Doitzel Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 Do you understand that the world does not revolve around you and your do whatever it takes, ruin as many people's lives, so long as you can make a name for yourself as an investigatory journalist, no matter how many friends you lose or people you leave dead and bloodied along the way, just so long so you can make a name for yourself as an investigatory journalist, no matter how many friends you lose or people you leave dead and bloodied and dying along the way? ...what??? My POV is no set of IC actions should result in Criminal activity. Simple as that, nothing feisty. I am sure you are of similar opinion.The certain subset of actions that you imply which would elicit such a response....I find this statement again quite weird. So canceling a protectorate because our protectorate was conspiring against us and allies is wrong now? Clearly for you, this certain action falls in the subset that would elicit a criminal response? Are you serious? lol, so now we should let people run their full course of conspiracy to undermine the alliance..otherwise omg we'll be DDoS-attacked again. Why were they conspiring against you and your allies? The person responsible for the DDoS of NPO's forums and for releasing the logs demonstrating Jardheads' "intentions" is not even in the alliance now, nor under attack by NPO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doitzel Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 Absolutely, but it hardly follows that we aren't allowed to make a public announcement informing everyone about what happened, as far as we know, and the extent of the attacks. I don't disagree. Sponge and I do have differing opinions from time to time. I do see it, I hope you don't mind, as an opportunity for some candid, purely-OOC discussion of the nature of such things however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Boris Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 When will people learn... CN is filled with notoriously slow learners, unfortunately. Godspeed to IRON in getting things resolved and in finding those responsible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NuclearShawn Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) ...what??? A light hearted jab at Vox's controversial stance on this, as with most topics. I earnestly believe that DDoS'ing becoming an acceptable element of Cybernations would be entirely detrimental to the functioning of the game. Suppose someone decided to DDoS CN and its forums themselves, as retribution for being disenfranchised from being a powerful alliance? I view that in the same manner as this. Losing a game never warrants the response of popping everyone elses' ball. Edited March 4, 2009 by NuclearShawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derantol Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 ...what??? It's a quote from Zoolander. The point is that the person involved was getting too involved in reporting a story for personal gain rather than really looking at what they were doing. Zoolander (the speaker at the time) just happens to be incredibly stupid, hence the unreadability of the quote. So I wonder what he was trying to imply... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heft Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 I don't disagree. Sponge and I do have differing opinions from time to time.I do see it, I hope you don't mind, as an opportunity for some candid, purely-OOC discussion of the nature of such things however. As long as you don't disparage my dear darling alliance, then I suppose. It's a quote from Zoolander. The point is that the person involved was getting too involved in reporting a story for personal gain rather than really looking at what they were doing. Zoolander (the speaker at the time) just happens to be incredibly stupid, hence the unreadability of the quote.So I wonder what he was trying to imply... Presumably he was implying that Zoolander is, like, really great. I mean, gasoline fight? Brilliant. And I feel ashamed that I didn't immediately recognize that quote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shahenshah Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) Why were they conspiring against you and your allies? The person responsible for the DDoS of NPO's forums and for releasing the logs demonstrating Jardheads' "intentions" is not even in the alliance now, nor under attack by NPO. Because DevilDogs (Jarheads) had been PZId for DDoS, Tech raids and Nuke attacks in Red Sphere? and then they were given a second chance to prosper? (did someone mention attrocities of EZI in this thread? *De Silva* ahem*) even treaties were signed with them..Even protection was offered...even Tech trades occurred so everyone can have mutual benefits? What else do you want us to give them? We gave protection to their independence, military and economic support despite their earlier actions...and this is the response we get...and despite all this..IRON still follows the treaty clauses to the word. I dont know who is the culprit behind DDoS, so I dont know whether he/she is under attack by NPO or not, if you seem to have concrete evidence in this regard that leads you to that conclusion...then I am sure you will help CN Administration with the information Edited March 4, 2009 by shahenshah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smooth Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) And OOC matters should be left for OOC consequences where appropriate and not irresponsibly for political advantage in a way that blurs the barrier between game and not-game. I'm sure that IRON has a duty to notify the CN community as a whole of an OOC occurrence on their forum, as well as an obligation to it's membership to use IC punishments as consequences to OOC actions which attack both OOC things and IC communities, that is to say, punishing a nation who feels it has to take things to the OOC level just to retaliate for some IC event. Edited March 4, 2009 by Smooth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schattenmann Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 Listen if alliances can use IPs and hostmasks to track down PZI listers, then why--outside of law--can't people DDoS attacks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batallion Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 The timing leads me to believe it was Jarheads. Also, some people said DevilDogs have done something like this to NPO as well? That really proves who I think it was.