as Baron of the Vanguard and nearly every single person in that range was on IRC daily to coordinate. The 50k+ range was a cakewalk on our side. Perhaps you had the one or two nations that were too lazy to get online regularly, but when I was assigning targets I was giving them out to whoever was online at the time because we had an excess of capable and competent fighters for the targets available in that range. Don't pretend to know what you're talking about and call it 'facts' in attempt to prove some point that is non-existent.

Edit: We had deletions throughout a lot of 2010 after the TOP war and during early 2011 but those weren't the people on the battlefield and I can assure you that nearly everybody who still has a nation in MK is ready to fight. And yes, the lower tier was an uphill battle since it was constantly being spammed with higher-tech wonderheavy nations that the mid and upper tiers had beaten down.

@volnavy, we took heavy damage that war because we were often fighting 3v1s or 3v2s in the upper tiers which puts us at a nuclear disadvantage.
[/quote]

Let them think we're a paper tiger imo

[Vanilla Napalm]

[quote name='Wilhelm the Demented' timestamp='1329269881' post='2920761']
Thing One: (Bob "appealing to the people to actually address the issue instead of attempting to debase one another".)

That seems a lot like appealing to everyone to address the central issue instead of insulting one another.

[/quote]
Seems more like a assessment than an appeal, and one that tars all statements ((and particularly MK's) within this thread as identical (i agree with the point, disagree with the scope of the generalisation.)
[quote]
Thing Two: (You "attempting to debase" my post.)

The patronizing inflection was an obvious sign that you were attempting to criticize me. There is a strong implication that I'm acting mindlessly while simultaneously accusing others of doing the same , apparently you didn't feel like stating it too strongly (that does make it harder to dismiss later). I have since addressed your primary concern: I was not mindlessly quoting him, I actually agree with the appeal expressed in "Thing One".
[/quote]
Wasn't it "debasing you" earlier? I addressed everything else here in my prior post. And to be fair, it could be strongly inferred that you were acting mindlessly while simultaneously accusing others of doing the same; that i only responded calmly to the post if anything respresents how 'not attacking the person' i'm acting.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Vanilla Napalm

[Kzoppistan]

Well this was a rather predictable fallout in regards to the accumulation and diffusion of collective power.

After NPO was toppled, and then rolled again to break them into a subservient alliance, there was a general diffusion of power across the web. Post Karma Heg alliances were isolated and weakened while Karma victors improved their standing. As more and more influence was gathered about the center of MK and other victors, you see them begin to take on the roles of their conquers, though, in taking a lesson from Karma about not being one central core alliance as the director, a more decentralized structure emerged.

Quite a few number of players strove to assert their dominance now that the central tie on NPO was cut. Vengeance is the theme of the last 2 years. Iirc, TPF was the first to get a taste (before their overlord NPO was snapped up by TLR,now they're safe again). NpO was the second to assert her power in a new world, and by the strange twists of the BiPolar war, had difficulty in securing a foothold, and being alienated from MK and that corner of the increasingly centralized area of the war. As we've seen in the following months, strikes against peripheral and ex-heg alliances have become more frequent due to a lack of ability of others to retaliate.

NG, in their strongest position since the merging, have made strikes against SOS, UPN, and AGW Overlords. The Legion, in her isolated state, was targeted by NSO, but as NSO lacked the ties or camaraderie to the center, was left to defend itself. Now, TOP, with backing from MK, has extracted revenge on Polaris, with the ensuing fallout being that all those that were on the farthest corners from the new center have received their due. The major blocs, XX, Superfriends, Mjölnir, have all crumbled under the onslaught and are now of less consequence than before, some even dissolving completely.

But there can only be room at the top for a few. Too many egos and jostling for inclusion creates rancor and paranoia. Sooner or later the infighting would begin, and here it is.

That the most dominate alliances are utilizing the most underhanded tactics is not really surprising. It is only the most ruthless and deceitful that ever make it to the top and stay for any length of time. Without those characteristics, one will not last (MHA anyone?)

Roq's exposé is probably not the spark, but is more than likely the seed.

Very interested in how this might develop.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Kzoppistan

[Sephiroth]

People kept insulting Roq despite knowing he had access to this type of information and told him to post evidence to his claims if he had any, now people are surprised when he followed through with it? MK trying to assassinate Roq's character here aren't making them look any better here or making Roq's story any less believable. It will be interesting to see if Umbrella keeps their treaty with MK, at least they haven't jumped on the bandwagon of throwing insults at Roq like some of MK's other allies as their response.

[Roadie]

[quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1329272520' post='2920809']
People lack the attention span to fight at their full attention for months straight? Say it ain't so!

Even at our most innactive, we still fought harder than the vast majority of alliances involved in that war. Anyone who decides to believe the line that MK are paper tigers is welcome to try their hand at it, but don't be surprised when you pull a stump back.
[/quote]

It wasn't months into it that it showed.


[quote name='Drai' timestamp='1329272553' post='2920810']
That is absolutely false. I worked with most of our mid-upper tier that war as Baron of the Vanguard and nearly every single person in that range was on IRC daily to coordinate. The 50k+ range was a cakewalk on our side. Perhaps you had the one or two nations that were too lazy to get online regularly, but when I was assigning targets I was giving them out to whoever was online at the time because we had an excess of capable and competent fighters for the targets available in that range. Don't pretend to know what you're talking about and call it 'facts' in attempt to prove some point that is non-existent.

Edit: We had deletions throughout a lot of 2010 after the TOP war and during early 2011 but those weren't the people on the battlefield and I can assure you that nearly everybody who still has a nation in MK is ready to fight. And yes, the lower tier was an uphill battle since it was constantly being spammed with higher-tech wonderheavy nations that the mid and upper tiers had beaten down.
[/quote]

Assigning targets did not mean your nations performed, they were largely turtles (Not talking about 30k nations - up to 50k at the beginning - where we had you outnumbered). Upper tier I'm sure everyone knows we used that super awesome Legion strategy so there really isn't much to talk about there other than the few we did have out got sent packing in a big hurry largely by Umbrella, not MK - though that could be due to the insane activity levels of Um. Once they joined the few others we had out in 50k range they all encountered poor resistance. The offensive declarations (against TPF) weren't there like they had been in the previous fight and many didn't run attacks, etc. It's not like MK nations don't know what they're doing, we know full well they do, but for some reason didn't care to do it.

Not of this is intended to compare penis sizes or to call MK names. It's just to say that the MK of today aint nothing special.

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Jgoods45' timestamp='1329265309' post='2920666']
If you think that you have the support to carry out your plans with your band of morons who cling to every word you say like your some kind of messiah.
[/quote]
. . . I didn't start this thread.

[Mogar]

I need to get drunk before I come back to this thread.

[Roadie]

[quote name='Drai' timestamp='1329272553' post='2920810']
@volnavy, we took heavy damage that war because we were often fighting 3v1s or 3v2s in the upper tiers which puts us at a nuclear disadvantage. Also how did you have an easier time getting to peace mode than Rafael if you only were in peace mode twice throughout nearly 3 months. Your post is filled with stats that are proving a different point than what you're wanting them to say.
[/quote]

Just caught this edit, sorry about not including it in my previous reply. Vol didn't need to go to PM regularly is what he's saying there. He could have but there was little point in it.