Legio Frigidum

[Scorbolt]

[quote name='skrewer' timestamp='1292296259' post='2539071']
Well I can only hope that people such as yourself (individuals that have been here a while) will take this opportunity and take a step back from the preconceived (and rather outdated) conclusion concerning the Legion and its ability to function as an alliance and begin to recognize the signs of an alliance actively providing for its members
[/quote]

Our conclusions are not preconceived. That would indicate they were formed [i]prior[/i] to the evidence upon which they are based.

The notion that Legion is a decent and functioning alliance would actually be the preconceived one.

[Chief Savage Man]

[quote name='Mirreille' timestamp='1292313563' post='2539361']
I'm curious who this remark was directed at; Polar? Legion? Both? Or was it intended to be cryptic from the start?

For months people have been saying,"Someone do something interesting, shake things up!". Now as soon as someone does, all they do is complain. I am curious to see where this treaty leads events down the road.
[/quote]

This is like when some party-goers wish the party would stop being so dull and one guy's response is to get hammered and drive his car into the living room. It's certainly interesting but you should still laugh at the guy for being a moron.

[Shoofly]

[quote name='Yankees Empire' timestamp='1292311149' post='2539340']
You could say the same for many alliances. And I don't hate Legion, I was just making a joke at their expense
[/quote]

You know what? I love ODN. You guys were the best for ever-so-long. And I think that a "perfect storm" of coincidences and an "unfortunately unlucky" bunch of leaders spoiled the party we had for years.

This may sound sentimental, this may sound trite, but I really really truly wish for a time when we are friends again, treaty web be damned.

[Zombie Glaucon]

[quote name='Shoofly' timestamp='1292315269' post='2539374']
You know what? I love ODN. You guys were the best for ever-so-long. And I think that a "perfect storm" of coincidences and an "unfortunately unlucky" bunch of leaders spoiled the party we had for years.

This may sound sentimental, this may sound trite, but I really really truly wish for a time when we are friends again, treaty web be damned.
[/quote]

First step back would be to have a little foreign exchange party. Get to know each other!

[Cataduanes]

[quote name='Zombie Glaucon' timestamp='1292309491' post='2539328']
Remember when you guys were best friends, and you hung them out to dry? I do.

Also, I would have chosen Riiiiiight.
[/quote]
Yeah I do remember and I would contend that the best friends status was already very strained (if not close to death) at that point. One has to take into account the leadership and its respective agendas in both alliances at the time. Both Legion and ODN are not the same outfits that they were back then.

[quote name='Shoofly' timestamp='1292315269' post='2539374']
You know what? I love ODN. You guys were the best for ever-so-long. And I think that a "perfect storm" of coincidences and an "unfortunately unlucky" bunch of leaders spoiled the party we had for years.

This may sound sentimental, this may sound trite, but I really really truly wish for a time when we are friends again, treaty web be damned.
[/quote]
And trust me there are some present day and ex-ODNistas that have always held a sentimental torch for Legion, I for one still look back to the Orrple days with some fondness despite the fact that treaty ultimately failed one or another (for which both sides are to blame). I for one always felt a profound sadness at the way ODN and Legion's relationship went way off course.

[quote name='Zombie Glaucon' timestamp='1292316760' post='2539382']
First step back would be to have a little foreign exchange party. Get to know each other!
[/quote]
Yeah it would be nice to see but I feel that boat sailed a long time ago

[King Wally]

God bless non-chaining clauses!

[Kalasin]

[quote name='Zombie Glaucon' timestamp='1292316760' post='2539382']
First step back would be to have a little foreign exchange party. Get to know each other!
[/quote]

They did. Legion actually wanted to get an MDoAP with ODN for a while and ran a diplo rush. The general consensus among ODN was 'Legion is a terrible alliance' and so the idea was abandoned.

[Jgoods45]

[quote name='youwish959' timestamp='1292313158' post='2539357']
No, cause CnG is growing apart from PB. CnG stands alone.
[/quote]

Come and get us then.

Nice grouping and all that jazz.

[Partisan]

[quote name='skrewer' timestamp='1292293583' post='2539041']
My mistake then. I joined months before GWIII and was only a small nation when war hit.

