Polaris White Peaced.

[Chickenzilla]

Sponge set it up. From the day he joined CN, he has plotted. GWI? His idea. GWII? All Sponge. GWIII? Part of his plan to break WUT up. \m/? Founded by Sponge for them to be attacked in UJP war and be disbanded. Vox? To get spies in the right places for this. Karma war? "shrug" \m/ reforming? Sponge setting this up. The Peace? Sponge couped Grub. He's in charge of Polaris now, and indeed. The world!

[Draztikus]

Sponge set it up. From the day he joined CN, he has plotted. GWI? His idea. GWII? All Sponge. GWIII? Part of his plan to break WUT up. \m/? Founded by Sponge for them to be attacked in UJP war and be disbanded. Vox? To get spies in the right places for this. Karma war? "shrug" \m/ reforming? Sponge setting this up. The Peace? Sponge couped Grub. He's in charge of Polaris now, and indeed. The world!

Don't forget he was briefly in MK before returning to Polaris. Why? To teach them how to dance...

[Chickenzilla]

Don't forget he was briefly in MK before returning to Polaris. Why? To teach them how to dance...

/facepalm

How could I have forgotten that?

[Earogema]

It can't a trap.

If it was, Polar just hung NSO to dry, since they are obligated to defend IRON (unless it's non-chaining, which I don't believe it to be, and even if it is, they can still just invoke the Moldavi doctrine). NSO was the first alliance to declare in defense of the NpO, and Ivan admits that he was very confused as to the peace that NpO just brokered. (Though that in itself could be part of the trap).

I'm almost certain it was an agreement between the four alliances to watch TOP/IRON get killed.

EDIT:

For anyone reading here who has not seen it, here is AlmightyGrub's reply.

Those on both sides who want to try to make a separate war out of this seem to be on weak footing.

3. Did I hang anyone out to dry? No

Well that answers that.

Edited January 29, 2010 by Earogema

[Bedford Forrest]

A trap? No. Not a trap, but a set-up, and in this day of back-room gameplay, there aint no way to tell until the fat lady sings. And if my guess is right, she's still in the dressing room, putting on her makeup.

[thaone]

The trap theory just doesn't hold. If there was a trap, we fell in it too and I doubt Polar would willingly let us walk into that situation.

All alliances involved in the fight got pretty hurt during the laying of the trap. I at least worked as hard as I could to let FOK do as much damage to our enemies as possible,

What does smell however is the rush in which the peace terms got signed. \M/ had the same terms for all this time and just before this update out of the blue decided they would sign them, they didn't even take the time to talk to any of the alliances on their side except Poison Clan. This is either incompetence or intent, you may decide.

[Authur]

It can't a trap.

If it was, Polar just hung NSO to dry, since they are obligated to defend IRON (unless it's non-chaining, which I don't believe it to be, and even if it is, they can still just invoke the Moldavi doctrine). NSO was the first alliance to declare in defense of the NpO, and Ivan admits that he was very confused as to the peace that NpO just brokered. (Though that in itself could be part of the trap).

I'm almost certain it was an agreement between the four alliances to watch TOP/IRON get killed.

EDIT:

Well that answers that.

From what I can tell, based on information here and else where the main leaders of Polaris, NSO, etc knew of TOP/IRON/etc's decision to enter the war in the manner they did. It was a power play on duckroll's part to engage CnG directly instead of allowing them to get picked apart when they entered the war through existing treaties. CnG leadership it would seem knew this was coming and wisely had \m/ accept the peace deal that has been on the table since day one just moments after the declarations. If there was a "trap" it was \m/ holding out until duckroll entered. Either way this was poorly handled and executed. No cease fire (We have actually not accepted peace yet) should have been granted until everyone was informed.

As far as I'm aware we are working to get everyone out of this war including TOP, IRON, and TORN.

Edited January 29, 2010 by Authur

[Earogema]

All alliances involved in the fight got pretty hurt during the laying of the trap. I at least worked as hard as I could to let FOK do as much damage to our enemies as possible,

What does smell however is the rush in which the peace terms got signed. \M/ had the same terms for all this time and just before this update out of the blue decided they would sign them, they didn't even take the time to talk to any of the alliances on their side except Poison Clan. This is either incompetence or intent, you may decide.

