AAF announcement

[Shovel]

In summation:

One 16,000 infra nation with WRC and MP dares aid 3,000,000 to a friend thats being triple teamed

response:

Two 14,000 infra nations and one 13,000 infra nation attack him.

Whilst I probably would start stomping my feet in a similar manner if this had been a sub 5,000 infra nation in a similar manner to iFOK had it been one of my raids Im failing to understand the mentality in why three infra heavy nations feel the need to take on a larger nuclear armed target all for the sake of 3 million.

iFOK must really want something to do with itself forcing the point on this issue, fail more than I do at ingame maths or both. Either way I hope Amnora changes his mind and just ditches 25 nukes into you; you loose a few billion in infrastructure because from where Im sat that outcome looks to be what your after.

His friend got tripled teamed? I don't think so.

lol, you have never heard of this little thing called "technology"? No, didn't think so.

The three nations attacking Amonra are no where near "infra heavy".

Someone needs to brush up on their CN knowledge.

Edited October 21, 2009 by Shovel

[Il Impero Romano]

This is what we call balls. littleFOK I await your response to this.

Sending it takes no balls, accepting it would though...but I don't see that happening.

Edit: Yeaaap

Edited October 21, 2009 by Il Impero Romano

[Goldie]

a lot of people are saying in one breath that stickmen are free to do business on purple and that their antics are humorous yet harmless, yet they are saying in another that there is a possibility of it coming down to a fight between they and the rest of purple. which is it? because i would think if these people really thought their antics were harmless, then why would there even be a thought of war between they and the rest of purple?

i think there are a lot of people taking things way too seriously in this game, and stickmen are a breath of fresh air in that they poke fun at a lot of traditional norms and other things taken for granted.

<3 stickmen

[bill n ted]

His friend got tripled teamed? I don't think so.

lol, you have never heard of this little thing called "technology"? No, didn't think so.

The three nations attacking Amonra are no where near "infra heavy".

Someone needs to brush up on their CN knowledge.

Meh

Tech you say?

Ruler: Shovel - 8,081.24 tech

Ruler: BNT - 8,650.81tech

I have indeed heard of it; Ive also seen it blow up too

All three have more infra than Ive ever had so by my standards they are infra heavy.

Indeed

[kriekfreak]

This is what we call balls. littleFOK I await your response to this.

He already backed down. Is that what you call having balls? I guess that is Invicta standards. Like I said earlier, big mouth no balls.

[Haflinger]

It's more like Invicta has a tendency to aid the people who are in war with people they don't like. They mass aided the alliance Bel-air was in war with, they got away with it. And now the vice president aided someone who was in war with iFOK. It was a clear provocation.

First of all, we sent like about 30M tops. Secondly, Belair didn't exist then. Thirdly, it wasn't an alliance war officially; Internet Superheroes attacked Crimson Guard as a tech raid. Fourthly, we didn't have anything against Internet Superheroes, and actually get along quite well with a number of their former members; we just didn't want to see CG get raided into the dirt.

I think you should've read the thread better, Penguin. iFOK asked some money as compensation, we didn't ask for anyone to be expelled. Amonra then made his own choice to leave Invicta and fight.

You may not be aware of the contents of the communications that Amonra received. I wouldn't describe his decision as exactly a free choice.

edit: In the past there have been instances where iFOK or FOK members have done the same thing as Amonra. We always tried to reach some kind of agreement with the other party and we never had anyone overreact and leave the alliance.

I find it doubtful that those people were spoken to in quite the same way as he was. I would not describe it as trying to reach agreement.

Anyway, for us it's water under the bridge now and we wish Amonra good luck in the future.

That's good.

Yeah, I felt 300% was pretty ridiculous too when I was dealing with FOK, but the thing is when you're in the wrong there's not a lot you have to argue your position. iFOK wasn't solely trying to re-balance the conflict. The policy of 300% (or even the 150/200% that most alliances use) is to ensure that the damage is covered, and that the person committing the wrong learns a lesson. Otherwise every alliance would just have 100% policy of reparations, no matter the situation.

