An attack upon IRON

[raptorix]

You can't be jailed for DDOS'ing someone's website unless doing so causes substantial financial loss to the owner. Also, if it was a DDOS, then there's no way anything can be done. The packets would be traced back to the botnet and stop there.

In short, LOL @ jailing someone for packeting a video game forum.

And $%&@ you to whoever's doing it. Leave our orange homies alone.

True, i had some internetshops in the past, some idiot thought it would be nice to DDOS us, it did cost me thousands of euros from missed business. Sad that some people are not able to seperate a simple game and there real life.

[MCRABT]

Firstly let me clarify what the purpose of this topic was, it was not for your sympathies, sympathy is nice and all but it doesn't change reality. No instead it was intended to inform anyone that attacks our server that you will be pursued outwith this game. Now it may be that the perpetrators are not CN players however given what is hosted on the server attacked I find it is the most likely possibility. Our host has absolutely no involvement in this game. He hosts our forums simply because he is a nice guy. As such this attack on IRON's forums is in reality an attack on his personal property. IRON is not looking to take appropriate action in this situation it's our hosts ISP who have asked us to gather any information we may have no matter how abstract it may seem.

Those in this thread trying to spin this as if IRON is somehow crying and bawing about getting dossed please stop. Please note that nowhere in the OP does IRON make any accusations as to the perpetrator of this attack, we have our suspicions and we will follow them up however until we have something more than circumstantial evidence they will be kept to ourselves. I would urge all those IRON members in here pointing fingers to stop doing so. As for those who want to speculate carry on but be aware that is all you are doing.

The person responsible for the DDoS of NPO's forums and for releasing the logs demonstrating Jardheads' "intentions" is not even in the alliance now, nor under attack by NPO.

Wrong the person who was responsible for the DDoS of NPO's forums is a Jarheads member. If your reading this we know who you are.

Listen if alliances can use IPs and hostmasks to track down PZI listers, then why--outside of law--can't people DDoS attacks?

If it wasn't illegal should it be considered a legal form of CN warfare? No because it is perpetrated outwith CN and is thus not a part of this game. It is illegal anyway so the point your trying to make is completely irrelevant.

She messed with someones business....not someones fake internet alliance.

This would be laughed out of court.

Actually they messed with our server as I stated above it is owned by a non CN player. You presume the only data hosted on that server is the IRON forums.

That could be said. But we're not crying about it either. We don't post topics about issues that have already been resolved for the purpose of inciting mindless sympathy for us. We are above that.

Pssshhh the likes of yourselves and Vox Populi whole agenda relies on sympathy and the dislike of the global hegemony. As for the already resolved issues I believe Vox posted a resolved issue in there latest version of TWiP. NPO makes a thread and you go cry about it. You personally cried all the way through there Jarheads DOW for about 7 pages on how unjust and unfair they are. I mean really your in here whining about what you perceive to be someone else whining. Should you not be off plotting the downfall of Continuum or something? In all seriousness you are the most irritating person I've come across on these forums whether you take that as a complement or not is completely up to yourself.

Having your forums attacked makes you proud to be an IRON member? Please explain your logic here.

Yes, they should. But it tends to be EXTREMELY hard to trace a botnet since they utilize thousands of compromised systems across the globe. Just write a simple script, drop it in a web page, email, maybe some forums via a software vulnerability, and you instantly have thousands of computers awaiting your orders. All from the comfort of your home.

How do you even know that the person who attacked your forums is a member of CyberNations? I'm 99% positive that you're using shared hosting. Which means there are hundreds, if not thousands of web sites hosted on the server you're on. Any one of those could have pissed someone off, causing the dDoS attack. Or hell, maybe the entire data-center's connection was clogged via the dDoS. Only the hosting provider knows.

IRON is just as guilty for blurring the IC/OOC line by making this announcement within a roleplay forum.

You no absolutely nothing about our hosting arrangements to say you are 99% sure is an extremely foolish statement to make. You will notice on the first page this announcement was moved to role play forum by the mods, most likely because it is most appropriate for it to be here.

I guess in this situation, IRON is that emo kid that lives in the suburb with his parents. And they bought him a new Volvo to drive. But someone stole his iPod. So his life is horrrrrrible and he's a victim to society.

