agafaba

There are plenty of reasons why CN is losing players involving how the game works, the politics, the way players are treated. The fact is the longer you play this game the less fun it becomes and it starts to feel more like a job. Its hard to leave something you invested so much time into but if you let your nation sit too long or if you are completely destroyed in a war its an excuse to get out.

I will admit, I loled.

[quote name='Aimee Mann' timestamp='1286223754' post='2474519'] The original context is irrelevant and has nothing to do with the intended meaning of your image. It's clear where people are finding humour in the image; the vehicle is called the gayroller 2000 and it's rolling over your political enemies. By implication you are calling your enemies straight, as though that's something negative. Heterophobic and bigoted. [/quote] I fixed it for you, based both on comments from future Pandora's box members as well as the original artists intentions.

[quote name='Kowalski' timestamp='1286215331' post='2474322'] Crazy idea - don't reply. [/quote] That advice would make for some really horrible discussions.

When did people get the privilege of naming their own wars? You know... this would be much more entertaining if their combined strength (all 3 alliances) was at least 75k ns. Or if 90% of the NS in all 3 alliances wasnt Andover.

Wow, so a 3rd super tiny alliance joins the fight.

[quote name='nutkase' timestamp='1285663415' post='2466737'] Though that war would not be defined as a global war. [/quote] Well in the last year there hasnt been too many global wars, I just assumed he made a mistake. The last global war according to the wiki [quote]The initial Polar declaration was made on allegations that a member of \m/ made racist comments towards AlmightyGrub, the Emperor of the New Polar Order, when he visited their IRC channel on the SynIRC server to voice his grievances with them over a raid on the Forces of Annihilation. AlmightyGrub, however, stated that the true rationale for the war was neither the racial comments nor the raid; rather, that those were merely examples of a wider "attitude" that he disliked and wished to see punished. This is supported by the fact that \m/ had already apologized for the aforementioned racist remarks before the beginning of the war, though some, especially NpO and its supporters, have questioned the sincerity of the apology as no action was taken against the member responsible other than a verbal reprimand. [/quote] Clearly they claimed \m/ were doing wrong by using OOC insults and general asshattery

Replied, and we are done

[quote name='Mr Damsky' timestamp='1285421790' post='2464249'] I'd take a 1v1 (even a 1v3) vs a 1v20 alliance war any day. And in the past year when has the starting CB of a global war ever been about an alliance "doing wrong". [/quote] The RoK-NSO war jumps to mind. With NSO "doing wrong" by aiding a member at war with a RoK protectorate.

The trade circle is complete, however we lost a member and are now short of our Pigs/Uranium resource. Agafaba - http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=289088 Water Aluminum Vladimar - http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=340035 Lumber Wheat Carthage Empire - http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=11961 Fish Spices Bart99 - http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=322472 Iron Sugar Imaginationland - http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=395020 Cattle Marble taintedxgod - http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=411477 Pigs Uranium Done

[quote name='Choader' timestamp='1285397861' post='2464079'] Forgive my stupidity then, but since when has a gather intel mission on an unaligned nation been an [size="4"][color="#FF0000"]Act of War[/color][/size] absolving a nation of any aggression past and present? These are some funny precedents you're trying to set. [/quote] The only reason the precedent was set that everyone can do anything to an unaligned back when people realized they didnt have anyone who could say otherwise. Not everyone agrees with the "do what you want and if they retaliate they are rogues" mentality. (as for him aiding Methrage making him a rogue or not is a different matter) Also Methrage had his AA for over 4 months, he was the leader of an alliance before he was warring GOONS.

[quote name='nippy' timestamp='1285401009' post='2464127'] Yes, but my advice to him was to not make solid assumptions based upon a single thread. There is too much bias in the OP to base one's sole opinion of an alliance on. Also, I've never understood the 'hiding within your alliance' comment. Nation leaders find comfort in the protection that an alliance provides while they grow their nation. In order to get used to the political climate, one must participate in it. To participate in it without being in an alliance would draw attention to one's self and be quite foolish. [/quote] He is in the NpO according to your post, so why does he need to be afraid of drawing attention. This thread isnt risky for anyone to post in unless you plan on aiding Methrage. As for bias, of course, every thread has a lot of bias, and the question was what effect this thread in particular has on opinions of GOONS. This is a great thread for new people, low risk while still having all the bias, mudslinging and arguing thats in nearly every OWF related discussion.

[quote name='nippy' timestamp='1285361204' post='2463560'] Ding. Ding, ding. An appropriate response would have been none at all, considering the fact that you know nothing about us, nor about the self-important person that produced the fecal mass that is the OP. You're already in the NpO, apparently, so unless they have some sort of forced mentality course you have to attend as a new member, I suggest you spend a bit more time getting a hang of the political climate here. Thanks. [/quote] To be fair he replied to a question about how this thread affected people if at all, and he started his post by saying his only experience was this thread. Besides hiding in your alliance is no way to get used to the political climate.

