The topic you've all been waiting for

[H2BKs]

Clearly it's that they lack any indication on them regarding if they are regular cupcakes or gluten free and/or dairy free. 
 
Actually I'm fairly certain that it has more to do with Cuba (and the rest of DBDC) being mad because CT is a former member who has become a traitor.  I can't think of a single alliance, including World Task Force frankly, that doesn't have an issue with traitors.  The difference here is that DBDC and WTF are already at war, which admittedly removes the bargaining power of DBDC regarding why WTF should not accept him.  However, it doesn't encourage friendly discussions.

Friendly discussions? Really dude xD

Nobody wants friendly discussions with alliances who attack another alliance without a cause. I don't see CT as a traitor at all. He went to defend an innocent alliance targeted by DBDC which he also used to be a member of. Clearly he had stronger ties with WTF than the entire DBDC.

If all, I see CT fighting for WTF as an honorable action.

[The Zigur]

Ok so let's review this.

Cuba is mad because CT was accepted while he was at war right?

Here we have Supa_Land, a triumvir of DT who attacked WTF and he was accepted back right after.

http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=45998


Oh look! Mos Risley from Umbrella!! He was accepted into umbrella while still at war

http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=84738


So Cuba, please stop whinning how CT took 7k of your tech and was accepted into WTF! You've turned out to be soo weak and cry so much

Lol, this really says alot.

[Starfox101]

 

I stand corrected.

 

Honestly? I have stopped looking at how people self-identify on this forum. Too many times I've been fooled by people who were just too lazy to change their AA.

 

Mea culpa.

 

 

 

OK, if I tell you that the first thing I thought of saying when I read this was, "Brains! Brains!" will you believe it's me?

 

 

 

I can't speak to the 'ultimately prove to be WTF's downfall' part, but otherwise I agree completely.

 

And I'll tell YOU this since for some reason Starfox seems to think I'm somehow in thrall to you.

 

I don't get what the hell you're doing, and I don't approve, but since it doesn't particularly affect me I don't care. Just don't come after the alliance I belong to and we'll be fine. But as you say, for some guy who's launching a moral crusade against you to join an alliance and then to be accepted is....foolish.

 

Some folks like to talk about 'established norms' of behavior and the like. But for some reason they fail to recognize those established norms when it involves someone at war with an alliance they dislike. That's fine. But they can't complain when someone like me comes along and points out the inconsistency. (Actually, they can complain and will complain, and it will forever piss me off.)

 

This kind of !@#$ drives me crazy.

 

So back to me.

 

Maybe the way I think is 'very 2009'. If so, I'm a-OK with that. Anyone is welcome to go back and read every pronouncement that came out of NoR while I was leading it, and then see if there were any substantive criticisms of my actions. Actually, let me save folks some time. There weren't any.

 

I'm the same person now that I was then. If the world has changed, then....well, it's changed. Big deal. I'm still the same.  I may be one of the few folks left who actually means what he says. I also say what I mean, regardless of who I'm speaking to. In the world that currently exists, this is something of a rarity. I continue to hold that it's a-OK to tell someone to go to Hell, provided you do so in such a way that they look forward to the trip. (Unless they're a dolt or an ideologue, in which case they don't get the travel brochure.)

 

I also haven't served in any kind of governmental role for several years. Anyone who thinks I speak on behalf of Nordreich or that I am somehow privy to secret conversations is sadly mistaken. I'm just a random guy who once mattered. So calling me ill-informed (as Polaris' comical Emperor has done) is a bit foolish. I know only what's been reported. If folks haven't reported the whole truth, the fault doesn't lie with me. Try telling the whole truth sometime.

 

You people are exasperating.

This is just an utterly nonsensical argument when you realize what's going on. DBDC holds dual membership with numerous alliances who right away accept them back into government positions after attacking neutrals, or other alliances without any justification. Why you've never complained about that, but are here to complain about CT basically makes you a complete hypocrite.

 

Also, everyone does what you said makes you one of a kind these days. It's not rare. Everyone is jaded.

[hapapants]

This is just an utterly nonsensical argument when you realize what's going on. DBDC holds dual membership with numerous alliances who right away accept them back into government positions after attacking neutrals, or other alliances without any justification. Why you've never complained about that, but are here to complain about CT basically makes you a complete hypocrite.

 

Also, everyone does what you said makes you one of a kind these days. It's not rare. Everyone is jaded.

 

I don't think kingzog is arguing about the relative morality of WTF's actions (accepting CT, etc) as compared to DBDC's (dual-membership nations).  

 

He's arguing that WTF is making a politically/diplomatically bad decision.  By accepting CT, they've turned this into a deeply personal conflict while opening the doors for DBDC's allies to escalate things.  And whatever side one holds in this conflict, I think they'd find this argument difficult to dispute.   