In Demeanor's situation, he's the kid that lives on a farm, gets up at 3 AM every morning to milk the cows, drives a rusted out 82 Chevy pickup, and has been saving money since he was six so he could go to college and improve his life.

Both are "victims," I guess.

No IRON isn't an "that emo kid" and no we didn't get our Ipod stolen. If you want our Ipod you can come and take it of us or well at least try. Wou

Personally, I agree. But what was done here was an intentional incitement of public sympathy. The issue was over with before post #1 was submitted. So, if using this as a PR stunt to gain sympathy isn't the main purpose behind this topic, then what is?

Honestly, I have zero sympathy for cry-babies that cry even after they get their pacifier back.

"Pacifier". Heh.

I think I've already explained what the purpose of this post was, so I'm not going to do so again. I have zero sympathy for you, your cause, your relentless whining about this thread, your whining about the state of cn, your whining about the injustices committed by the NPO do I need to go on?

I have zero sympathy for cry babies that cry all the time simply because they have nothing better to do with their time.

Honestly, most of us could care less how you solve your own internal issues. I think the biggest issue that's affecting IRON at this point, is the topics it posts. You lost your forums, you got them back - nothing was deleted, everything is exactly the way it was.

Get over it. Stop being emo.

Another complaint? Your like a broken record. For someone who doesn't care less you do like to !@#$%* alot.

The hyperbole in this thread is hilarious.

agreed.

Edited March 4, 2009 by MCRABT

[Windsor]

True, i had some internetshops in the past, some idiot thought it would be nice to DDOS us, it did cost me thousands of euros from missed business. Sad that some people are not able to seperate a simple game and there real life.

Hai. My name's Windsor. Welcome to the topic. Do you know where you are in this discussion?

Edited March 4, 2009 by Windsor

[Windsor]

Firstly let me clarify what the purpose of this topic was, it was not for your sympathies, sympathy is nice and all but it doesn't change reality. No instead it was intended to inform anyone that attacks our server that you will be pursued outwith this game. Now it may be that the perpetrators are not CN players however given what is hosted on the server attacked I find it is the most likely possibility. Our host has absolutely no involvement in this game. He hosts our forums simply because he is a nice guy. As such this attack on IRON's forums is in reality an attack on his personal property. IRON is not looking to take appropriate action in this situation it's our hosts ISP who have asked us to gather any information we may have no matter how abstract it may seem.

Those in this thread trying to spin this as if IRON is somehow crying and bawing about getting dossed please stop. Please note that nowhere in the OP does IRON make any accusations as to the perpetrator of this attack, we have our suspicions and we will follow them up however until we have something more than circumstantial evidence they will be kept to ourselves. I would urge all those IRON members in here pointing fingers to stop doing so. As for those who want to speculate carry on but be aware that is all you are doing.

Wrong the person who was responsible for the DDoS of NPO's forums is a Jarheads member. If your reading this we know who you are.

If it wasn't illegal should it be considered a legal form of CN warfare? No because it is perpetrated outwith CN and is thus not a part of this game. It is illegal anyway so the point your trying to make is completely irrelevant.

Actually they messed with our server as I stated above it is owned by a non CN player. You presume the only data hosted on that server is the IRON forums.

Pssshhh the likes of yourselves and Vox Populi whole agenda relies on sympathy and the dislike of the global hegemony. As for the already resolved issues I believe Vox posted a resolved issue in there latest version of TWiP. NPO makes a thread and you go cry about it. You personally cried all the way through there Jarheads DOW for about 7 pages on how unjust and unfair they are. I mean really your in here whining about what you perceive to be someone else whining. Should you not be off plotting the downfall of Continuum or something? In all seriousness you are the most irritating person I've come across on these forums whether you take that as a complement or not is completely up to yourself.

You no absolutely nothing about our hosting arrangements to say you are 99% sure is an extremely foolish statement to make. You will notice on the first page this announcement was moved to role play forum by the mods, most likely because it is most appropriate for it to be here.

No IRON isn't an "that emo kid" and no we didn't get our Ipod stolen. If you want our Ipod you can come and take it of us or well at least try. Wou

I think I've already explained what the purpose of this post was, so I'm not going to do so again. I have zero sympathy for you, your cause, your relentless whining about this thread, your whining about the state of cn, your whining about the injustices committed by the NPO do I need to go on?