So that being clarified, I must ask, why do you hold to an antiquated grudge such as this when you of all people know how the face of Planet Bob has shifted over these many years? You yourself have witnessed the rise and fall and rise again of countless alliances. If LUE were to come back to life, would you harbor ill feelings towards them considering the brief war between NPO and LUE? Did not FAN have an interesting welcome back to Planet Bob, despite the lol's with which they departed? You criticize the former leadership of the Legion, and yet accept them amongst your ranks and promote them to your own leaders. How is there such a oxymoronic state pervading the political climate of Planet Bob?
[/quote]

You are describing a 'brief' war between NPO and LUE. Lue/NPO was a rivalry. A cold war, so to say. The LUE and the NPO had been at that state for as good as their entire existence and went head to head in multiple instances. On top of that, MK was for a long time perceived as LUE 2.0 by the powers that be and I do believe they harbour a good lot of LUE members and I don't believe MK has ever been on great terms with the old 'hegemony'. (correct me if i'm wrong on the latter)

FAN did not depart with 'lols'. FAN never departed at all. They were at a prolonged state of war and managed to sing it out until the alliances that kept them at war were defeated by other forces. They were not 'welcomed back' by their enemies. Their opponents simply no longer had the power to prolong the war and as such had to let FAN go. Your point doesn't apply there.

When you try to use history to make a point, at least try to have your facts straight or you will just look silly.

[quote name='Shoofly' timestamp='1292301421' post='2539214']
Lol. Im sorry but I can't stand by and let my fellow Legionnaires accept this grossly simplified and faulty synopsis of GWIII. I was in GWIII and fought 3 FAN nations personally (to ZI in fact). The mistake that Legion made was mainly a timing error as I see it. AEGIS nations were slow to support. If we had declared 3 days earlier while GATO still had combat strength, the ending might have been different. As it was however, we declared too late and GATO was in ashes already. If AEGIS had unified earlier and stood together, instead of staggering into the meat-grinder separately, the results would have been different. It's much easier to dismantle your opponent one at a time instead of all at once, which is exactly what the Initiative did.

All of our top nations were hitting NPO and VE upper tiers, check the combat logs, and we were attacked on several fronts by FAN, TOP, MHA and GGA. It was simply overwhelming.

Don't let rhetoric belittle Legion's bravery, honor, or effectiveness when at war. One thing I have always admired about Legion is her willingness to risk it all on principle alone. Whether that's honoring a treaty, or simply doing what she believes is the right thing (VL) to do.

If you remember the world at the time of GWIII, it was basically the Initiative versus The Rest of the World. We made a "ballsy" decision to stand on principle and yes, ever sacrifice ourselves for principle - something we have done time and time again. If some others at the time had the same ideals (IRON), then we might be living in a different world.
[/quote]

Apparently we do indeed live in a different world.... The reason you were being ridiculed for that war was because depite you having pretty much a numerical advantage over FAN/TOP at the time (if not an advantage sides were at least even), you were crippled with great ease. I'm not sure about the MHA but i'd contest your claim that the GGA was *actively* engaging you. I fought in that war as a Senior Field Officer and my memory tells me that you weren't a priority of ours. The only wars you got from us must have been a couple of members that picked a target willy-nilly. You weren't overwhelmed for as far as I know. Then again, my memory might fail me.

As for "ballsy"...It would have been "ballsy" if you did it in GWII. This move was simply stupid.

You have an... Interesting perception of history.


EDIT: typo

Edited December 14, 2010 by Partisan

[youwish959]

[quote name='Jgoods45' timestamp='1292323095' post='2539404']
Come and get us then.

Nice grouping and all that jazz.
[/quote]
We're waiting on our care package.

[Yankees Empire]

[quote name='youwish959' timestamp='1292313158' post='2539357']
No, cause CnG is growing apart from PB. CnG stands alone.
[/quote]

Please PB, don't betray CnG?

[skrewer]

[quote name='Partisan' timestamp='1292329596' post='2539433']
You are describing a 'brief' war between NPO and LUE. Lue/NPO was a rivalry. A cold war, so to say. The LUE and the NPO had been at that state for as good as their entire existence and went head to head in multiple instances. On top of that, MK was for a long time perceived as LUE 2.0 by the powers that be and I do believe they harbour a good lot of LUE members and I don't believe MK has ever been on great terms with the old 'hegemony'. (correct me if i'm wrong on the latter)

FAN did not depart with 'lols'. FAN never departed at all. They were at a prolonged state of war and managed to sing it out until the alliances that kept them at war were defeated by other forces. They were not 'welcomed back' by their enemies. Their opponents simply no longer had the power to prolong the war and as such had to let FAN go. Your point doesn't apply there.