[the rebel]

He's arguing that WTF is making a politically/diplomatically bad decision.  By accepting CT, they've turned this into a deeply personal conflict while opening the doors for DBDC's allies to escalate things.  And whatever side one holds in this conflict, I think they'd find this argument difficult to dispute.

So you're suggesting DBDC have bitten off more they can chew so would call in allies? Because we all know how the peanut gallery loves to laugh at that when it happens.

[hapapants]

So you're suggesting DBDC have bitten off more they can chew so would call in allies? Because we all know how the peanut gallery loves to laugh at that when it happens.

 

How have I suggested that?

 

Regardless, your amusement isn't a factor in political decision-making.  

[the rebel]

How have I suggested that?
 
Regardless, your amusement isn't a factor in political decision-making.  

You're the one talking of DBDC allies coming in not me. So yes I find it funny that you would suggest that.

[arentak]

It would be interesting if it escalated.  WTF is a deep alliance.  While the battle may mostly involve its top guys, they have a lot of nations in mid tier too.  And in a way, losing your NS fighting neutrals is like losing your NS in a black hole, it doesn't matter.  You don't gain an edge over an adversary when you lose NS that way.  So, I don't see that happening. 

[Starfox101]

 

I don't think kingzog is arguing about the relative morality of WTF's actions (accepting CT, etc) as compared to DBDC's (dual-membership nations).  

 

He's arguing that WTF is making a politically/diplomatically bad decision.  By accepting CT, they've turned this into a deeply personal conflict while opening the doors for DBDC's allies to escalate things.  And whatever side one holds in this conflict, I think they'd find this argument difficult to dispute.   

You miss the point, however. Why would anyone waste their time saying WTF was wrong in accepting CT while ignoring and never commenting a thing about DBDC's actions?

[CubaQuerida]

You miss the point, however. Why would anyone waste their time saying WTF was wrong in accepting CT while ignoring and never commenting a thing about DBDC's actions?

It doesn't matter which alliance took him in.  CT is going to be unwelcome everywhere for the betrayal he pulled.  Will alliances that align against DBDC take him in, probably.  Should they expect it will end well, lol, no.  Ultimately it's WTF's problem until he's cast off.

[Starfox101]

So you're telling me you are going to put CT in PZI? Good luck enforcing that one.

[The Zigur]

It doesn't matter which alliance took him in.  CT is going to be unwelcome everywhere for the betrayal he pulled.  Will alliances that align against DBDC take him in, probably.  Should they expect it will end well, lol, no.  Ultimately it's WTF's problem until he's cast off.

Lol I just love these eternal statements Cuba always bandies about.

[hapapants]

You're the one talking of DBDC allies coming in not me. So yes I find it funny that you would suggest that.

 

How funny do you find it?  Does it merely tickle you pink?  Or perhaps it has resulted in a full-bellied laugh?

 

It is important for me to know these things, as I will consult your humor in the future before I make decisions for my alliance. 

 

 

You miss the point, however. Why would anyone waste their time saying WTF was wrong in accepting CT while ignoring and never commenting a thing about DBDC's actions?

 

You are misinterpreting what "wrong" means in the context of kingzog's argument.  He isn't arguing that WTF is "morally" wrong, or that DBDC isn't hypocritical - those are arguments are a waste of time and the rest of you are free to melt your brains over such things.

 

What he's arguing is that WTF worsened their political position by unnecessarily by accepting CT into their alliance.  And I don't understand why it is a waste of time to independently analyze the merits of such decisions.  

 

So for illustrative purposes, do you think that DBDC's actions amount to "bad" decisions?  Are their actions worsening their military or political decision more than helping it?  (This is of course, rhetorical, but you're welcome to answer it.)

 

That frame of analysis is where the argument is taking place.  If you want to take it somewhere else, that is your prerogative, but don't accuse people of "missing the point" when you pull an argumentative bait-and-switch.  

Edited February 13, 2015 by hapapants

[Unknown Smurf]

I highly doubt WTF cares that they worsened their political position.

[Starfox101]

Worsened political position? According to whom? It's abundantly clear that a great majority of alliances do not care for this attack on WTF, nor do they care about DBDC's grudge against CT for turning on them. There are those who will flow with whatever DBDC wants and WTF was already in a bad position with them. Nothing has changed post-CT-acceptance. It is moronic to assume WTF is a politically unskilled alliance for responding to an unjust attack with aggression, and accepting a member who is already attacking DBDC and inflicting pretty heavy damage.

 

I'm sorry, I understand you would prefer WTF lie down and take it. I don't understand why you attempt to spin accepting a "mercenary" as a bad political move. CT is a wild card, yes. However, CT and WTF were both already at war with DBDC. Their marriage changes nothing and is a matter of convenience for two people with the same motive.

