Hymenbreach Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 You should understand that the ODN as a sovereign alliance didn't wish to travel the new road Legion was on under NPO control. I personally took the signing with NPO and Valhalla after the viceroy ended as a slap in the face. ODN looked for a new best friend and NpO welcomed them. I'm not sure what genius went looking for IRON, but I don't think anyone is refuting that mistake at this point. Two points. Past the Viceroyship, we were never under NPO control. Secondly, our business is none of your business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpoiL Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Two points. Past the Viceroyship, we were never under NPO control. Secondly, our business is none of your business. Three points. You were under direct NPO control during the Viceroy. Afterwards, you were under their influence. Granted, you probably chose to be-which contributes to why Orrple is where it is now..different Foreign Policy, Surely Legion was ODN's business. If you meant my personal business, then I say that any publicized announcement/thread becomes my business despite me being in ODN for a lengthy time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrrie Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 In all honesty, this treaty probably should have been canceled immediately after Purplegate, if not earlier. Glad to see it finally happened. No sense in being weighed down by a treaty that won't be upheld. Also, I really don't see how treaties with NPO and Valhalla after the Viceroyship were a slap in the face. Obtaining new friends is only an insult to the old friends if they let it be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twizzler Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I'm sorry. Did you ever read my response to your post? How does my pointing out your rubbish bring my post to your level? At least I am not afraid to state my opinion rather than trying to backhandedly cast blame elsewhere. Me thinks you doth protest to much. "ME?!?! WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?!? I NEVER SAID THE LEGION WAS RESPONSIBLE" (wink wink nudge nudge). Okay. So whose fault is it that the relationship failed? I'm not talking about any recent events because the relationship between the Legion and the ODN died a very long time ago. Tell me about how the ODN signed pacts with GOONS and let the Legion fall. It wasn't a blunder? The Legion placed the highest priority on ORRPLE and look where it got them. I certainly wouldn't call falling from the top spot and getting crushed into near oblivion while their allies stand on the sidelines a diplomatic breakthrough. The ODN bails on the Legion, then bails on GOONS, then bails on the NPO. Legion fell out of sanction, GOONS was disbanded and only very recently reformed, and the NPO is fighting what looks to be an eternal war. You aren't calling a treaty with the ODN a blunder? How cute. 1. Okay, so somehow saying "I do not solely blame Legion" (IE, stating my opinion) is somehow synonymous with being afraid to state my opinion and really means that I am throwing all the blame on Legion. Really, do tell me how that works. 2. Legion getting crushed from the top spot? You mean, GWIII? That big war that ODN fought in and got pummeled? Or, seeing as we like to take the exact opposite of what I say, I suppose that getting pummeled alongside them must mean standing on the sidelines. 3. I don't feel the need to go over purplegate. You feel one way, and I feel another about 'bailing on Legion'. There is no point in arguing over it, as neither one of us is going to change our minds about that. Secondly, I am oh so sorry about bailing on GOONS. You know, after demanding we kick out our founder under accusations of having another role here on the BBs and hacking our offsite forums, I just can't see any reason why ODN declared war on GOONS. It just doesn't make any kind of sense. I must be crazy. Also, I'm not entirely sure how we bailed on NPO. The last time ODN and NPO had any sort of almost relations was when Dilber was Emperor and there was discussion of signing an NAP. It never went through, and ODN and NPO have a long history together. We have never been friends, and sometimes we have not even held cordial relations. How can we bail on an alliance that we have been openly hostile with since the founding of our alliance? I'm not sure how that really went down either. As for where it got Legion, they currently have plenty of other treaties. I don't think you mean that since ORRPLE is gone, Legion is about to go under. They still have treaties, they still have Purple Unity, and they are working on climbing back into sanction capability. (IIRC, they are in 14th?) ORRPLE got them a fun and exciting time while it lasted, but now its time to move on. Relations have been dwindling as a result of BOTH parties. (Did I make that clear enough for you, or by both do I still mean its Legion's fault?) ORRPLE has been dead for a while, and its time to move on. They have a path to walk down, and so do we. If Legion is anything like Legion (oh wait, they are) they are a strong alliance that can get through this, and move on. That's exactly 'where it got them'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Style #386 Posted July 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Ill informed, how ironic when but 3 months ago you were coming to me for advice. Get your head out of your own over inflated ego and have a good