Ninja Election Announcement

[JT Jag]

[quote name='xoindotnler' timestamp='1285795558' post='2468715']
I think you should feel pretty much ashamed when that happens really. You are worse than the worst thing we knew.
[/quote]No, we really aren't, but you guys like to paint it that way (perhaps because some of you didn't get closure over the old GOONS and you like to transfer that aggression to us).

Nothing that we have done in our 16-month-odd existence justifies the bizarre amount of vitriol that is hurled at us. But hey, whatever, the people we care about are closer to us than ever and that's all that matters.

[Gamemaster1]

[quote name='potato' timestamp='1285794676' post='2468691']
I get being a good ally is a foreign concept to you but seriously?
[/quote]
Did ya quote the wrong post by accident? Because that had [i]nothing[/i] to do with my post.

Maybe if I asked it in a question you might understand it easier: Why are you calling an established alliance rogues?

And this post obviously isn't complete, it's lacking a potshot at your AA. ....Nah.

[Diogenes]

[quote name='Gamemaster1' timestamp='1285793806' post='2468676']
Funny how MK jumps so quickly to call an established alliance rogues. I guess it's just easier to deal with if you don't treat it like an [i]actual[/i] war.
[/quote]

It's almost as though they literally are rogues!

[The MVP]

[quote name='Gamemaster1' timestamp='1285795933' post='2468728']
Did ya quote the wrong post by accident? Because that had [i]nothing[/i] to do with my post.

Maybe if I asked it in a question you might understand it easier: Why are you calling an established alliance rogues?

And this post obviously isn't complete, it's lacking a potshot at your AA. ....Nah.
[/quote]

Ignore him, he's still stuck on the concept that anyone from a certain side of the MDP web sucks at honoring treaties forever and all eternity from here until the hour of death.. Amen.

[ROMMELHSQ]

[quote name='Yevgeni Luchenkov' timestamp='1285790036' post='2468589']
-The Ninjas are an alliance and people should show the common courtesy to at least issue a DoW on them if they're going to attack.
[/quote]
If I read this correctly, then maybe you should tell that to your friends and allies

[CRexx]

[quote name='Quiziotle' timestamp='1285795970' post='2468730']
It's almost as though they literally are rogues!
[/quote]

That's harsh man. I prefer the term legitimacy challenged.

[ktarthan]

[quote name='Egwaterboy61' timestamp='1285795156' post='2468705']
This really leads me to my bigger point about mutual [i]respect[/i]. If the GOONS can tech raid an established 10 man alliance without interference from outside sources, why can't an established 10 man alliance tech raid the GOONS without interference from outside sources? In the same regard, if we have to give a DoW to GOONS to be deemed "serious aggressor" (and so does the rest of CN), then why don't GOONS' allies gives us the same?
[/quote]
To your first question - this situation is not being treated differently at all.

If GOONS raids a 10-man alliance and there is outside interference, we will deal with that outside interference in a way that we see fit.

In this case with a 10-man alliance "raiding" GOONS, there is outside interference, and you can deal with that interference in any way that you see fit.

In either case, outside interference is not prohibited. It's just that in this case, due to the situation, you have far fewer options at your disposal.

As to your second question, I can't tell you. I went to ask them but their door was locked and all I could hear from behind the door was an awful screeching noise. Perhaps I'll try later!

[Arcturus Jefferson]

[quote name='Quiziotle' timestamp='1285795970' post='2468730']
It's almost as though they literally are rogues!
[/quote]
MK's got a senator, right? Get cracking!

[Egwaterboy61]

[quote name='Lord Gobb' timestamp='1285795870' post='2468725']
I'm guessing because that 10-man alliance GOONS raids doesn't have any treaties/friends.
[/quote]

Hmmm....Well I guess that sucks for them!

[TrotskysRevenge]

[quote name='JT Jag' timestamp='1285795891' post='2468726']
No, we really aren't, but you guys like to paint it that way (perhaps because some of you didn't get closure over the old GOONS and you like to transfer that aggression to us).

