DEAR LORD let the ignorance end. I have read through the last 6 pages of this. To those that haven't been around for years let me clue you in. Grub is probably one of the top 10 players of all time. He is a master of manipulating the treaty web. He has the ability to be patient and has pulled off one of the most amazing betrayals of all time and torched an entire coalition in order to achieve his goal. (I aint mad at ya grub its ancient history, just an example) For those that are saying oh yeah right hes just posturing, Grub does not posture and while he is a master of spin, just enjoy the fact that apparently our side won, enjoy it, rebuild and get ready for the next one. Here is my one warning, keep talking !@#$ and the next time he will bury you and drink your alligator tears while he enjoys feasting upon your nations. GOD I sound like a groupie but I do believe he has at least earned the right to be respected a bit more.