long look at reality, maybe if you open your eyes wide enough you will see what a pitiful heap of cowards you associate yourself with. As for spinning I don't need to do any of that ODN embarrasses itself enough every time a war comes around. I just relish the opportunity to remind you how worthless you really are. We didn't embarrass ourselves nearly as much as IRON did. About five months or so ago, I did indeed ask you for advice. How this is relevent in any way or would serve to make you better informed of our history and reasoning, I do not know. As for your assertion that we are worthless cowards, I can assure you that I won't lose any sleep over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paint Your Target Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 People worrying about the Legions Future: have no fear, Vires Noctu has their backs PYT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cataduanes Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 --snip-- Still waiting to hear your considerable tales of heroic bravery MCRABT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 When's the last time you guys started negotiations for a treaty at the behest of the GA and against the wishes of the Sec Gen? Er.... Keep in mind that Secgen elections happen every two months, whereas for us the process of signing a new MDP level treaty takes at least 3-4 months (usually much longer). Secgens are elected on platforms primarily oriented around Foreign Affairs. As such, the conflict that you suggest really doesn't make sense. The GA elects Secretary Generals in order to execute their will in Foreign Affairs. Although it is hypothetically possible that such a thing could happen, in reality it has never came close to occurring. blah MCRABBLE strikes again! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE A treaty? Who said a treaty? You have followed whatever the dominant forces have wanted you to do. Perhaps it was a crude shortcut to say the NPO but it is essentially the same. Who attacked GOONS? Oh yeah the ODN was involved in ~. Who then attacked BLUE and others? Oh right! The ODN was part of it too. Do you notice the theme? How many times have you been on the winning side? Seems funny how many times it happens that even though just prior to the wars you seemed to be such good friends. Did you betray them before or after you gave them a huggle? You win some, you lose some. You seem to be less interested in facts (there are a number of alliances with better war records than us) or the well documented and widely understood reasons for our fighting on the sides that we have (you even try to act like we betrayed the Goon Order of Neutral Shoving ) than you are in simply bashing the ODN at every turn. This leads me to the conclusion that you are hopelessly driven by some sort of agenda. Fortunately, it appears that your posts are served with a blood-pressure-raising mountain of salt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gofastleft Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I can't speak for RnR or The International, but the Vanguard/ODN treaty would exist regardless of what Spheres our alliances inhabited. I can speak for R&R and will say that the R&R/ODN treaty would also exist no matter what sphere each alliance inhabited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paint Your Target Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Still waiting to hear your considerable tales of heroic bravery MCRABT I will say this CN: When all the ODNs members can boast the same loyalty and fighting calibre of Cataduanes, none here will dare to question them. I wish you, Cata, and the other ODN Senators the best of luck in restoring the name of my first home PYT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Glaucon Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 I'm always hoped Cata, Pingu, and a couple others would finally just leave The Network (as so many others have) and come play in the real world. *That* would be something to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denial Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 People worrying about the Legions Future: have no fear, Vires Noctu has their backs PYT. Oh, that's a relief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor Noldorin Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 Well this thread certainly turned out to be interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soccerbum Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 (edited) Did you hear that everyone? The ODN never betrayed you. They were just philosophizing in their intellectual world. We are really just slaves in a cave. The ODN makes motions but all we can see are the shadows. Oh if only we could see their deep and "multi-faceted" reality! Their actions, while looking crude and self serving are really so so much more. It's a pity really. I wanted for once an explanation for their seemingly random and flippant foreign policy. Please philosopher. Enlighten me. Why did you betray your allies so many times? Posting with an agenda only makes you look silly. For example: The ODN bails on the Legion, then bails on GOONS, then bails on the NPO. Legion fell out of sanction, GOONS was disbanded and only very recently reformed, and the NPO is fighting what looks to be an eternal war. You aren't calling a treaty with the ODN a blunder? How cute. Please, enlighten me. Where in our history have we ever signed a military pact with the New Pacific Order? Got your