Actually, we pretty much have a 100% policy, usually rounded up to the next 3M, sometimes ignored with tiny nations (who cares if someone goes from 200 to 100 infra? Newbie grant or one tech deal will take them so much higher); strangely enough, we've never gotten pulled into any major wars over rep disputes. I do think there's a correlation there.

Generally the people who you're trying to discourage will refuse 100% reps anyway, so it doesn't matter - go 500%, you'll just be wasting your slots on cash anyway.

So what is the status of the conflict with i/FOK and Amonra?

Is it a tech raid, war or punishment beating?

I ask as I have sent Amonra some aid and am wondering what the likely repercussions will be. I have to assume none as the monies sent can hardly give Amonra an unfair advantage at the NS levels being considered here.

M6

Wasting Amonra's slots with incoming cash might constitute a CB in itself

So any nation a member of iFOK attacks is instantly an enemy of iFOK? What if an iFOK member attacks a nation in an alliance, does that nation, and by extension the alliance, become an enemy of iFOK? Of course not, that is absurd. The nation aided was not an enemy, but a victim of iFOK.

I wonder what happens if iFOK raids Chickenzilla.

Hmmm....

[Amonra]

Amonra made a poor decision, and followed it up by making another poor decision because of pride.

I apologized for the first mistake, but the second one was not a mistake. Why would I endanger my alliance for my actions. I do not regret step out and making sure my friends dont pay for me.

[Amonra]

He already backed down. Is that what you call having balls? I guess that is Invicta standards. Like I said earlier, big mouth no balls.

Nice, there is nothing like bad mouthing an apology to yourself.

Do you also step on your own christmas presents before you open them?

And I didnt back down, I refused to put another freind in your line of sight. You should actually be thanking me, M6 is about the only guy I would not want to fight in CN.

Edited October 21, 2009 by Amonra

[oinkoink12]

Why would they need help with one nation.

Because there were only 2 people in IFOK within his range at the time, 1 was arexes (who attacked) the other was mikethefirst (who had 7k infra less than the guy)

So if you don't have any nations to hit him with, you call your allies.

Its quite common.

[Lenny N Karl]

Nice, there is nothing like bad mouthing an apology to yourself.

Do you also step on your own christmas presents before you open them?

And I didnt back down, I refused to put another freind in your line of sight. You should actually be thanking me, M6 is about the only guy I would not want to fight in CN.

I think (hope) he was talking about M6 Redneck.

Either way, Amonra has honored his side of the terms. Would be nice to see some leniency shown.

EDIT: for forgotten "ed"

Edited October 21, 2009 by Lenny N Karl

[Wu Tang Clan]

a lot of people are saying in one breath that stickmen are free to do business on purple and that their antics are humorous yet harmless, yet they are saying in another that there is a possibility of it coming down to a fight between they and the rest of purple. which is it? because i would think if these people really thought their antics were harmless, then why would there even be a thought of war between they and the rest of purple?

i think there are a lot of people taking things way too seriously in this game, and stickmen are a breath of fresh air in that they poke fun at a lot of traditional norms and other things taken for granted.

<3 stickmen

Fun is not allowed in my CN. Death to stickmen.

On a serious note, I would argue the inverse. I would say Amonra was just having fun in aiding someone who was being techraided by someone he didn't like and it was iFOK who took it out of porportion and made this an international incident.

[Balder]

Meh, I think this would of been a whole lot easier if yall didn't try to claim morality. Just admit that you did it because you wanted to and had the power to. Seriously, I'd actually respect you if you outright said it rather than try and take the non-existent high ground from the Holier Than Thou peanut gallery.

[oinkoink12]

Is this topic still going.