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unko Kalaikz Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) Listen if alliances can use IPs and hostmasks to track down PZI listers, then why--outside of law--can't people DDoS attacks? Name an instance where tC tracked and hunted players across rerolls using solely IP marks (Although Vox certainly tried that with me). In any case the two are hardly equivalent. Besides the legal aspects, following someone's IP trail is hardly the same as attacking an ISP network and disrupting service, and trying to damage forums. Edited March 4, 2009 by Count da Silva Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tolkheleknar Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 My POV is no set of IC actions should result in Criminal activity. Simple as that, nothing feisty. I am sure you are of similar opinion.The certain subset of actions that you imply which would elicit such a response....I find this statement again quite weird...now I am guessing here >> So canceling a protectorate because our protectorate was conspiring against us and allies is wrong now? Clearly for you, this certain action falls in the subset that would elicit such a criminal response? Are you serious? lol, so now we should let people run their full course of conspiracy to undermine the alliance..otherwise omg we'll be DDoS-attacked again. I believe you are quite missing the point. Slow down, go back and read it, and then comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hippy Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 It amounts to blatant terrorism in my eyes.... its a game for people to enjoy. Don't make it more than that. Shame on you, Shame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agafaba Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 Listen if alliances can use IPs and hostmasks to track down PZI listers, then why--outside of law--can't people DDoS attacks? Interesting point, also I think harassment of individual members outside of the game for ingame things is much much worse then DDoS attacks. I dont think anyone will be getting in RL trouble, but I do wish IRON well and hopefully that will be the end of any for some time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astronaut jones Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 Listen if alliances can use IPs and hostmasks to track down PZI listers, then why--outside of law--can't people DDoS attacks? They're both things only an !@#$%^& would do, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akon91 Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 On 1 March 2009, approximately 11:30pm Server time, IRON's forums came under a coordinated Distributed Denial of Service (DDoS) attack. This attack lasted from that point until sometime the morning of 3 March 2009, when our host's ISP was able to block the incoming attack. Our forums are now operating properly, and it appears there was no destruction of data. [sections of this are OOC, some are IC, should be obvious what is what] IRON realizes that there are entities that do not like us. We have no issue if this dislike is dealt with using IC methods and via ingame routes, etc. However, an attack on our forums is an attempt to destroy someone's personal property, as well as disrupt an ISP, which can cause issues to any number of people who have no involvement. Our server host is not involved in CyberNations, other than to host our forums. These actions are OOC and have been and will continue to be frowned upon. We have our theories and beliefs on who attacked us. However, we won't mention them here. Our host's ISP is absolutely ready to level criminal charges against the perpetrators of this act. And I, along with the IRON Council, have provided whatever info we have regarding this to them. Thank you for your time and consideration. IRON's forums are back up and running, at the usual address. tl;dr: Don't mess with our forums, you just might wind up in Jail. Signed, Finsterbaby, President Coursca, Secretary of State, IRON Councilor Shan Revan, Deputy Secretary of State, IRON Councilor Peron, Minister of Defense, IRON Councilor Grizz Goose, Deputy Minister of Defense, IRON Councilor MCRABT, Minister of Internal Affairs, IRON Councilor Matt Miller, Minister of the Vault, IRON Councilor Krash, Minister of Labor, IRON Councilor Iamthey, Minister of Intelligence, IRON Councilor Mods: If this is the inapproriate place for this post, please feel free to move. You really think someone is going to jail over this >_> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unko Kalaikz Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 You really think someone is going to jail over this >_> It would be amusing at the least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akon91 Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 It would be amusing at the least. It's really not going to happen....ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unko Kalaikz Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 It's really not going to happen....ever. Yes, but it would still be quite awesome. Perhaps they would meet my friend in Arizona. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shahenshah Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 You really think someone is going to jail over this >_> DDoS causes RL damages in RL $$$. There is a reason why it is a crime. and outlawed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilrow Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 It's really not going to happen....ever. That's an awful broad statement to make considering: DoS for hire scam teen jailed for five years and others here: Google Search of DDoS punishments Like the OP says it depends on what the ISP company does since it is their property that was attacked, probably not only affecting IRON but other customers of the ISP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akon91 Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 That's an awful broad statement to make considering:DoS for hire scam teen jailed for five years and others here: Google Search of DDoS punishments Like the OP says it depends on what the ISP company does since it is their property that was attacked, probably not only affecting IRON but other customers of the ISP. She messed with someones business....not someones fake internet alliance. This would be laughed out of court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilrow Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) She messed with someones business....not someones fake internet alliance. This would be laughed out of court. And the perpetrators in the case messed with a Real Life company's business and affected IRON and other patrons of the company's service due to the DDoS. From the OP; However, an attack on our forums is an attempt to destroy someone's personal property, as well as disrupt an ISP, which can cause issues to any number of people who have no involvement. Our server host is not involved in CyberNations, other than to host our forums. These actions are OOC and have been and will continue to be frowned upon. So it is not improbable for the ISP company to seek restitution for this action. Edited March 4, 2009 by Bilrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shahenshah Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) She messed with someones business....not someones fake internet alliance. This would be laughed out of court. The Fake internet alliance is hosted on someone's server..for which it pays to the business for providing the hosting facilities. So, when the fake internet alliance is attacked, the property of the hosting business is attacked, its customers suffer, its hosting services suffer, its bandwidth suffers, it looses real $. I am sure tho, only you will still come up with the same conclusion . Anywayz time to go, I hope such criminal activities do not happen against anyone ever. Edited March 4, 2009 by shahenshah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbrownso Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 Listen if alliances can use IPs and hostmasks to track down PZI listers, then why--outside of law--can't people DDoS attacks? I really hope you're purposely being obtuse. DDoS can have an effect on other people who are completely unconnected to CN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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