I have zero sympathy for cry babies that cry all the time simply because they have nothing better to do with their time.

Another complaint? Your like a broken record. For someone who doesn't care less you do like to !@#$%* alot. Have you not got a girlfriend or something?

agreed.

Hmmm. So this is your way of saying, "Sorry, we screwed up?". Can't say that I'm surprised.

[NuclearShawn]

Hmmm. So this is your way of saying, "Sorry, we screwed up?". Can't say that I'm surprised.

[Windsor]

Indeed. I'm wondering if that was a response with any ..... substance.

[MCRABT]

Hmmm. So this is your way of saying, "Sorry, we screwed up?". Can't say that I'm surprised.

Is this your way of trying to bait me into trolling you so you can report me for trolling you?

or are you seriously saying you are incapable of comprehending that post, I thought it was pretty simple. Perhaps if I wrote it in 3 letter words you would understand better?

If I had any intention of apologizing I would have apologized. The fact is we have absolutely nothing to apologize for.

[UberSpion]

My post is based on personal theories and beliefs. However, I will not mention them here.

But UberSpion is absolutely ready to level criminal charges against the perpetrators of this act. And I, along with Planet BOB, have provided whatever info we have regarding this waste of time to them.

Good luck in your search for the criminals of this DoS attack.

Edited March 4, 2009 by UberSpion

[NuclearShawn]

Indeed. I'm wondering if that was a response with any ..... substance.

*snip* get better security, and a box of tissue so that when someone takes something away from you, and then gives it back in the same condition, we don't have to hear you guys cry about it in front of everyone.

A straw man argument is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position.

IRON isn't here to cry about our forums. Should you read the OP, you might realize it was a statement of why our forums have been down, a denouncement of DDoS attacks and those who use them, and a statement of what we have done.

Nowhere in the original announcement can I find a plea for Cybernations in any capacity to throw a sympathy party, as you seem so bent on painting a picture of. We aren't asking anyone to do anything.

I realize that basic logical fallacies are a staple of propaganda, but you can do better.

Edited March 4, 2009 by NuclearShawn

[Windsor]

Is this your way of trying to bait me into trolling you so you can report me for trolling you?

or are you seriously saying you are incapable of comprehending that post, I thought it was pretty simple. Perhaps if I wrote it in 3 letter words you would understand better?

If I had any intention of apologizing I would have apologized. The fact is we have absolutely nothing to apologize for.

Okay. Let's think about this for a second. If you had to break things down into 3 letter words for me to understand, then I surely wouldn't be capable of baiting. You think? Perhaps not. But, if that's what you DO think, then it looks like it worked.

I think the notion of informing everyone of something that is entirely irrelevant (i.e., IRON being in the same condition it was last week), and backing it up with a "warning" that everyone already knows.... and placing it in the wrong area.....is something that IRON should apologize for.

[Oktavia]

I thought you could only get jailed for DDOSing systems if you caused significant money loss or theft during the attack?

[raptorix]

Hai. My name's Windsor. Welcome to the topic. Do you know where you are in this discussion?

Trying to flame everybody in this topic? Way to go boy.

Edited March 4, 2009 by raptorix

[MCRABT]

Okay. Let's think about this for a second. If you had to break things down into 3 letter words for me to understand, then I surely wouldn't be capable of baiting. You think? Perhaps not. But, if that's what you DO think, then it looks like it worked.

I think the notion of informing everyone of something that is entirely irrelevant (i.e., IRON being in the same condition it was last week), and backing it up with a "warning" that everyone already knows.... and placing it in the wrong area.....is something that IRON should apologize for.

Ahhh so it seems that 3 letter words would be to large due to your inability to understand the word "OR". Writing my post in 1 letter words is beyond my ability. We didn't ask for you to read or care, you choose to do so, you therefor have no one else to blame but yourself for what you perceive to have been a waste of time. If you think it is a waste of time why do you persist on posting?

You have your opinion, we heard you the first time, we don't need 10 repeats to confirm that you are wrong. IRON is within it's right to post whatever the hell we want if you don't like it don't read it, it's as simple as that. Now unlike you I have better things to do than spend my day moronically whining in this thread. I bid you good day.

[Windsor]

Trying to flame everybody in this topic? Way to go boy.

HIGHFIVE o/\o.