 

Keep pretending WTF are the bad guys here, though. Perhaps one day Doom Squad will become a seperate entity and stop being DBDC cheerleaders. Until then, your opinions are going to be viewed the way they should be - incredibly biased, with little ground in reality.

[Asa Phillips]

What he's arguing is that WTF worsened their political position by unnecessarily by accepting CT into their alliance.

 

 

I highly doubt WTF cares that they worsened their political position.

This.

 

Where in the blue blazes has anyone ever gotten the idea what WTF cares about politics or political position at all? Does the fact that WTF purposely excludes itself from the political realm of CN still become lost to anyone anymore?

 

I'll just leave this tid bit here. Since it seems to be hotly debated. WTF regards Bones, who is a former member, as someone we respect and whose opinion we value... someone who we made sure was ok with the CT/SPATR matter that was going on when CT was accepted. I personally consider Bones as someone I genuinely give a CN crap about, he's a good guy and genuine in his intentions. CT and SPATR would soon after make peace all around as you can see by CTs war history.

 

Edited February 13, 2015 by Asa Phillips

[wes the wise]

WTF is simply defending themselves from an unprovoked attack, what could be more respectable than that?

I don't think WTF cares about any "Weakened political position". They were already at war with DBDC, not by their choice, defending against blatant aggression. By their words, they don't seem exctited to make peace with DBDC at any point in the near future. So really by accepting CT They had little to lose. It is DBDC, in fact, who has weakened their poltical position. ;)

[The Zigur]

Nihilism in its purest, most destructive form is a terrible thing to behold. It will destroy its enemies, then it will destroy its friends, and when nothing else is left, it will destroy itself.

[PrMn]

Yep. :popcorn:

[thespindoctor]

As our little tiff with DBDC continues, I know you have all been waiting to hear about DDC warchests. So here are a few of them, others will follow when we remember to do it :-)

 

Condolences to DBDC member Desconistan who looks like being in bill lock quite soon.

 

Umayyad Caliphate 10bil

Glenfeld 1.3bil

The 907 4.9bil
Desconistan 0.3bil
Borgsters 5.1bil
DPRK 6.6bil
Israelestine 6.4bil
Valnain 14bil
Wilmark Republic 2.4bil
Supa LaNd 5.2bil

[Isolatar]

For a moment, I felt sorry for DBDC

[berbers]

hrmm, most of those warchests seem adequate for the 1-2 rounds DBDC usually has someone in range lol :P

 

I am a bit surprised at Bean's though, figured he'd have more

[christian trojans]

Hey guys :)

 

Sorry i havent messaged here for a while but i was banned from even viewing these forums.

 

Erm, just a few things i would like to say.

 

Thank you to everyone who has been messaging me in game sending your support :D Its appreciated! I will contnue to fight for my friends at WTF. They did not deserve to be attacked, i have friends in WTF so i helped them. I have always said that if i leave this game i will leave it after attacking some nations i dont like, so i am content with my decision. But 1 thing is for sure i have a war chest that will last at least 3-4 months so i will not be leaving any time soon  :war:

 

Its funny how the crying tyrant keeps whinging about me joining WTF while at war. My issue with SPATR is a totally seperate matter and has nothing to do with WTF. I hope that SPATR and i can have peace so that i can concentrate on my wars with DBDC. But just fyi i will nuke everyone who declares on me.

 

Also Cuba regularly is accepting new nations into the aa to fight a round whothen flee back to their orginal aa to rebuy nukes and collect who then return to DBDC to fight again. Cuba you are a massive hypocrit.

 

I would just like to say how proud i am of WTF for fighting back so hard. I have not heard anyone whining about this war yet. All i have heard is words of bravery and great fighting spirit.

 

BTW in my war vs cuba the crying tyrant i took a massive 92,000 nation strength away from him, this is over 10% of his entire size. This loss was made up of over 14,000 infra, over 7,000 tech and about 10,000 land as shown below.

 

Infrastructure: 14,068

Tech : 7,123

Land : 9,844

 

Cuba is very beatable right now, with a low WC a broken spirit he is about to crack. If anyone wants to get revenge on cuba now is the time. He is drenched in tears and losing NS fast!

 

Thak you for your time

 

CT

Edited February 18, 2015 by christian trojans

[Mogar]

considering half of his NS is just land, all it would take is two months of offensive wars against him with high tech level nations, of course that would also mean nations in range willing to burn themselves down far more than what they would do for that one round.

[cverf]

I can only imagine how much Cuba has cried losing all that tech. No one in CN loves his stats more than that coward. HAHA, good luck trying to catch up to Dulra.

 

o/ CT