panties in a bunch? Perhaps you should read up on your history a bit before making any comment to us about ours. Many of us, after all, did live through those events (minus the whole NPO bit). Well this thread certainly turned out to be interesting. Quite. I wake up every morning and check to see how far it has progressed. It is both interesting and entertaining. Edited July 17, 2009 by soccerbum879 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cataduanes Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 I will say this CN: When all the ODNs members can boast the same loyalty and fighting calibre of Cataduanes, none here will dare to question them. I wish you, Cata, and the other ODN Senators the best of luck in restoring the name of my first home PYT. You flatter me Comrade I'm always hoped Cata, Pingu, and a couple others would finally just leave The Network (as so many others have) and come play in the real world. *That* would be something to see. Ahhh but nothing is more real than giving your all for community that everyone likes to kick, Comrade Pingu and i take our duty to ODN very seriously. Besides i have a responsibility to those that have trusted me enough to re-elect me in the last three terms of office ...also good to bump into you again Zombie B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCRABT Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 We didn't embarrass ourselves nearly as much as IRON did.About five months or so ago, I did indeed ask you for advice. How this is relevent in any way or would serve to make you better informed of our history and reasoning, I do not know. As for your assertion that we are worthless cowards, I can assure you that I won't lose any sleep over it. I would say that having worked closely with ODN officials for over 2 years I am pretty well up on your "history and reasoning". I have been the victim of ODN's woeful reasoning on multiple occasions. Still waiting to hear your considerable tales of heroic bravery MCRABT This one time at band camp.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dujek Onearm Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 I'm always hoped Cata, Pingu, and a couple others would finally just leave The Network (as so many others have) and come play in the real world. *That* would be something to see. Believe me, ODN is as real as it gets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cataduanes Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 This one time at band camp.... Oh man no need to continue, band camp gives me the shivers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petrovich4 Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 Much respect to ODN for overtly making the tough decisions rather then sitting down. Much respect to Lincongrad for keeping a cool head and being a respectful Legionnaire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayOvfEnnay Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 It's kind of cool that you are going to cancel a treaty instead of ignore it. I view this as an excellent step towards improving your foreign policy, and one that should be applauded. ICEBURN. Any way, whatever you say ODN. I'm going to refrain from my usual trolly self. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archon Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 This may have been said, as I've been distracted a few times staggering through these pages, but it is funny to see how distinct the division between ODN and Legion is. And who supports each. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Greenberg Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 (edited) It's kind of cool that you are going to cancel a treaty instead of ignore it. I view this as an excellent step towards improving your foreign policy, and one that should be applauded. Yes, at least we know now that the ODN won't betray the Legion. We can take them off the list.... Edited July 18, 2009 by Ryan Greenberg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadian Empire Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 I am saddened to hear this news... however it was inevitable especially due to the stances of both the alliances in the last war. But, if nothing else, I shall still have personal contact with ODN people via Liga Mundo in epic "Legion Senior Staff v. ODN Senators" derby matches! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cataduanes Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 (edited) Yes, at least we know now that the ODN won't betray the Legion. We can take them off the list.... Sigh.....Yes thats true from a certain point of view, many thanks for taking the time to point that out as i am pretty sure no one has made that point as of yet I am saddened to hear this news... however it was inevitable especially due to the stances of both the alliances in the last war. But, if nothing else, I shall still have personal contact with ODN people via Liga Mundo in epic "Legion Senior Staff v. ODN Senators" derby matches! hehe I will certainly be staying in Liga Mundo. Besides i know that many of us on both sides of the fence still have our personal bonds and that is something to smile about surely B) Edited July 18, 2009 by Cataduanes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
President S O Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 Sad to see. Nonetheless, best of luck to The Legion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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