Nothing that we have done in our 16-month-odd existence justifies the bizarre amount of vitriol that is hurled at us. But hey, whatever, the people we care about are closer to us than ever and that's all that matters.
[/quote]



I don't necessarily have problem with GOONS (beyond the Red Raiding Safari) but I do have a problem with what you are doing around this 12-man alliance; you could easily have taken them on your own without any outside help. Like NSO did, you should have asked your allies to stay out of it.

[Beefspari]

[quote name='xoindotnler' timestamp='1285795558' post='2468715']
I think you should feel pretty much ashamed when that happens really. You are worse than the worst thing we knew.
[/quote]
This is going in my sig right the hell now.

[Chaoshawk]

[quote name='TrotskysRevenge' timestamp='1285796708' post='2468752']


I don't necessarily have problem with GOONS (beyond the Red Raiding Safari) but I do have a problem with what you are doing around this 12-man alliance; you could easily have taken them on your own without any outside help. Like NSO did, you should have asked your allies to stay out of it.
[/quote]
The difference is that NSO (and allies that could help) were in a losing position and GOONs is not.

Edited September 29, 2010 by Chaoshawk

[Egwaterboy61]

[quote name='ktarthan' timestamp='1285796401' post='2468740']
To your first question - this situation is not being treated differently at all.

If GOONS raids a 10-man alliance and there is outside interference, we will deal with that outside interference in a way that we see fit.

In this case with a 10-man alliance "raiding" GOONS, there is outside interference, and you can deal with that interference in any way that you see fit.

In either case, outside interference is not prohibited. It's just that in this case, due to the situation, you have far fewer options at your disposal.[/quote]

So might makes right, is what your saying? and I don't mean to put words in your mouth, I honestly want to understand your side of things.

To me, your logic says that because a small 10 man alliance has little to no "muscle" it shouldn't be treated the same as GOONS?

To me, I feel The Ninjas deserve the same exact treatment as GOONS. That includes a DoW. Just because we are small, does *not* mean we deserve less.

[xoindotnler]

[quote name='Beefspari' timestamp='1285796911' post='2468755']
This is going in my sig right the hell now.
[/quote]
My life is complete now.

[JT Jag]

[quote name='TrotskysRevenge' timestamp='1285796708' post='2468752']


I don't necessarily have problem with GOONS (beyond the Red Raiding Safari) but I do have a problem with what you are doing around this 12-man alliance; you could easily have taken them on your own without any outside help. Like NSO did, you should have asked your allies to stay out of it.
[/quote]In the end, it's all about winning. By falling on their sword and not getting their allies involved, NSO and their friends ended up stronger as a group for it than they would have if they had been drawn into a world war. That's a win, even if NSO suffered in the short term.

By allowing our treaty partners and good friends to jump in, we come out in long term in a much better position even if in the short term we suffer some OWF stigma from "not fighting honourably". That's a win.

Of all people you should understand this concept.

[Lord Fingolfin]

[quote name='delendum' timestamp='1285741578' post='2467982']
It really doesn't phase me one way or the other, you can call them an ALLIANCE, but their action is that of going rogue. Your examples aren't really worth getting into, they're too stretched.
[/quote]

They're an alliance, perhaps it needs to be said a few more times. Since when does declaring on an alliance qualify you as going rogue? Did MK go rogue when they declared on WAPA in the Shark War?


[quote name='Sardonic' timestamp='1285762018' post='2468189']
Alright since there's apparently some debate on this issue I'll spell it out. We consider the Ninjas an alliance, not a very good alliance, but an alliance nonetheless.

Even still, I hope you guys realize what you've gotten yourselves into, if you truly do not intend to disband. We are not the type to say live and let live and grant white peace. We are going to be fighting you for a very, very long time, and when we're finally ready to entertain the notion of peace, you're going to be paying us for a very, very long time.
[/quote]

I'm rather puzzled as to what qualifies you to say that they are aren't a very good alliance. GOONS is hardly a paragon of excellence and everything that is to be aspired to as an alliance. Are you really so butthurt that they actually put their money where their mouth is and called your bluff to attack you, that you've decided to designate them "not very good".

