cookavich Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Delendum, I'd just like to preface what I am about to say with a statement that I have a huge amount of love and respect for MK, as allies, friends, and as an alliance. I also like you quite a bit. That said, you're here talking about respect for allies, and I'm really not seeing it coming from you, or MK as a whole lately on these boards. There are quite a few quiet shows behind the scenes, and those are much appreciated, but you're sitting here publicly bashing NpO, who IS your ally, and you know that STA will stand by Polar, and we're your ally too. While you're obviously always welcome to voice your opinion, do you really have to be so "Screw you" about it? Both STA and MK are placed in an awkward position here, and Archon and I spoke at length about that earlier today. I feel that we walked away from that conversation knowing that each of our alliances holds the other in extremely high regard, and we're each well aware of the others positions on this matter. I'm concerned, however, about the public beating NpO is getting here from you folks today. You're allies. Friends. It's incredibly easy to support them by saying "Well, I don't agree with you, but best of luck." and then go say what you need to say to them in private. I've heard a lot of things about fracturing "this side" with this action. You are just as responsible for that by publicly burning bridges when those bridges simply did not need to be burnt in this way. Friends don't behave this way in public. I'm reminded of the celebration that occurred publicly from MK when our treaties with NSO were canceled. We were really sad about that cancellation. I don't know. Maybe I'm just from the old school. This is not how allies should behave to one another. Thank you for that, Pez. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mussolandia Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Look, if MK attacked NSO tomorrow, you would be a bit more than pissed about it. Especially if we did so on account of some insults and a morality issue. Hell, we already fling !@#$ back and forth between us, we're half way there.They aren't our friend and we don't like them, why should we think twice about it amirite? Well, you could always try, like my friend Chronorica said. There is one problem, however. Usually, to win support over, you have to provide what is called a casus belli, which we haven't really given you. More powerful alliances than yours have been destroyed for failing to find one. This expression is part of the warped sense of entitlement your alliance has about us. When we signed our mutual defense pact with IRON, you were outraged and disappointed, as though we had slighted you - since, of course, you were an ally of an ally. Whilst we never considered you an enemy, we didn't feel like accomodating our foreign policy to please you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandeza Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 This war is dumb and everyone involved should feel dumb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TehChron Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 What was the diplomacy for? From what I can tell it was NpO trying enforce their moralities on \m/, but you can clarify that I'm sure. Does it matter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mussolandia Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 ODNers have been calling every war stupid since time immemorial. Why do you have to be so boring? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stumpy Jung Il Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 (edited) Delendum, I'd just like to preface what I am about to say with a statement that I have a huge amount of love and respect for MK, as allies, friends, and as an alliance. I also like you quite a bit. That said, you're here talking about respect for allies, and I'm really not seeing it coming from you, or MK as a whole lately on these boards. There are quite a few quiet shows behind the scenes, and those are much appreciated, but you're sitting here publicly bashing NpO, who IS your ally, and you know that STA will stand by Polar, and we're your ally too. While you're obviously always welcome to voice your opinion, do you really have to be so "Screw you" about it? Both STA and MK are placed in an awkward position here, and Archon and I spoke at length about that earlier today. I feel that we walked away from that conversation knowing that each of our alliances holds the other in extremely high regard, and we're each well aware of the others positions on this matter. I'm concerned, however, about the public beating NpO is getting here from you folks today. You're allies. Friends. It's incredibly easy to support them by saying "Well, I don't agree with you, but best of luck." and then go say what you need to say to them in private. I've heard a lot of things about fracturing "this side" with this action. You are just as responsible for that by publicly burning bridges when those bridges simply did not need to be burnt in this way. Friends don't behave this way in public. I'm reminded of the celebration that occurred publicly from MK when our treaties with NSO were canceled. We were really sad about that cancellation. I don't know. Maybe I'm just from the old school. This is not how allies should behave to one another. I respect STA. A lot. And I respect what you just said here. But its hard to stay quiet when your ally takes actions that could very well bring you into war with them. Our public displeasure is on a whole different level than attacking an MDP partner of our close ally. However, I agree that C&G members should be more respectful and less aggressive in this topic. Myself included. Edited January 21, 2010 by Stumpy Jung Il Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TehChron Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 ODNers have been calling every war stupid since time immemorial. Why do you have to be so boring? I *really* need to go try that cake. Dammit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timeline Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 (edited) So this is what I've got for the whole situation: Sparta cancels their protectorate with FoA \m/, GOONS and PC raid FoA after their protectorate with Sparta expires The Corporation (an ally of \m/) steps in and offers protection to FoA At this point the situation is consider resolved by all those who were involved ??? AlmightyGrub informs Ragnarok that he's going to do something about \m/'s tech raiding AlmightyGrub enters \m/'s channel, seeking "a solution". Neither side is willing to concede anything (what was being asked is still unclear) \m/ insults Grub \m/ posts a thread apologizing for the way they acted (albeit not the most sincere apology ever) The New Polar Order declares war on \m/ 70-page thread Anything to add? You missed one part, \M/ starts to cry about been attacked. Edited January 21, 2010 by Timeline Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Does it matter? If you can't answer it why are you responding to it? I'm asking a question of the alliance that declared war, not you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archon Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Delendum, I'd just like to preface what I am about to say with a statement that I have a huge amount of love and respect for MK, as allies, friends, and as an alliance. I also like you quite a bit. That said, you're here talking about respect for allies, and I'm really not seeing it coming from you, or MK as a whole lately on these boards. There are quite a few quiet shows behind the scenes, and those are much appreciated, but you're sitting here publicly bashing NpO, who IS your ally, and you know that STA will stand by Polar, and we're your ally too. While you're obviously always welcome to voice your opinion, do you really have to be so "Screw you" about it? Both STA and MK are placed in an awkward position here, and Archon and I spoke at length about that earlier today. I feel that we walked away from that conversation knowing that each of our alliances holds the other in extremely high regard, and we're each well aware of the others positions on this matter. I'm concerned, however, about the public beating NpO is getting here from you folks today. You're allies. Friends. It's incredibly easy to support them by saying "Well, I don't agree with you, but best of luck." and then go say what you need to say to them in private. I've heard a lot of things about fracturing "this side" with this action. You are just as responsible for that by publicly burning bridges when those bridges simply did not need to be burnt in this way. Friends don't behave this way in public. I'm reminded of the celebration that occurred publicly from MK when our treaties with NSO were canceled. We were really sad about that cancellation. I don't know. Maybe I'm just from the old school. This is not how allies should behave to one another. I quite agree with the sentiment described in this post and shall be passing it along to my membership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delendum Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 (edited) Delendum, I'd just like to preface what I am about to say with a statement that I have a huge amount of love and respect for MK, as allies, friends, and as an alliance. I also like you quite a bit. That said, you're here talking about respect for allies, and I'm really not seeing it coming from you, or MK as a whole lately on these boards. There are quite a few quiet shows behind the scenes, and those are much appreciated, but you're sitting here publicly bashing NpO, who IS your ally, and you know that STA will stand by Polar, and we're your ally too. While you're obviously always welcome to voice your opinion, do you really have to be so "Screw you" about it? Both STA and MK are placed in an awkward position here, and Archon and I spoke at length about that earlier today. I feel that we walked away from that conversation knowing that each of our alliances holds the other in extremely high regard, and we're each well aware of the others positions on this matter. I'm concerned, however, about the public beating NpO is getting here from you folks today. You're allies. Friends. It's incredibly easy to support them by saying "Well, I don't agree with you, but best of luck." and then go say what you need to say to them in private. I've heard a lot of things about fracturing "this side" with this action. You are just as responsible for that by publicly burning bridges when those bridges simply did not need to be burnt in this way. Friends don't behave this way in public. I'm reminded of the celebration that occurred publicly from MK when our treaties with NSO were canceled. We were really sad about that cancellation. I don't know. Maybe I'm just from the old school. This is not how allies should behave to one another. You and STA both have my love, and I agree in full with the points you raise. I admit (as I have earlier) that what I'm doing now is very poor form. I just don't take it lightly when an ally tells me "we don't care what our allies think, so long as we feel strongly about something" and flaunt it like it's something to be proud of. That was just a slap in my face (and not mine alone), as somebody who does feel pretty strongly about this, but out of respect intended to just shut up about it. Regardless, I've said my piece and hopefully proved my point. I'll now tip my hat and leave the floor. Edited January 21, 2010 by delendum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Brendan Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 You missed one part, \M/ starts to cry about been attacked. Can you link me to *one* example of a \m/ember crying about being attacked? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Well said pezstar, thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banksy Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 (edited) I *really* need to go try that cake. Dammit. Pingu baked you a special one here On topic: @ pezstar, I'm sure MK could be a little more courteous, but they are quite aggravated that Polar has put them in a position where C&G may have to fight against Polar (assuming this escalates) and Polar's allies. MK and polar are friends- and would hate for a situation like this to occur. I am no supporter of \m/ (far from it), but Polar should not have started this war. Edited January 21, 2010 by jamesdanaher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omfghi2u2 Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Not like I have any real political weight or anything, but good show on part from Pezstar, Archon and Delendum. But back on topic, So the reason why this thread has gotten to be 70 pages long because \m/ and co think this is a shabby CB? I think the real victim like Hoo put it a couple posts back is RoK here who is on both sides of this war. -omfg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shodemofi-NPO Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Can you link me to *one* example of a \m/ember crying about being attacked? There aren't actual tears in this post, but it comes close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stumpy Jung Il Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 There aren't actual tears in this post, but it comes close. Considering their alliance is getting rolled Im gonna go ahead and say Im impressed that that is all you can find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantastico Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 You and STA both have my love, and I agree in full with the points you raise. I admit (as I have earlier) that what I'm doing now is very poor form. I just don't take it lightly when an ally tells me "we don't care what our allies think, so long as we feel strongly about something" and flaunt it like it's something to be proud of. That was just a slap in my face (and not mine alone), as somebody who does feel pretty strongly about this, but out of respect intended to just shut up about it. Regardless, I've said my piece and hopefully proved my point. I'll now tip my hat and leave the floor. pezstar is not saying to leave, just try to be more diplomatic and not so "screw you" about things in contributing to the public debate. My alliance is closely tied to both NpO and Athens (via a protectorate), yet I still think it is okay to be critical of either "side" here in public debates, so long as it is done respectfully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shodemofi-NPO Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Considering their alliance is getting rolled Im gonna go ahead and say Im impressed that that is all you can find. I started on page 1. That post was on page 2 and happened to be the first \m/ post in the thread. I stopped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daikos Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 You know AirMe, FIST is not something I am responsible for. We have readily admitted that we made a very bad mistake right there. However, there is no comparison between these situations, like none at all. You may not have been responsible for it but I seem to recall you coming out and supporting the rolling of FIST. Also, I've seen this asked a number of times by members of PC but what diplomatic attempts did you make with them? Theres a lot of talk about GOONs getting off the hook because of diplomatic talks and \m/ being rolled because they didn't bow down to you in diplomatic relations. But PC was just as involved in these raids and as far as I can tell, granted thats as an outsider, your world policing only seems to go so far as pretending to be moralist crusaders as long as you aren't going to get a bloody nose in the process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penkala Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 (edited) Basically, all thats going on is "ATHENS RAIDED KON AND THEY DIDNT GET ROLLED, POLARIS JUST WANTS TO KILL \m/ BECAUSE POLARIS IS EVIL AND THERE TAKING OVER PLANENT BOB AND THERE GOING TO NUKE THE MOON AND EAT PLUTO" For chists sakes dont you people understand Athens took the diplomatic route, and appologized. When diplomatically approached, Athens handled it with diplomacy. When whoever else tech raided whoever, They used DIPLOMACY. When \m/ was approached, There diplomacy was to insult the government of Polaris, Which is a VALID casus belli aswell. So all in all, They have a VALID casus belli in more than one way. Basically all thats being said is Polaris attacked \m/ because of there name, Get over it. If Polaris didnt like the people in \m/ or \m/... RAD and IS would have disbanded last week or whenever this "new" \m/ was made. IS and RAD were hated by practically everyone anyways so they made \m/ because people USED to like \m/. Now they've given \m/ a bad name. Ahh I see. So if you say "my bad" every time it's all good. So essentially, \m/ way to piss off your protector's ally. And NpO, way to attack your ally's protectorate over your ego. Poor show from everyone involved. At least in the end one of you fools is getting rolled. 1/2 ain't bad. Edited January 21, 2010 by Penkala Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Brendan Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 I started on page 1. That post was on page 2 and happened to be the first \m/ post in the thread. I stopped. It's a pretty lame example of "crying" to be honest. Grub, I realize your ego is immense, but I have to point out that the only we or the almighty admin can disband us. Anyway, have fun with your moral crusade. I look forward to what other exciting policies you try to force on CN. All hail the Brave New World indeed! You could call it bitter I guess, but whining/crying? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stumpy Jung Il Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 I started on page 1. That post was on page 2 and happened to be the first \m/ post in the thread. I stopped. Oh >_> Well then you mislead me and for that I will now declare war on you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beauty Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 (edited) Ahh I see. So if you say "my bad" every time it's all good. So essentially, \m/ way to piss off your protector's ally. And NpO, way to attack your ally's protectorate over your ego. Poor show from everyone involved. At least in the end one of you fools is getting rolled. 1/2 ain't bad. Ahaha, No. Incase you didnt realize, About 4 months ago, everyone had neutral opinions or LOVED Athens. Now... Athens has enough hate to get them rolled next global conflict, easily. So now you finally understand. Edited January 21, 2010 by Rotavele Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stumpy Jung Il Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Also, I may have missed it, but you said \m/ can end this at any time. How exactly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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