Joint Poison Clan - iFOK Announcement

[shahenshah]

[quote name='Emphix' timestamp='1293132863' post='2551828']
So he properly resign and all, right? that's perfectly fine

But if, hypothetically, he attempt to rejoin WTF, like right after the war is over, will WTF accept him? is there any policy about things like that?

and I guess this question apply to whatever alliance with members ghosting NEW right now. Particularly PC, since more or less half of NEW's current, about 20, foreign fighters come from there.
[/quote]

Trying to enforce who can join or leave an uninvolved alliance would really take us all a step back.

Edited December 25, 2010 by shahenshah

[greenacres]

[quote name='Hyperion321' timestamp='1293227965' post='2552939']
Because Fark really expected PC to take advantage of their kindness right? This is underhanded manipulation of an agreement in good faith, and these rogues will be beaten to a pulp for it.
[/quote]

They're not rogues.

[Haflinger]

I do not think anyone here really wants to set a precedent that people joining an alliance during wartime should be considered rogues and given separate surrender terms.

This happens in every war. Heck MK did it in WotC. NPO didn't try to inflict any separate surrender terms on the volunteers that joined MK then.

[Havamil]

[quote name='Hyperion321' timestamp='1293227965' post='2552939']
Because Fark really expected PC to take advantage of their kindness right? This is underhanded manipulation of an agreement in good faith, and these rogues will be beaten to a pulp for it.
[/quote]
this really makes no sense, so its ok for fark to jump without a legitimate cb, folks take up the chase on them for there dishonorable action and you have issues with folks with a sense of loyalty, defending what they believe in. who are you again?

[Fluoroalien]

[quote name='ALFERALFER' timestamp='1293132080' post='2551814']
I moved from Farkistan to TF to TF![/quote]

Yeah, that's pretty much all we need to know about you.

Coward.

[Locke]

[quote name='Bob Janova' timestamp='1293220962' post='2552801']
As long as those nations have resigned properly and joined NEW, there is no reason to consider them 'rogues'.
[/quote]
Well, "resigned properly" is the issue here, I think. I seem to recall when FoB had a mass of members leave for PC, they actually stayed there, but more often than not such movements of nations are not permanent, and those who leave their alliances will find themselves re-instated at the same level of membership they held as soon as they rejoin; that is why they are considered ghosts and rogues. If they're actually in it as a member of NEW and not a proxy of their real alliance, there shouldn't be an issue, as in the aforementioned FoB/PC instance.

[Artigo]

I don't see how members = rouges

edit: [quote name='Batallion' timestamp='1293229827' post='2552962']
Creole answered the call apparently. This should be interesting
[/quote]

Where?

Edited December 24, 2010 by Artigo

[Havamil]

[quote name='Artigo' timestamp='1293233777' post='2553049']
I don't see how members = rouges
[/quote]
Depends on how the desperate play it out in the end

[Jocko Homo]

I don't think calling them rogues is accurate. If you must call them [i]something[/i] then I think "[b]Illegal Combatants[/b]" fits best. And while I admire those who joined up with NEW to help them in their time of need, IMO doing so pretty much negated FARK's self imposed restriction on it's allies joining the fight. If NEW's allies (regardless of whatever they want to call themselves) come to the aid of NEW then Farks allies are free to do the same.

Edited December 24, 2010 by Jocko Homo

[Havamil]

[quote name='Jocko Homo' timestamp='1293234043' post='2553060']
I don't think calling them rogues is accurate. If you must call them [i]something[/i] then I think "[b]Illegal Combatants[/b]" fits best. And while I admire those who joined up with NEW to help them in their time of need, IMO doing so pretty much negated FARK's self imposed restriction on it's allies joining the fight. If NEW's allies (regardless of whatever they want to call themselves) come to the aid of NEW then Farks allies are free to do the same.
[/quote]
It seems most of the folks joining up are the old school that originally signed the treaty,that the new school has thrown aside, is that so wrong? And fark has no business in this to begin with

[Artigo]

[quote name='Jocko Homo' timestamp='1293234043' post='2553060']
I don't think calling them rogues is accurate. If you must call them [i]something[/i] then I think "Illegal Combatants" fits best. And while I admire those who joined up with NEW to help them in their time of need, IMO doing so pretty much negated FARK's self imposed restriction on it's allies joining the fight. [b]If NEW's allies (regardless of whatever they want to call themselves) come to the aid of NEW then Farks allies are free to do the same.[/b]
[/quote]

If under FARK's banner, then I agree.

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='Jocko Homo' timestamp='1293234043' post='2553060']
I don't think calling them rogues is accurate. If you must call them [i]something[/i] then I think "[b]Illegal Combatants[/b]" fits best.[/quote]

I was thinking of something more along the lines of 'Foreign Legion' or 'International Brigade'. 'Illegal Combatants' still implies that they're doing something wrong.

[Timmmehhh]

[quote name='Cataduanes' timestamp='1293230821' post='2552971']
Totally agree with this, volunteers joining up in a war is not exactly a new thing In CN...it has happened on countless occasions. I for one do not consider any such volunteers rogues and so on, they are individuals following their instincts and putting their pixels on the line for what they believe in...