[quote name='Mandolus' timestamp='1285299151' post='2462961'] Just curious. Did this thread convince anyone of anything besides the fact that Schattenmann likes to type a whole lot? No, I'm not talking about you perpetual GOONS haters who will naysay us regardless of the circumstances. You know who you are. I'm talking about fence sitters, or people who like GOONS. Did this massive wall of words change your mind to the anti-GOONS camp? Did it even make you reconsider your feelings toward us for a moment? [/quote] To be honest it showed me 2 things, that GOONS possibly had one of the worst track records in CN history as far as bad raids go, and that you finally seem to be doing something about it. So... Boo GOONS o/ GOONS

[quote name='Umar ibn Abd al-Aziz' timestamp='1285294013' post='2462875'] You could consider that the NS you and I will be shedding in the coming days was really just a deferral of what would have happened if we'd both stayed in TOP. It's amusingly ironic that two ex-TOPpers who largely avoided the beat-down that our former colleagues received in the last war are going to be beating each other to a pulp 1/2 a year down the track [/quote] There can be only one!

[quote name='commander thrawn' timestamp='1285286895' post='2462719'] First, do you really believe alliance wars are defensive? Second, how does defensive war materially differ from offensive war? Especially if reps might be involved from either side. [/quote] Defensive wars are accepted, offensive wars are not. Every alliance war may not be defensive in truth, but they are sold as such. In truth both offensive wars and defensive wars are the same when you look at it from a material view only, however they are not the same when discussing justifications or morality. Wars are not justified/moral because you steal 1m dollars and 5 technology, they are justified through the actions leading up to the war itself. Because there are no actions leading up to a tech raid it is impossible for it to be defensive in nature, and impossible for it to be justified as moral. Even look at surrenders, in several recent cases the defending alliance was forced to declare that their actions were offensive in nature and therefore wrong. Alliances will use whatever opportunity they can to prove that their declaration of war was a defensive reaction to the other alliances previous aggressive action.

[quote name='commander thrawn' timestamp='1285275891' post='2462472'] Tech raids rarely are a fight to the death as that is counter-productive. Tech raids often get in a quad and anarchy and then peace out. [/quote] What I am trying to show is that tech raids are offensive in nature. Nation(s) attack, stealing what they can and then give the attacked nation 2 options. Accept peace or be attacked again the next day. Alliance wars are defensive in nature, to defend against foreign threats to their strength (both political and physical). Or to simplify it, tech raids are an [b]action[/b] taken by the aggressor. Alliance wars are nearly always a [b]reaction[/b] to an event. Whenever an alliance starts a war without it being a reaction it is denounced by nearly everyone, if tech raids are the same as wars then should the same standards not apply?

[quote name='commander thrawn' timestamp='1285214019' post='2461791'] When was the last war fought for that reason? [/quote] When was the last alliance war that that was fought with this reason? "Tech raid surrender for peace"

[quote name='Tautology' timestamp='1285198769' post='2461477'] Where on Earth did you get that silly idea from? [/quote] It is true of a sort, nearly every DoW describes why they are defending themselves by being offensive. Its not often you find a DoW claiming they did it because they felt like it, or because they wanted to steal the alliances cash/tech.

[quote name='CEverettKoop' timestamp='1285193485' post='2461378'] Even then we just follow the trail of breadcrums/exploding meth labs that ol' Methy leaves for us right to their doorstep. [/quote] True, but at least they wouldnt leave a map with directions. Who knows, maybe Methrage will try harder now that you guys are 3/3.

I think the lesson we have all learned is if you have to aid Methrage dont tell people that you are going to do it. at the very least you should make GOONS work to find out who did it.

[quote name='AvengingAngel256' timestamp='1285073700' post='2459899'] I would Like to Nominate Jerdge of the GPA. [url="http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=141583"]The Humble Nation of Gaela[/url] Intelligence shines through every wall of text post he makes and every argument he makes is well thought out and logically sound. He has been a constant voice of Reason throughout his 1,206 days on Planet Bob and I can think of no other better deserving. o/ Jerdge! [/quote] I too will nominate Jerdge of the GPA. As far back as I can remember each and every one of his posts have been respectful. He has offered his services to help end wars, he has broken down and explained situations to further understanding and in the end I can think of no individual who has both been an active presence on the OWF and lived the very ideals you mention in the op.

[quote name='blindswelledrat' timestamp='1284568129' post='2454808'] I see what you're up to Beefsafari I can do that too [12:10:48 AM] <Beefsafari> To: blindswelledrat From: beefsafari Date: 9/15/2010 12:01:50 AM Message: Please leave us alone We have had enough. We are sorry. We have talked among our GOONs alliance and we universally agree that you've spanked us like the naughty babies that we are. Please stop hurting us. We will do anything. And I mean [i]anything[/i]. Im pretty hot for a gamerchick you know. And I can oscilate [i]it[/i] What do you think? [/quote] You heard it here, attack GOONS and get hot gamerchicks. (you know if you advertised this you might get more members) Seriously though I hope you guys get enough members to be considered a real alliance just because it might make this whole situation a bit funnier.

[quote name='Haflinger' timestamp='1284718963' post='2456513'] Andre.... Andre. If the charges are public, then the criminal record ultimately is public as well. Yes, it maybe is a bit more difficult to access than simply doing an Internet search, but - a matter of public record is a matter of public record, and the public has a right to know what goes on in courtrooms. [/quote] Although you are right, I dont think it should be too easy for people to find. Maybe more serious charges, but sometimes silly little things can ruin peoples lives. Hell you can get a charge that will ruin your chances at a job interview and restrict travel outside your country just for being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Atop the tower Barad-dûr the all seeing eye gazes upon you and has decided you cannot trade with people wearing blue.