Imperial Announcement from the New Pacific Order

[Haflinger]

[quote name='flak attack' date='17 February 2010 - 12:59 AM' timestamp='1266386357' post='2187192']
If he's before my time, you aren't putting up a very compelling case as for how often people join that side of the web, considering I joined just after UJW
[/quote]
I do believe your argument went something along the lines of "Nobody from the GPA would ever dirty themselves by joining an NPO ally." Not saying it was rare, but saying it was impossible.

Amonra's not the only ex-GPA member I know. Jesusaurus is also a valued member of Invicta. Remember him?

[heggo]

[quote name='Haflinger' date='17 February 2010 - 01:30 AM' timestamp='1266391804' post='2187285']
I do believe your argument went something along the lines of "Nobody from the GPA would ever dirty themselves by joining an NPO ally."
[/quote]
Ex-GPA members dirty themselves by doing all kinds of things- just look at me!

[Hydro]

[quote name='Haflinger' date='17 February 2010 - 12:30 AM' timestamp='1266391804' post='2187285']
I do believe your argument went something along the lines of "Nobody from the GPA would ever dirty themselves by joining an NPO ally." Not saying it was rare, but saying it was impossible.[/quote]

I was just skimming this thread when I saw this; I was in GPA for over a year and am now in Pacifica.

[F15pilotX]

[quote name='Penkala' date='16 February 2010 - 09:51 PM' timestamp='1266375077' post='2186758']
Yeah we're all a little busy right now.[/quote]Sorry, but where in the terms did it say you only had to defend the NPO if you weren't busy? I can't seem to find that gem.

Edited February 17, 2010 by F15pilotX

[Letum]

[quote name='Penkala' date='17 February 2010 - 02:51 AM' timestamp='1266375077' post='2186758']
Yeah we're all a little busy right now.

See, this is what happens when you purposely drag your feet, hoping that in the ensuing war your old allies will come out with the upper hand and free you of your terms: you end up having to go without protection for a while and send aid when you don't want to. Your fault for making terms that could have been accomplished in 4 months take 3 times as long (purposely).
[/quote]

Tell me, how many alliances have moved 112,000 tech in reps every 30 days using only 1/7th of their members? Because that what your "could have been accomplished in 4 months" figure would need.

It's easy to pull grandiose claims out of thin air, but not as easy to back them up. While it will no doubt make people comfortable to lay the blame for the long time of these reps on the NPO rather than the massive size of the demands, the fact remains that the NPO has been sending tech at the highest speed we can manage. And in fact, if you compare in terms of the amount of reps sent [i]per eligible member per month[/i], the NPO is probably amongst the fastest, if not the fastest, rep givers ever. It's just that speed is only one of the factors that determines total time; quantity is important too.

But that's what happens when you limit who can pay, along with asking a lot. It takes time to give it. Especially when we're left with a very small amount of people who *can* pay, since half of our original "eligible" paying nations have either left the alliance or planet bob altogether. The majority of our nations are forced to sit around, unable to do anything because of that. It's hard to drag your feet when you're not even allowed to move them.

But don't let that get in the way of your self-justifications.

Edited February 17, 2010 by Letum

[Sephiroth]

[quote name='Benjamin Arouet' date='16 February 2010 - 10:15 PM' timestamp='1266376524' post='2186843']
All I see is a trail of unnecessary public whining starting with the OP and continuing some 20-odd pages. There was never any particular reason for this spectacle, it's just one drawn out and unwarranted shot at GOD. As has already been stated, you guys should just be happy that the people you agreed to an instrument of surrender with are far more tolerant of such juvenile antics than NPO ever would've been.
[/quote]
If I saw NPO nations aiding GOD while we are still at war I don't think I would of thought well of NPO for it, although I saw this thread which showed how much they didn't want to break their neutrality here. They tried to avoid this situation, but GOD wouldn't budge. This thread was very necessary in my opinion, now I'm understanding of the difficult situation GOD has forced them into here.

Anyways good luck to NPO in dealing with these terms only you seem to be upholding.

[Kowalski]

Was there really any need for this to be made public, other than some PR for NPO by announcing that they'll be accepting POW's without making them decommission anything?

This didn't need to come out, NPO didn't need to 'reluctantly' pick a side and they didn't need to accept POW's.

[Nizzle]

[quote name='Kowalski' date='17 February 2010 - 04:02 AM' timestamp='1266404561' post='2187401']
Was there really any need for this to be made public, other than some PR for NPO by announcing that they'll be accepting POW's without making them decommission anything?

This didn't need to come out, NPO didn't need to 'reluctantly' pick a side and they didn't need to accept POW's.
[/quote]

Right. This didn't need to come out.

