Yubyubsan Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Well it was a bit more then "Uh, okay, thanks, I guess", and more "Okay, Ill accept more, we have a deal ship them". But this was already debated, the irc logs scrutinized and interpretations from them made. At this point this is not anymore important really. At this point war isn't about OV at all is it? Thats my boy. +1 How did you guys find out about OV's duplicity anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starcraftmazter Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Probably from their enemies (it's what they did with GATO at least). Last time I checked, NPO has not been at war for three months, with all of it's nations being forced to be in war mode - for 3 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haflinger Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 How did you guys find out about OV's duplicity anyway? mhawk and bigwoody told them. Where does Hoo plan an offensive attack in those logs? Or state that they have planned one?I see prep for defense, not offense. You see what you would like to see. Some of us know better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King DrunkWino Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 You see what you would like to see. Some of us know better. Unfortunately, one word reply's are frowned on. So I had to say all this to say this: Horsehockey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yubyubsan Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 mhawk and bigwoody told them.You see what you would like to see. Some of us know better. Ok, and how did mhawk and bigwoody know? (A tip of the hat to anyone who can see where I'm going with this) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoFish Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 The Hoo-Grinch logs say otherwise.And Chairman Hal used to be Ragnarok government. He's an insider on this issue. Unless I'm mistaken weren't the Hoo-Grinch logs about Rok siding against the NPO in a hypothetical conflict that NPO would have started? And please don't insult me, you can see clearly in the post you quoted that I know who Chairman Hal is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muffasamini Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 (edited) Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO Great War I - No reparations paid. Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War IV - No reparations paid to NPO. Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War 5 -500 tech 58,000 tech 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Edit: Thanks PapaJacky from Legion Edited June 15, 2009 by muffasamini Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironchef Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 I havent read through every page of this (who has time, 173 pages?!?!)I will say this though NPO was very bad in the past. Yup, they did alot of stuff that was considered horrible. Yep they deserve this beatdown. But Karma? stop believing your own propaganda as well. Many, Many of you were directly involved in committing those same "crimes" as you call them. Aside from that, many many of the rest of you sat back and watched it happen and did nothing. Only a very small minority of you actually spoke out against the atrocities as you call them. You say that you're justification for the war isn't FAN GPA, or GATO, but yet you constantly bring them as such. Just admit that they are infact a part of your justifications, because the terms you presented sure as hell aren't inline with an attack on OV. They are terms presented as reparations for every crime you percieve NPO to have ever committed and FAN, GPA, and GATO seem to be very high up on your list of crimes NPO committed. NPO, You complain that the terms are unreasonable. Guess what, it is 2 things. 1) retribution for past "crimes", 2) to destroy your alliance to a point that it will take years to recover from. the current reps solve #1, but they do not accomplish #2 which is why the 90% and 14 days thing come into play. You're counter offer does not accomplish #2. I dont see how any counter offer you could possibly make with accomplish #2 unless you send out all tech and sell off infra. Guess what though. You deserve it. Of course, several of the alliances trying to impose this on you deserve it as well. You however do need to accept the fact that your alliance will not exist as it does today in the future. You will either be a beaten down tech farm, be in permanant peace mode, or be disbanded. Those are going to be the only options that your aggressors allow for you. But don't worry. Karma does not just circle around once and stop. It keeps coming back to bite people in the $@! and those calling themselves karma will eventually be on the other side. ^^^^This!!! Well said KFG. The sad part is no one in Karma or NPO will comment on this post because it speaks the truth. NPO, you need to realize the alliances that make up Karma will never let you remain a sanctioned alliance and will not let you live in this world as you are today or have been in the past. So pick an option forever war, peace mode, or a smack down of a life time, but pick one so your allies can go about doing something other than nailing Jell-O to a tree. Pick one and move on from there. Karma, own up to what it is you are working to accomplish with this war, just spit it out and say what it’s going to take before you let NPO be a free alliance again. No need to lie, or sugar coat things, just say it’s not because they attacked OV but because what they have done in the past and now you have all come together to make them pay. NPO, I wish you luck in whatever path you choose to take. Karma, you have accomplished some big changes on PB and have every right to be proud. But I think it’s time to end this. The longer you keep this war going the less people are going to remember the good things it has caused and they will start to dwell on the ugly side of war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daikos Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO Great War I - No reparations paid. Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War IV - No reparations paid to NPO. Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War 5 -500 tech 58,000 tech 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Edit: Thanks PapaJacky from Legion What's that saying the kids keep using? Oh... right... Tough !@#$. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoFish Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO Great War I - No reparations paid. Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. VE disbanded. NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War IV - No reparations paid to NPO. Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO as no surrender terms were offered. Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. GPA made to re-write their charter, limited to 13 nukes. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. GATO placed under a viceroy. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. GS Disbanded. NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. BDC placed under a viceroy. CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War 5 -500 tech 58,000 tech, decommed HNMS's and WRC 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Edit: Thanks PapaJacky from Legion and NoFish from GOD Fixed just from what I know off the top of my head. C'mon, people, let's work with this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vol Navy Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO Great War I - No reparations paid. Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War IV - No reparations paid to NPO. Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War 5 -500 tech 58,000 tech 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Edit: Thanks PapaJacky from Legion You miss the point. You are also responsible for terms/reps that every other alliance has handed out in the history of Planet Bob, including the terms that GOONs used to hand out for "lulz". Your 1000 man alliance has also single handedly kept down the other 30,000 or so nations on Bob at a given time. Because of your "3 year reign of terror" no one has been able to keep more than 100 infra and 25 tech at a given time in this game. No alliance has prospered, no nation has been capable of growing. Any alliance that posted on the forums was instantly ZI'd and then forced to give their first born to the Pacifican war machine, where those babies were turned into nuclear weapons. This is pretty much what I've learned in this thread. It's very refreshing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO Great War I - No reparations paid. Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War IV - No reparations paid to NPO. Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War 5 -500 tech 58,000 tech 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Edit: Thanks PapaJacky from Legion I recommend reading Azaghul's thread on proportionality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coven Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO Great War I - No reparations paid. Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War IV - No reparations paid to NPO. Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War 5 -500 tech 58,000 tech 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Edit: Thanks PapaJacky from Legion Good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muffasamini Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 I recommend reading Azaghul's thread on proportionality. Fine, propotionality. The karma terms are almost 9x as much as we've ever recieved. For your argument to be valid, the alliances that paid us those reps would need to be 9x smaller than we were at the time of the war. Which is obviously incorrect. And remember, I'm not arguing that this is the reason we denied the terms, far from it. But I am trying to stop the "this is proportional to your crimes" by showing what we've actually done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vilien Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO << Tygaland becomes viceroy of NAAC Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. << This was huge back then ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO << Alliance crushed Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO << Oath of allegiance to Ivan Moldavi, other monetary reparations Great War I - No reparations paid. << You lost this one Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. << http://cybernations.wikia.com/wiki/Great_W...math_of_the_War Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO << Your friends tried to destroy an entire community. Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. << Again, this was worth much more then than it is now, /b/, SWF, LUE, BTA, Syndicate, and NAAC disband The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. << Vladimir appointed Viceroy Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. << CIS forced to move spheres, VE is disbanded NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. << ONOS becomes a viceroyalty FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. << http://cybernations.wikia.com/wiki/FAN-WUT_War#Peace_Terms Great War IV Unjust War - No reparations paid to NPO. << \m/, Genmay, GOLD, EoTRS disband, GOONS destroyed Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. << What? FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. << FAN forced into eternal war, emerges free due to Karma war Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. << What else were you going to take from them? GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. << Viceroyalty, secret terms, etc. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. << Golden Sabres disbands NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. << BDC becomes viceroyalty CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. << CIS destroyed Great War 5 WoTC -500 tech 58,000 tech 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. << Just read the goddamn wiki page Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Blatant disregard for facts. Don't try to argue history with me, young Vladimir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCrotch Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Its not hypocrisy when it is done to correct past wrongs. It is justice. The penalty should naturally be larger than the crime, for two simple reasons: -Repayment for damage caused - 100% of damages -A deterrent and clear message to the community that such behavior will not go unpunished - up to 200-500% of original damages The world should remember that justice will be served. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 (edited) That's a really cute post. Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO Great War I - No reparations paid. Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War IV - No reparations paid to NPO. No alliances disbanded after this right? *rolls eyes* Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN under eternal war until a month ago plus a bit. Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. GPA destroyed for no good reason other than their size. GPA made to re-write their charter, limited to 13 nukes. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. GATO under a viceroy. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. GS disbanded. NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. BDC under a viceroy. CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. CIS disbanded. Great War 5 -500 tech 58,000 tech 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Edit: Thanks PapaJacky from Legion Keeping it alive! Add on what you remember! Oh vilien. http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...t&p=1617457 does it better D: Edited June 15, 2009 by Penlugue Solaris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UberSpion Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO Great War I - No reparations paid. Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War IV - No reparations paid to NPO. Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War 5 -500 tech 58,000 tech 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Edit: Thanks PapaJacky from Legion what about all the alliances forced to disband due to the reps requests or terms? p.s. i before e except after c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 (edited) Fine, propotionality. The karma terms are almost 9x as much as we've ever recieved. For your argument to be valid, the alliances that paid us those reps would need to be 9x smaller than we were at the time of the war. Which is obviously incorrect. And remember, I'm not arguing that this is the reason we denied the terms, far from it. But I am trying to stop the "this is proportional to your crimes" by showing what we've actually done So its alright to disband NPO or put you in a position where disbandment or eternal war are the only possibilities? Since that is the worst you have done arguably Oh, and this is apparently what NPO wants. Remember guys, it is about being fair. Let's do to them what they did to others, and they totally will not complain..ohwait. Edited June 15, 2009 by Penlugue Solaris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandmdave Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO Great War I - No reparations paid. Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War IV - No reparations paid to NPO. Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War 5 -500 tech 58,000 tech 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Edit: Thanks PapaJacky from Legion Did you adjust for inflation? Back in the day even 100 members above 4K infra and 1K tech and with a myriad of wonders was a huge acheivement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Flinders Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 Theres all sorts of posts about how NPO deserves such harsh terms to be in line with all the evil things we've done. So heres a list of all those evil terms we've done in those evil wars we viciously started. First Arctic War - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Citrus War - $500,000 paid to NPO. ICSN Debacle - Unknown reparations paid or not paid to NPO Second Polar War - No reparations Paid to NPO Great War I - No reparations paid. Great War II - No repartions paid to NPO. Holy War of Farkistan - No reparations paid to NPO Great War III - $800,000,000 paid to NPO and pals. The Alaskan Folly - No reparations paid to NPO. Green Civil War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-ONOS War - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-WUT War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War IV - No reparations paid to NPO. Reeducation of Devildogs - No reparations paid to NPO. FAN-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Continuum-GPA War - 10,000 technology or $300,000,000 paid to NPO. Wolfpack War - 3,600 technology paid to NPO. GATO-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Golden Sabres War - No reparations paid to NPO. NPO-BDC War - No reparations paid to NPO. CIS-1V War - No reparations paid to NPO. Great War 5 -500 tech 58,000 tech 2,000 tech 8,000 tech Total Great War 5 Reparations = 68,500 Technology. Total Reparations New Pacific Order Recieved: $800,500,000 and 82,100 Technology. Karma Terms: $7,000,000,000,000 and 300,000 technology. Karma demands roughly 8.75x more money than NPO got from her wars, and Roughly 3.65x the Technology NPO recieved from her wars. Edit: Thanks PapaJacky from Legion Did you really just use FAN as an example of how NPO is getting the short end of the stick? Really? Really?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 You see what you would like to see. Some of us know better. "If NPO attacks Gremlins we will side against them" is the point of those logs. Whatever manipulation you attempt to pull is slander (IC slander, not OOC or anything related to mod actions) against Hoo imo. His intention had nothing to do with what you are attempting to force the logs to mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pingu Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 I am trying to stop the "this is proportional to your crimes" by showing what we've actually done Given what Bob has learned about Realpolitik and power from NPO's history, the point must surely be at least as much prophylactic as punitive. The key figure in your long list of conflicts that NPO was involved in is that connected to the Great Stupid War aka GW1. No reparations. Nothing, in fact, beyond empty promises of change and lessons learned on the part of Pacifica. Such things cannot be trusted, as we have seen. So the present conflict must significantly reduce NPO's capacity to return to its previous ways. Whether the terms as offered are the most efficient way of doing that or not, the only reasonable terms must achieve that end. So if NPO is considering further counter-offers, they must take into account that forward perspective more than the debate about whether terms are 'just punishment' for past 'crimes.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ogaden Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 (edited) The Vindictive Coalition desires our complete subjugation and destruction, yet is by and large too cowardly to say so out loud, thus the arguments about 'proportionality' and 'justice', when in fact the mathematics involved usually revolve around "how can we do as much PERMANENT damage as possible?" Edited June 15, 2009 by James Dahl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquilos Posted June 15, 2009 Report Share Posted June 15, 2009 So since you've added it to the conversation, what exactly is the price of reps for making an alliance disband? Can you set a dollar figure on that? Or is your goal simply to make it years before NPO can ever dream of being sanctioned again? At least admit it if it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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