Practically every CB in CN boils down to "I don't like you". Saying that someone spied on you, or plotted espionage against you, or threatened your security, or attacked your allies/your interests, is merely the [i]justification[/i] for why you don't like them. I don't like you because you did me/my allies harm, so now I'm going to attack you. The Ninja's CB is as valid as any other, and after GOONS telling The Ninja's to attack them for days on end, they are in no position to complain about it. On that matter, I haven't seen GOONS complaining, and props to them for that, lots of other people have though, and I would appreciate it if you would kindly stop your delusional ramblings.

Keep on trucking along GOONS, be the big man, be the bad guys, have fun with it. When it comes around to bite you in the ass, I'll be waiting. Never thought I'd say that I wish Electron Sponge or Almighty Grub was still in power, especially after how I watched Grub basically destroy my world after he pulled his betrayal in the last war. But at least he had cajones, and he would have already declared upon and destroyed GOONS. Lets see if anyone else has the strength of character to follow suit

[wiccan high priest]

so lets see

ninjas declare war on GOONS.

goons a 278 nation alliance VS a 10 nation alliance. be it alliance of raiders or a legit alliance they were still just 10 nations vs 278 nations.

AND YOU NEEDED HELP?

[Beefspari]

[quote name='Lord Fingolfin' timestamp='1285797506' post='2468767']
I'm rather puzzled as to what qualifies you to say that they are aren't a very good alliance. GOONS is hardly a paragon of excellence and everything that is to be aspired to as an alliance.[/quote]
Well, they did cancel their treaty with VE without the wait period so they could declare on friends of VE.

[JT Jag]

Grub in charge for a while when we were young and vulnerable, and he didn't do anything then.

And he certainly wouldn't do anything now that we're in a better position, politically and militarily, than ever.

[ktarthan]

[quote name='Egwaterboy61' timestamp='1285797026' post='2468758']
So might makes right, is what your saying? and I don't mean to put words in your mouth, I honestly want to understand your side of things.

To me, your logic says that because a small 10 man alliance has little to no "muscle" it shouldn't be treated the same as GOONS?
[/quote]
Replace "shouldn't be" with "isn't", and you'd be a lot closer.

If GOONS is raiding a member of a 10 member alliance, and another AA (or even other members on the same AA) decides to join in and attack GOONS, we aren't just going to sit there and take the attack. We will likely counter. I think that's fairly common sense.

In that same light, I don't think any of the alliances that have assisted us by hitting TN expect you to just sit there and take the attacks. You're free to respond in any way you choose.

10-man AA raiding 300, or 300-man AA raiding 10, outside interference is just as valid. The difference is in the response you can expect.

[Egwaterboy61]

[quote name='Beefspari' timestamp='1285797764' post='2468776']
Well, they did cancel their treaty with VE without the wait period so they could declare on friends of VE.
[/quote]

If you actually had spoken to VE you'd understand *why* we canceled the wait period.

If we had attacked GOONS without canceling immediately on VE, VE would have been forced to enter the conflict. We did not want them in our mess, as it was hard enough to break our decision to them.

I thought this was a good thing?

[SoADarthCyfe6]

Beauty at its finest. I support The Ninja's all the way in this. A fine show of courage honor. Go get 'em guys!

[JT Jag]

[quote name='Egwaterboy61' timestamp='1285797897' post='2468779']
If you actually had spoken to VE you'd understand *why* we canceled the wait period.

If we had attacked GOONS without canceling immediately on VE, VE would have been forced to enter the conflict.
[/quote]Why? Did you have a mutual aggression clause with them?

[IAMCRAIG]

[quote name='nutkase' timestamp='1285772799' post='2468321']
wow first time I see some serious balls from a GOONS nation, even when I get down to your range your nation would be no match for mine which is something I am guessing you already know.. If that did come about, you would hold my highest regards within GOONS.
[/quote]

Is that a no?

[wiccan high priest]

Nutkase and I have had a few issues in the past but, I do have to take my hat off to him. Ninjas fight the good fight.