No. I'm trying to help keep this on track. The focus of discussion here is whether or not to fall for a PR stunt. If you have, then my objective is to get you to think about it again

Edit: Hence the reaffirmation of some of my points, IRON. The bottom line here is to take responsibility for your own actions while telling others to do the same.

Edited March 4, 2009 by Windsor

[enderland]

HIGHFIVE o/\o.

No. I'm trying to help keep this on track. The focus of discussion here is whether or not to fall for a PR stunt. If you have, then my objective is to get you to think about it again

I think it's fairly clear that you are attempting to make this into a PR stunt to slam IRON.

No one disagrees.

[Windsor]

I think it's fairly clear that you are attempting to make this into a PR stunt to slam IRON.

No one disagrees.

You are correct. I will not deny that claim. Does that make me just as guilty? No. I didn't post the OP.

Edited March 4, 2009 by Windsor

[Oktavia]

I think it's fairly clear that you are attempting to make this into a PR stunt to slam IRON.

No one disagrees.

That's all their forum accounts exist for.

[raptorix]

HIGHFIVE o/\o.

No. I'm trying to help keep this on track. The focus of discussion here is whether or not to fall for a PR stunt. If you have, then my objective is to get you to think about it again

Edit: Hence the reaffirmation of some of my points, IRON. The bottom line here is to take responsibility for your own actions while telling others to do the same.

Ok, why would IRON would do that? Do you think they liked it that there forums where disfunctioning for multiple days?

Its also very easy to verify, check sites running on the same backbone or they had trouble...

[enderland]

You are correct. I will not deny that claim. Does that make me just me just a guilty? No. I didn't post the OP.

What's your point? You think IRON posted this with a "sweet, maybe people on the OWF are going to think worse about us because we posted a - gtfo from our forums - post" thought in mind?

Everything posted in these forums is a PR move of some sorts. "Public" and "relations" make that seem rather clear to me.

It actually makes you more guilty, because instead of just posting what 99% of the rest of this community thinks which is "wow people who do DoS attacks are @#%#%@es" you try to make it somehow about yourself. Hijacking someone else's announcement for the sake of your own PR (which, is for the record NOT positive in the slightest, and in fact you are the only forum member who has ever made me seriously consider putting them on ignore) is far worse than starting your own thread about a serious, both IC and OOC, event.

[Windsor]

Ok, why would IRON would do that? Do you think they liked it that there forums where disfunctioning for multiple days?

Its also very easy to verify, check sites running on the same backbone or they had trouble...

Indeed. I have the same question myself. I don't doubt that it happened.... but seeing as everything was just fine in the end, and that no data was lost, and that what happened most likely has nothing to do with Planet Bob, I can't help but to ask why we were informed.

At least now the title of this topic has more value.

[Shimmer]

Jarheads. I use to play Battle.net with them they are Clan RH on the east coast. Pathetic they resort to such events again.

[Windsor]

Jarheads. I use to play Battle.net with them they are Clan RH on the east coast. Pathetic they resort to such events again.

Okay, and this is exactly why Blackstone got involved with this topic - to prevent the incitement of a witch-hunt and accusations toward innocent parties. It didn't work, unfortunately, and now, I shall leave you guys to it, and bow out gracefully.

[President Nevik]

I'm appalled by the politicking done by both sides in this thread.

[raptorix]

Indeed. I have the same question myself. I don't doubt that it happened.... but seeing as everything was just fine in the end, and that no data was lost, and that what happened most likely has nothing to do with Planet Bob, I can't help but to ask why we were informed.

At least now the title of this topic has more value.

Do you actually know something how a DDOS works? Offcourse you don't loose data, its not some kind of virus or something, just an overload of network traffic to one point, so "real" traffic don't reach the site. A DDOS can cost a lot of data traffic, which in some cases have to be paid by the people who rent the servers, this can be in the thousands of euros if its an agressive attack. I think the statement of IRON was pretty clean, no accusations to anybody, just a clear message.

[MCRABT]

Okay, and this is exactly why Blackstone got involved with this topic - to prevent the incitement of a witch-hunt and accusations toward innocent parties. It didn't work, unfortunately, and now, I shall leave you guys to it, and bow out gracefully.

I would urge all those IRON members in here pointing fingers to stop doing so. As for those who want to speculate carry on but be aware that is all you are doing.

Ahh well your not needed we got it covered thanks for your help.