When you try to use history to make a point, at least try to have your facts straight or you will just look silly.



Apparently we do indeed live in a different world.... The reason you were being ridiculed for that war was because depite you having pretty much a numerical advantage over FAN/TOP at the time (if not an advantage sides were at least even), you were crippled with great ease. I'm not sure about the MHA but i'd contest your claim that the GGA was *actively* engaging you. I fought in that war as a Senior Field Officer and my memory tells me that you weren't a priority of ours. The only wars you got from us must have been a couple of members that picked a target willy-nilly. You weren't overwhelmed for as far as I know. Then again, my memory might fail me.

As for "ballsy"...It would have been "ballsy" if you did it in GWII. This move was simply stupid.

You have an... Interesting perception of history.


EDIT: typo
[/quote]
Silly Partisan, this comment was already discussed a few pages back, and as such is the case, it is not warranting a secondary expounding of my points. You may remember things as you wish, the fact that you place so much emphasis on a feud between NPO/LUE that "the rest of Bob seems to revolve around"(sic) shows exactly the mindset of the drone I'm talking with.

On your other response, I fought as well in GWIII, took three nations to ZI along with myself (one deleted), where two of those nations were of the three that declared on me. And I was of the lower tier strength. WE fought overwhelming odds numerically wise, and coming in late as we did only helped the initiatives cause.

[Partisan]

[quote name='skrewer' timestamp='1292337629' post='2539475']
Silly Partisan, this comment was already discussed a few pages back, and as such is the case, it is not warranting a secondary expounding of my points. You may remember things as you wish, the fact that you place so much emphasis on a feud between NPO/LUE that "the rest of Bob seems to revolve around"(sic) shows exactly the mindset of the drone I'm talking with.

On your other response, I fought as well in GWIII, took three nations to ZI along with myself (one deleted), where two of those nations were of the three that declared on me. And I was of the lower tier strength. WE fought overwhelming odds numerically wise, and coming in late as we did only helped the initiatives cause.
[/quote]

Your comments were so far off-base that I did feel it warranted an expounding. I remember things exactly as they were on the LUE bit. Go check the wiki and you'll see that there was indeed a cold war and that there were indeed multiple conflicts. To deny that is simply ignorant. I never mentioned 'the rest of bob revolving around said conflict' and I would appreciate it if you sticked to my actual comments. I would also note that resorting to personal comments (mindless drone?) only shows the weakness of both your argument and your verbal strength. I think the only one looking silly here is you.

All I see in your second paragraph is gloating about how you fought 3 nations. Big deal, I fought 3 nations as well. Does that mean the GGA was overwhelmed? No. I recall that TOP and FAN were the only alliances actually assigned to focus on you and they did a great job at that. Even if you had been 'overwhelmed' you still performed incredibly bad. Something you can't deny.

Edited December 14, 2010 by Partisan

[skrewer]

[quote name='Partisan' timestamp='1292339792' post='2539481']
Your comments were so far off-base that I did feel it warranted an expounding. I remember things exactly as they were on the LUE bit. Go check the wiki and you'll see that there was indeed a cold war and that there were indeed multiple conflicts. To deny that is simply ignorant. I never mentioned 'the rest of bob revolving around said conflict' and I would appreciate it if you sticked to my actual comments. I would also note that resorting to personal comments (mindless drone?) only shows the weakness of both your argument and your verbal strength. I think the only one looking silly here is you.

All I see in your second paragraph is gloating about how you fought 3 nations. Big deal, I fought 3 nations as well. Does that mean the GGA was overwhelmed? No. I recall that TOP and FAN were the only alliances actually assigned to focus on you and they did a great job at that. Even if you had been 'overwhelmed' you still performed incredibly bad. Something you can't deny.
[/quote]

I'll let you interpret my words as you wish (seeing as I used a definition of "drone" referring to "one of many" in terms of your viewpoint on history; never did I call you mindless).

[Partisan]

[quote name='skrewer' timestamp='1292342715' post='2539500']
I'll let you interpret my words as you wish (seeing as I used a definition of "drone" referring to "one of many" in terms of your viewpoint on history; never did I call you mindless).
[/quote]

I might have misinterpreted your words there. If I am one of many that views it the same way, perhaps there is a core of truth in my words (as well as those of others)?