We fought to prove that we would fight. That was about it. We would have eventually taken those terms, or just stayed at war forever. We fought exactly one round. Why people didn't just let us take that one round I have no idea.

PC were our only allies too. Nobody else came to our defense. Though to be fair, FOK should have also been consulted.

EDIT:

From what I can tell, based on information here and else where the main leaders of Polaris, NSO, etc knew of, and approved of, TOP/IRON/etc's decision to enter the war in the manner they did. It was a power play on duckroll's part to engage CnG directly instead of allowing them to get picked apart when they entered the war through existing treaties. CnG leadership it would seem knew this was coming and wisely had \m/ accept the peace deal that has been on the table since day one just moments after the declarations. If there was a "trap" it was \m/ holding out until duckroll entered. Either way this was poorly handled and executed. No cease fire (We have actually not accepted peace yet) should have been granted until everyone was informed.

As far as I'm aware we are working to get everyone out of this war including TOP, IRON, and TORN.

\m/ wasn't "holding out" on anything. We just fought because that's what we wanted to do.

Also- I highly doubt that Polaris approved of preemptive attacks- Especially on their allies.

Edited January 29, 2010 by Earogema

[Authur]

We fought to prove that we would fight. That was about it. We would have eventually taken those terms, or just stayed at war forever. We fought exactly one round. Why people didn't just let us take that one round I have no idea.

PC were our only allies too. Nobody else came to our defense. Though to be fair, FOK should have also been consulted.

EDIT:

\m/ wasn't "holding out" on anything. We just fought because that's what we wanted to do.

Also- I highly doubt that Polaris approved of preemptive attacks- Especially on their allies.

You fought because you "wanted to" and suddenly decided to accept peace that night? It was such a heated issue and we didn't even get through a round of battle.

As for your second comment "approved of" was the wrong term to use but I think they knew and didn't stop them.

Edited January 29, 2010 by Authur

[The FSM]

First off, Im very happy to see everyone using that awesome fellow in my avatar.

In regards to the actual matter at hand, I would say no this was not a conspiracy by the fact that it would have to be so huge, far ranging, and intricate that it becomes improbable. In order for this to work not only would NpO and \m/ have needed to be in on this, but also PC, FOK, NSO and many others. More likely its a matter of people not adequately taking into account how big the public outcry would be against something like this.

[thaone]

You fought because you "wanted to" and suddenly decided to accept peace that night? It was such a heated issue and we didn't even get through a round of battle.

As for your second comment "approved of" was the wrong term to use but I think they knew and didn't stop them.

I think you're hitting the nail on it's head.

[Earogema]

You fought because you "wanted to" and suddenly decided to accept peace that night? It was such a heated issue and we didn't even get through a round of battle.

As for your second comment "approved of" was the wrong term to use but they knew and didn't stop them.

We got just over one round in. My round with "MiSS TRIGGA" expired a day ago. We decided to accept the very same terms that were on the table for day one. Everybody already hates us, so we may as well at least prove we can fight a week. That isn't too much to ask. We got Grub to concede he wasn't the sole moral authority on Bob too. You have no idea how hard that was. It really wasn't that much of a heated issue other than both sides just feigning moral outrage.

And I still doubt that Grub would want ANY preemptive strikes, and I really doubt they would allow MK to be hit for damn no good reason when MK stayed out of the war. It just makes more sense for MK to have actually entered when Polar got hit by FOK or something. Then C&G would be on the same side as TOP.

[Branimir]

And even so, I still feel like you guys got screwed over.

Because they did. Elaborate trap, from both sides, or just quick reaction from one and silliness of other, your ally IRON got played.

And you were in a position to just watch it transpire, as you arent big enough player in this game.

I hope you get your promised peace outs, NSO. Good luck to you.

[Merrie Melodies]

Jeez, for the love of Admin, there was no conspiracy/trap on \m/'s side and I am personally 100% sure none from Grub. If people had paid attention Grub never pulled his white peace terms, \m/ was free to end this anytime we wanted to admit we screwed the pooch. If people had paid attention to some of the posts in threads here they would have noticed away from all the mud slinging parties where working towards a mutually acceptable conclusion.