I'm sure no one would have cared that GOD was getting aid packages from NPO. Na, they wouldn't have noticed at all.

Silly NPO.

[Kowalski]

It could have been dealt with privately.

[Wabooz]

It could have been but then someone else would have posted this with their spin on it.
Instead NPO beat them to the punch and had a little fun with their surrender idear..

[Nizzle]

[quote name='Kowalski' date='17 February 2010 - 04:15 AM' timestamp='1266405352' post='2187413']
It could have been dealt with privately.
[/quote]

Incidentally, so could have many other things.

This, however, doesn't fall in that category.

[Letum]

[quote name='Kowalski' date='17 February 2010 - 11:15 AM' timestamp='1266405352' post='2187413']
It could have been dealt with privately.
[/quote]

From my experience on the other side (the ones seeing their enemies getting aid), dealing with it "privately" does not tend to diminish the ill-will generated with the public of the alliances being wronged. Transparency and openness does.

[Roadie]

[quote name='Kowalski' date='17 February 2010 - 05:02 AM' timestamp='1266404561' post='2187401']
Was there really any need for this to be made public, other than some PR for NPO by announcing that they'll be accepting POW's without making them decommission anything?

This didn't need to come out, NPO didn't need to 'reluctantly' pick a side and they didn't need to accept POW's.
[/quote]

lolwut? Do you honestly not see the humor in NPO offering terms to both sides of the conflict?

[Mussolandia]

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='17 February 2010 - 03:19 AM' timestamp='1266376741' post='2186859']
[b]
Lord Brendan's Quick Guide for Completing Surrender Terms and not Making Everybody Hate You:[/b]

-Don't wear anti-Karma propaganda signatures on the OWF. (applies especially for the Emperor)
-Keep PUBLIC anti-Karma sentiment at an absolute minimum.
-Complete more than the bare minimum of monthly reparations. Impress the world by completing your terms early!
-Don't make monthly topics calling out your captives.
-Talk to your former enemies in PRIVATE if you have issues.
-Accept that there will always be a small amount of haters, and don't moan about the fact that not everybody loves you.
-Smile.

Hope that helps. It's too late now though, they've chosen a different route. For examples of good execution, see: New Polar Order, Mushroom Kingdom, Federation of Armed Nations (between the first and second FAN Wars) and basically every other alliance ever that has endured surrender terms.
[/quote]

That presupposes Karma is the world. I like it when you guys think this way. Will make your own day of reckoning come sooner.

[the lizard queen]

[quote name='Mussolandia' date='17 February 2010 - 09:04 AM' timestamp='1266415488' post='2187507']
That presupposes Karma is the world. I like it when you guys think this way. Will make your own day of reckoning come sooner.
[/quote]

Indeed. That day cannot get here soon enough.

[Qazzian]

[quote name='Kowalski' date='17 February 2010 - 06:15 AM' timestamp='1266405352' post='2187413']
It could have been dealt with privately.
[/quote]


I'd like to use this to back up my post on page (I think) 14 or 15 where I pointed out that if it's no in the original post, you keep visiting the same point over and over because people do no ready the thread. I don't want to know how many people have already gone over this point, from the NPO and other alliances. I guess we'll just have to add another one to that list though.


*EDIT* Sorry, it was [url=http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=80948&view=findpost&p=2186031]page 17 [/url]

Edited February 17, 2010 by Qazzian

[Jasmines Jewels]

[quote name='NoFish' date='16 February 2010 - 05:27 PM' timestamp='1266362826' post='2186418']I am always on IRC, idling or otherwise, and have so far never received contact from someone from NPO regarding any issue. I assume this is because you have had no trouble getting in touch with Xiphosis or Big_Z about any matters that may concern us.[/quote]
Xiphosis has been my point of contact since I was promoted to handling reps. I've idled in your channel for the last 4 or 5 days and have asked on how to find him but he's not been around at all and I received no reponse. This also goes along with the fact that I've never received contact from GOD regarding reps or our protection either. Street goes both ways especially when mine forks in 14 different directions.

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='16 February 2010 - 08:32 PM' timestamp='1266373936' post='2186725']For GOD to waive reparations payments, even temporarily, would be a nice thing for them to do. A charitable favor.

tl;dr if you spit on the guard every time he turns his back, don't expect a recommendation for early parole[/quote]
So you're agreeing that GOD is doing something not nice and uncharitable. Perfect. We also are not asking for "early parole" or anything of the sort. By asking for a suspension we're in terms longer so yes evil us.