[Poyplemonkeys]

The whole Legion dropping Val/BAPS situation came out pretty clearly on these forums a while back Just takes some memory/a bit of searching to find it.

[SpiderJerusalem]

[quote name='Poyplemonkeys' timestamp='1292346214' post='2539525']
The whole Legion dropping Val/BAPS situation came out pretty clearly on these forums a while back Just takes some memory/a bit of searching to find it.
[/quote]

Stop giving out hints

[assarax]

Ah, another Legion treaty, another round of anti-Legion asshattery... More people spewing outdated facts and irrelevant data in order to justify your hatred for my alliance. I hope you all realize that in the eyes of Legionnaires everywhere you all are one hilarious joke. Thank you to all of Legion and Polaris' allies and supporters, you're all good people. As for the rest of you, kindly take your !@#$%baggery and shove it. Though I doubt you'll find room, since your heads are taking up so much space in your asses.

[Some-Guy]

[quote name='assarax' timestamp='1292352802' post='2539595']
Ah, another Legion treaty, another round of anti-Legion asshattery... More people spewing outdated facts and irrelevant data in order to justify your hatred for my alliance. I hope you all realize that in the eyes of Legionnaires everywhere you all are one hilarious joke. Thank you to all of Legion and Polaris' allies and supporters, you're all good people. As for the rest of you, kindly take your !@#$%baggery and shove it. Though I doubt you'll find room, since your heads are taking up so much space in your asses.
[/quote]

I'm pretty sure that you're my new hero.

[Hyperion321]

[quote name='youwish959' timestamp='1292332170' post='2539443']
We're waiting on our care package.
[/quote]
You have to get a 4 kill streak dude. NSO has never killed...well...anything. Although I will give you props for helping to buzzkill NPO though. They were getting dangerously close to a nuke due to the chopper gunner known as Q.

o/ Cold Blooded

[Buds The Man]

[quote name='assarax' timestamp='1292352802' post='2539595']
Ah, another Legion treaty, another round of anti-Legion asshattery... More people spewing outdated facts and irrelevant data in order to justify your hatred for my alliance. I hope you all realize that in the eyes of Legionnaires everywhere you all are one hilarious joke. Thank you to all of Legion and Polaris' allies and supporters, you're all good people. As for the rest of you, kindly take your !@#$%baggery and shove it. Though I doubt you'll find room, since your heads are taking up so much space in your asses.
[/quote]

You sir make me smile and be thankfull about things, and the times to come

[ChairmanHal]

[quote name='assarax' timestamp='1292352802' post='2539595']
Ah, another Legion treaty, another round of anti-Legion asshattery... More people spewing outdated facts and irrelevant data in order to justify your hatred for my alliance. I hope you all realize that in the eyes of Legionnaires everywhere you all are one hilarious joke. Thank you to all of Legion and Polaris' allies and supporters, you're all good people. As for the rest of you, kindly take your !@#$%baggery and shove it. Though I doubt you'll find room, since your heads are taking up so much space in your asses.
[/quote]

*golf clap*

At least this one has some fangs.

[Branimir]

If the issue is of Legion changing allies, by any conceivable standard, dropping Val and BAPS and then later on (related or not, I do not know) allying with NpO is a step up. That is actually a non issue. One should congratulate Legion on that.

Edited December 14, 2010 by Branimir

[Buds The Man]

[quote name='Branimir' timestamp='1292354599' post='2539618']
If the issue is of Legion changing allies, by any conceivable standard, dropping Val and BAPS and then later on (related or not, I do not know) allying with NpO is a step up. That is actually a non issue. One should congratulate Legion on that.
[/quote]

oh Branimir another pot shot at Valhalla and Baps how original from you. The issue isnt about them changing allies its about how they do it. Valhalla has changed her path so Legion can change theres its all about how you do it. But then again at least legion did talk to us about things so thats a step up from how we were treated by some former allies.

[Branimir]

[quote name='Buds The Man' timestamp='1292354892' post='2539619']
oh Branimir another pot shot at Valhalla and Baps how original from you.[/quote]
No, actually that is a hard cold fact of life.

[quote name='Buds The Man' timestamp='1292354892' post='2539619']The issue isnt about them changing allies its about how they do it.
[/quote]
Fair enough on that point, although am not sure it was that grievous.