Why we in \m/ choose to fight for a full round of wars before conceeding is our business and PC's should they ask us. That we submitted last night is just one of the cyberverses very hilarious coincidents. Our Triumvirate was in talks with Grub last night prior to TOPS blunder, people outside of the \m/-Polar war came to us asking us to accept white peace to which our Triumvirate responded "hey we have already been working on it"

Grub didn't screw anyone over last night, he meerly honored terms that had been on the table for over a week, and really how could he not?

I truly hope NSO can extract themselves from their predictament, yeah the Sith are awesome.

[Petrovich4]

As far as I'm aware we are working to get everyone out of this war including TOP, IRON, and TORN.

You might be working but they will not work regardless of your attempts. Those 3 plus DAWN and whoever else will be getting pummelled. For if TOP and friends get peace I can guarantee you that Citadel will not be the only bloc that will be fractured and heavily watered down.

You simply do not know all the 'driving' personalities behind C&G.

[Zombie Glaucon]

I don't mean to sound like a broken record by repeating what I previously stated, but the fact that the aggressive alliances and the defensive alliances were all uninvolved in the prior conflict makes a pretty compelling case for this being something separate, something uninvolved.

There's uninvolved and then there's uninvolved. If IRON was going to come in to defend NSO, then a CnG counter, then TOP coming in to counter that, it's reasonable to see a preemptive strike to try for some tactical advantage.

I don't know if that's the case, I simply posit it as possible. No one lets me in on the planning - I'm just here to have a good time.

[Earogema]

There's uninvolved and then there's uninvolved. If IRON was going to come in to defend NSO, then a CnG counter, then TOP coming in to counter that, it's reasonable to see a preemptive strike to try for some tactical advantage.

I don't know if that's the case, I simply posit it as possible. No one lets me in on the planning - I'm just here to have a good time.

IRON is plausible, but I don't see C&G coming in against them.

I just can't see it.

[Chief Savage Man]

You fought because you "wanted to" and suddenly decided to accept peace that night? It was such a heated issue and we didn't even get through a round of battle.

Yes, yes, and I bet you'll get more than one round of battle before this is all over.

[Magnum T. Gundraw]

Opportunism on TOP's part maybe.

At any rate, it's no "accident."

Edited January 29, 2010 by Magnum T. Gundraw

[Groucho Marx]

Neither, really. AlmightyGrub and I agreed to peace about 10 minutes before TOP launched their first attacks. It is simply the most epic coincidence in Bob history.

This. There is no mystery to this war, no arch criminal behind it all. TOP just picked a bad time to involve themselves in something stupid.

[Zombie Glaucon]

IRON is plausible, but I don't see C&G coming in against them.

I just can't see it.

It's inconceivable!

[hizzy]

This reminds me of the time when GGA and Valhalla attacked Hyperion... and then, a few days later TOP and a bunch of other jerks declared war on NpO for basically the same thing ("NpO wants to hurt us") and IRON preemptively hit Nueva Vida because "[they] don't like [us] and want to see [us] dead." And then, when you won the war, you claimed "oh, this is a completely different war from the GGA-Hyperion thing, it's just close to the same time".

The fact that you laid out the exact same plans is hilarious.

[HellAngel]

60% of people on planet Bob were fooled. Yeah its that easy.

and @Hizzy: I would wish our DoW would have been something along the lines of "Polaris is doing the right thing and we want to help them", but Crymson pretty much went in on his old thinking.

But yeah theres the moralist side in TOP and the realist side. Latter pretty much thinks what Crym has said and the former wanted to help Polaris standing up for whats good and just.

[Bob Janova]

And then, when you won the war, you claimed "oh, this is a completely different war from the GGA-Hyperion thing, it's just close to the same time".

We were saying that from the beginning ... I distinctly remember arguing that point in our (Citadel and other people on Polar) DoW thread.

But this isn't even the same thing, TOP claimed to be going in to help on the Polar side. It was just a terrible move.

I think the testimony of people in all the involved alliances (TOP, NpO and \m/) in this thread show that it wasn't a trap.

You might be working but they will not work regardless of your attempts. Those 3 plus DAWN and whoever else will be getting pummelled.

Hellloooooo there new Hegemony!

[theArrowheadian]

If it was "a trap" then TOP and Co. would be crying their hearts out on the forums. If anything the prior NpO war was just a launching pad that TOP wanted to attack C&G. Since TOP, for the most part hasn't been playing the bleeding heart it's pretty safe to assume that this wasn't a set up.