[center]Volunteers of the NEW, FARK and anyone else: I Salute you.[/center]
[/quote]
Still love you Cata

[Jocko Homo]

[quote name='Artigo' timestamp='1293234364' post='2553068']If under FARK's banner, then I agree.[/quote]

So if an entire 300 man alliance mass joined the conflict but all of them changed their AA to FARK then that's fine? I don't think so, that's just semantics and it's silly.

Don't get me wrong, I've left an alliance I was in in the past and changed my AA to another who was getting hit just to help defend them because I thought our leaders were weaseling out on our treaty and abandoning an ally in their time of need, pretty much exactly the same as whats going in here. I don't blame them, I respect them, but I also know they are not "real" members of NEW and have entered the conflict outside of normal paths.

[Jocko Homo]

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' timestamp='1293235435' post='2553083']
I was thinking of something more along the lines of 'Foreign Legion' or 'International Brigade'. 'Illegal Combatants' still implies that they're doing something wrong.
[/quote]

I'm not saying they are doing anything wrong, I am just saying it is a more accurate term than Rogues. Keep in mind, I am talking about how I think their [i]opponents[/i] should be referring to them, not as how they see themselves (freedom fighters & NEW members) or how the community as a whole will see and refer to them.

One mans Illegal Combatant is another mans Freedom Fighter.
One mans Spy is another mans War Hero

Edited December 25, 2010 by Jocko Homo

[greenacres]

[quote name='Fluoroalien' timestamp='1293232855' post='2553014']
Yeah, that's pretty much all we need to know about you.

Coward.
[/quote]

You need to let old grudges go. TF! is long dead, and TPF is a shell of it's former self. You won, so celebrate, let go of the old grudges.

[Chalaskan]

[quote name='Timmehhh' timestamp='1293228857' post='2552951']
We are not "rogues" we are people who were friends with NEW and who decided join them because they needed help. Every nation who joined NEW is in it on their own accord and decided for themselves if they wanted to join NEW. There is no conspiracy here or plan from any PB alliance to bring nations over to NEW.
[/quote]

The #1 nation in Fark has joined them today from another alliance. Conspirators are everywhere!

[Sephiroth]

[quote name='Chalaskan' timestamp='1293240009' post='2553146']
The #1 nation in Fark has joined them today from another alliance. Conspirators are everywhere!
[/quote]
I see nothing wrong with both sides recruiting new members who want to help with their war effort, that's always been part of war.

[Cataduanes]

[quote name='Timmehhh' timestamp='1293235461' post='2553084']
Still love you Cata
[/quote]
Likewise Timmehhh, likewise

[sigelopisan]

Seeing some ex.Créole and Guru Order who ghost at FARK is really something.

I mean, honestly, fighting with Twisted, Zoom, Tim, ALF and others is super awesome.
Not to mention those nations have casualties less than me.

Looks like some big-fat-boy try to hit Jacky Chan.

FARK shouldnt try to "desperately" bring in anyone with high NS to help their high tier.
You guys are more than capable to know this situation.
It didnt fair for them, to asked them to fight those Jacky Chans. Its a murderer. You shoudnt do this to your friends.

[abdur]

[quote name='sigelopisan' timestamp='1293244797' post='2553217']
-snip-
[/quote]
But... but... it wont be as big of a curbstomp as they would have liked.... 4:1 isnt good enough. Better odds are needed.

[Enzos]

[quote name='abdur' timestamp='1293246225' post='2553234']
But... but... it wont be as big of a curbstomp as they would have liked.... 4:1 isnt good enough. Better odds are needed.
[/quote]


Couldn't agree with you more, we at Sparta have been waiting forever, Bob dissapointed me

[Sephiroth]

[quote name='Jocko Homo' timestamp='1293234043' post='2553060']
I don't think calling them rogues is accurate. If you must call them [i]something[/i] then I think "[b]Illegal Combatants[/b]" fits best. And while I admire those who joined up with NEW to help them in their time of need, IMO doing so pretty much negated FARK's self imposed restriction on it's allies joining the fight. If NEW's allies (regardless of whatever they want to call themselves) come to the aid of NEW then Farks allies are free to do the same.
[/quote]
I agree both should be free to use the same tactics here, which in this case seems to be recruiting new members during war, something I see nothing wrong with. If someone wants to join an alliance under attack, I think those are the most honorable conditions someone can join an alliance. Sacrificing their own nations to help an ally is something to be respected.

[Dochartaigh]

[quote name='abdur' timestamp='1293246225' post='2553234']
But... but... it wont be as big of a curbstomp as they would have liked.... 4:1 isnt good enough. Better odds are needed.
[/quote]

hahahaha, you do realize that PC/iFOK agreed to this (not sure who actually proposed the idea). so how about stop blaming one side for it being a curbstomp when PC/iFOK could have stopped it at anytime from being a curbstomp.

[Monster]

[quote name='Timmehhh' timestamp='1293228857' post='2552951']
We are not "rogues" we are people who were friends with NEW and who decided join them because they needed help. Every nation who joined NEW is in it on their own accord and decided for themselves if they wanted to join NEW. There is no conspiracy here or plan from any PB alliance to bring nations over to NEW.
[/quote]

This is what I don't get. All NEW had to do was apologize and pay minor reps. They don't need anyone's help, they just need to help themselves.