Even invicta says that you can all learn from Stickmen

*points to signature*

Edited October 21, 2009 by oinkoink12

[Havamil]

Because there were only 2 people in IFOK within his range at the time, 1 was arexes (who attacked) the other was mikethefirst (who had 7k infra less than the guy)

So if you don't have any nations to hit him with, you call your allies.

Its quite common.

But according to the agreement in the op, #2 i dont see anything about allies/friends included. Why not go along with the agreement that you was made ?

Edited October 22, 2009 by Havamil

[Lord Fingolfin]

I'm glad to see this resolved. Although it still ranks pretty high up on my biggest !@#$%^&* events of CN list. The other thread was more entertaining, more hate.

[kriekfreak]

I think (hope) he was talking about M6 Redneck.

Either way, Amonra has honored his side of the terms. Would be nice to see some leniency shown.

EDIT: for forgotten "ed"

I indeed was. And about the leniency, we gave that already.

[M6 Redneck]

Could I be permitted to clarify some items.

The aid was not accepted by Amonra. I fail to see how this constitutes backing down on my part. Maybe I could be enlightened upon this as I would hate to be accused of lacking balls?

However the aid was sent in the full knowedge that Amonra would likely not accept it for the following reasons.

A - It makes no financial sense for him, as Haf points out it would waste an aid slot.

B - Amonra in accepting the aid would probably be breaking if not the terms but the spirit of his agreement with i/FOK. I reckon he would be too honourable to take that course.

C - Amonra would likely see no reason to drag others into what is a mess he created. As specially as he knows how dumb I can be.

Now having freely admitted this it could be said the offer of aid was an empty gesture, especially as proved right. This could reopen the possibility of being without balls.

To counter that I would like to say I fully intended to aid a nation at war with i/FOK and if Amonra changes his mind my offer still stands except this time I would send tech and troops inaddition to cash.

Secondly my actions cannot be indicative of Invicta as I am not a member of that alliance. (But as I was for some time and considering my sig an easy error to make).

Now I guess this creates an impass as I have committed at the very least a thought crime against i/FOK if not an act of war within the arbitary set of rules they feel impelled to cast over the cyberverse.

As a way forward I make 2 suggestions.

1 - i/FOK can try and persuade me to their point of view via reasoned arguement and points of logic. (I must caution though, as already alluded to, I am dumb).

2 - I have a duel with an i/FOK nation.

Finally I do have balls, however my cat doesn't. I paid a stranger to cut them off him when he was only little. I like my cat alot. He entertains me by bringing mice home and jumping around and stuff. Considering the above do you really want to go toe to toe with somebody who will spend good money on having something he loves castrated as a baby. Well do ya, punk?

M6

[Dochartaigh]

I mean let's both drop the act. This was about an Invicta member trying to get back at iFOK by aiding someone they were raiding, and iFOK was smart enough to know that, and dealt with it in this way, which was appropriate. However, if this would have been someone giving aid to a friend, I hope iFOK would know to just leave it alone, or maybe give their own guy some aid too. If iFOK were pulling this in a situation other than an Invicta member trying to proxy-fight them, I'd totally be agreeing with HellAngel, and I'd lose a hell of a lot of respect for iFOK. As it is, though, an Invicta member thought he was finding a cute way to hurt iFOK, and iFOK didn't let him get away with it, which is fine by me.

how can 3 million hurt iFOK? seriously? that is the whole issue it seems. if 3 million sent in aid to a tech raid victim can damage iFOK this much, then iFOK is just plain pathetic. seriously makes me wonder if iFOK will whine and cry if they raid a nuke capable nation and then get nuked?

since iFOK came about, FOK has slowly become less and less honorable.

[PX6DEVASTATER]

basically this just comes down to iFok being a whiny little !@#$%* and throwing a fit.

[Wu Tang Clan]

basically this just comes down to iFok being a whiny little !@#$%* and throwing a fit.

Couldn't agree with you more. Someone stands up to there tech raid and they call in their daddy to beat them up. It's classy isn't it? Reminds me off GGA and NPO in a strange way. (Obviously they are very different situations).