[quote name='Timmehhh' date='16 February 2010 - 08:52 PM' timestamp='1266375153' post='2186763']FOK is sorry we can't uphold our obligation to defend NPO against rogues for the time being, due the global war.
When the war is over we will be ready again to deal with the rogues who are attacking NPO.[/quote]
FOK has been extremely helpful in liberating the tech and land of those that have attacked us the last 7 months. You're one of the few that have lived up to your signature even though you receive no reps from us.

[quote name='Mundokiir' date='16 February 2010 - 09:40 PM' timestamp='1266378036' post='2186924']Also, I don't blame the NPO for everything. I just blame Bilrow. Much easier to hold accountable instead of an entire alliance.[/quote]
Don't worry, we all blame Bilrow ... daily.

Edit: you goldie ... also Vlad

Edited February 17, 2010 by Jasmines Jewels

[New Frontier]

Pacifica is always trying to get away with things. Their evil knows no bounds.

[kpcurley]

[quote name='Thierra' date='15 February 2010 - 11:54 PM' timestamp='1266296068' post='2184553']
Nothing gets by you.

I've never seen Pacifica go into a war kicking and screaming. Guns blazing to be sure, but do I smell reluctance?
[/quote]

Yeah, they are required to keep their troops at 20% and not have military improvements and nukes. Any ground attack or deployment of troops would anarchy them straight away. So yeah, I am sure they are very reluctant to enter a war while under terms.

[President President]

[quote name='New Frontier' date='17 February 2010 - 04:05 PM' timestamp='1266422715' post='2187590']
Pacifica is always trying to get away with things. Their evil knows no bounds.
[/quote]

Flattery. I love it.

[Bilrow]

[quote name='flak attack' date='16 February 2010 - 10:15 PM' timestamp='1266380123' post='2187003']
When was the last time you heard of a former GPA member applying to an alliance on your side of the treaty web? I think that says something. When people leave GPA, we tend to go to alliances that we know won't ally themselves with NPO in a long, long time. IAA, MK, Ronin. GPA just has a level of class you could never hope to comprehend.
[/quote]


Thierra was in GGA for a while.

[Lord Brendan]

[quote name='Jasmines Jewels' date='17 February 2010 - 10:04 AM' timestamp='1266419089' post='2187558']
So you're agreeing that GOD is doing something not nice and uncharitable. Perfect. We also are not asking for "early parole" or anything of the sort. By asking for a suspension we're in terms longer so yes evil us.
[/quote]

That falsely implies that they are doing something active. They aren't, they are simply [i]not[/i] doing you a favor.

[Cager]

[quote name='F15pilotX' date='17 February 2010 - 03:34 AM' timestamp='1266395693' post='2187327']
Sorry, but where in the terms did it say you only had to defend the NPO if you weren't busy? I can't seem to find that gem.
[/quote]

You know as well as I do this quote will be buried or unanswered or avalanched by people saying the NPO is complaining or more anti-NPO rhetoric. Because when it boils down to it they're obligated by their own terms to defend you regardless of the current global conflict. But they'll conveniently forget that fact and justify it by saying you deserve it. That's Planet Bob as we know it.

[Galapagos]

[quote name='Newhotness' date='16 February 2010 - 04:51 AM' timestamp='1266295909' post='2184536']
i hope someone ends up being a PoW of NPO. lol
[/quote]

I became an NPO POW before this announcement was made, and I tell you what, I haven't looked back.
Time of my life.

[Aloop]

The NPO was more than welcome to finish paying our reps before the war started. Most of us had slots open for NPO reps (which we were told were coming) all through the autumn. Deliberately dragging your feet, and wasting our aid slots when we could have been using them for other things did little to convince me that you were sincere in your efforts.

[quote]I don't think anyone on our end was aware that you lacked reparations targets. GOD recently got a new Lord of Internal Affairs (whose duty such a list would be) and it's possible that there has been some confusion over this matter. I'll bring it up with him tonight.[/quote]
They never lacked rep targets. They had the list almost immediately after they surrendered. They chose to drag their feet as much as possible. For those who don't know (most of you) I'm the ex-LoIA. I got the wonderful job of trying to convince people that Pacifica was actually going to be sending out the reps soon. Yeah. They sure came through on their end. When it was a deliberate tactic, or just malicious inaction, Pacifica wasted a ton of our aid slots every month.

[quote]What else do you !@#$@#$ want from them? They pay their reps on time (to the best of my knowledge), I mean seriously you didn't put a term in their terms that said they couldn't talk !@#$ did you?[/quote]
It's true that they've managed to do the absolute minimum to meet the requirement. When they've taken advantage of the wording of the ToS to stretch our patience, don't be surprised that we're not really inclined to be nice to them.