Imperial Decree from the New Pacific Order

[SFBlade]

wow, what a lot of typing. i read the first and last page, i can't even imagine what is in the middle. Really who cares what NPO did or what karma is doing. In another 6 months or when ever it is we have another war it will be another alliance and more tech/money. Just sit back and relax, watch the reruns!!!

[Roadie]

I'm not trying to tell anybody what to do, but as somebody on the hegemony side of the current conflict, I really must advise hegemony members to not get in a swordfight with Grub about an ancient war. It's the antithesis of what you should be doing. No matter who brought it up or how wrong or right anybody is.

[BarbulaM1]

every just stop and take a breather please. I think this thread is getting way off topic and nothing is getting resolved.

So everyone please just step back take a breather in a room full of angry people posting he said , they said, they did this that or the other thing isnt getting anything resolved.

so just stop.. Please ( no offense too anyone )

1) NPO has done bad things in its past.

2) Allot of other players and nations have done things bad in the past too

3) NPO started this war

4) KARMA stepped up and beat NPO and allies down

5) NPO Admited defeat

6) MOO Declared that any alliance is free too make red sphere their home.

7) MOO publicly Applogised to GATO, and some KARMA feel its a false appology

8) Negotiations took place too end this war

9) KARMA made their Offer , Which was rejected by NPO due too the 90% /14 mandatory war

10) NPO/ MOO made counter offer of MORE money for reps in exchange for dropping the 90% mandatory war, KARMA rejected

11) Negotiations ended and multiple posts in this thread state KARMA will not alter the terms.

12) KARMA members claim that we have 181 banks sitting in PM, As a NPO who is in PM, I can honestly say we DONT have 181 banks

And yes i havent forgetten that KARMA is using this war too Punish NPO for every bad thing that has happened in the game. Contrary too popular belief, yes we have done alot too get people mad. but there are some posts laying blame on NPO for things we didnt do. and im not goin back thru 2500 posts too find all the quotes that would just drive me insane.

Id like too eventually have some kind of decent or reasonable peace.. the only way this can happen is too try and work it out instead of the back and forth slam posts. I dont care about all the back and forth blah blah blah. that stuff gave me 4 headaches just trying too read over 2500 posts, Sorry

soo Please everyone just STOP posting for a bit, calm down and then come back and discuss it like Adults and not like a bunch elementary kids arguing on the playground..

Please

Thank you

What if I diverge from the norm and say I believe the apology might be real. But I believe that it is not enough and skimps around the 1 year that we spent together.

[AlmightyGrub]

And what do you expect, that we accept this rubbish of terms? That we let every single Order nation to get hit hard in this war and then pay gazillions of dollars.

Well, sorry we don't play ball like that. Our stance is natural to take for anybody in our position. Sorry to anybody for feeling greatly insulted by the fact we dont want to get utterly annihilated. Actually no, not sorry.

We are evil for trying to avoid that. Ah that ebil NPO, is to blame for everything.

The NPO is to blame for what it did, which is far less than claimed.

Accept the terms or don't, but don't use the same defense we tried to, the defense you debunked and ridiculed with us and the same defense you did not allow us to use.... then deny same.

The terms are !@#$%^&*, you know it and I know it. Getting better terms would be greatly assisted by the lack of this thread and the lack of drone posts in it. The terms are set for the same reasons as ours were, to cripple you forever. It didn't work with us and it wont work with you if you are as smart as you claim to be. Accept the !@#$%^&* terms, or don't, the choice is yours and nothing to do with me until you start speaking !@#$%^&* about Polaris.

[Sal Paradise]

What would you have us do, Emperor Grub?

What was our proper reaction when you started sending aid to Greenland Republic, while you still had access to our forums and the general membership IRC channels?

Should we have pointed out which nations in particular in Greenland Republic really needed aid because their NPO targets were winning?

As GR government during the beginning of the war, I don't recall anyone requesting aid because their NPO targets were winning. It was more OG and NEW that gave us the toughest fight.

Just to clarify.

[wickedj]

Instead of guessing how many banks we have, maybe this should have been something spoken about in peace talks to find out exactly how many we have.

Secondly, we did not help to put crippling terms on Polaris. We have never put terms on Polaris. Do you know why? We've never fought them. As much as you'd like to believe we're the "big bad puppetmasters", we're not.

Lastly, we're willing to pay. More than willing. We even proposed alterations to the terms that would pay more than what had been asked of us. All we ask is for that 90%/14 days thing to be removed. Also, allowing for every nation we have to send reps instead of limiting who can send it would be nice.

Good sir, you owe me one new keyboard as the rootbeer i had been drinking is now on my keyboard after a fit of laughter

[jimbacher]

Hate? You have to be kidding me. Seriously, I didn't burn the bridge, but now it is I will ensure it never gets rebuilt. I learned much about the NPO in the last few weeks, you are singly the most reactive and defensive group I have ever come across. Anyone who doesn't fall into goose step with you is immediately trashed regardless of the circumstances.

Moo called me naive once, he was right. I have been naive, I believed in trying to work with the NPO for such a long time when every other person in the world told me I was mental. I guess they were right and I was was wrong, all the efforts were in vain because we didn't want to fight for you to the death like you did for us in the SPW. Your BR might have been all butt hurt about what was happening, but your BR didn't exactly march to our defense either.

Polaris made some mistakes during this war, I know things didn't go the way we would have liked, but your constant need to pump yourselves up at our expense is a fair indication that you don't actually like us. We have accepted it and moved on. There is no brotherhood, no ''Orders'' and the concept is deader than dead.

It would have been easier to enter the war on the other side than support you, but we have made it clear we do not support Karma and their blatant agenda either. Our allies, ones that actually lifted a finger to fight in our defense, were all lined up against you and we resisted considerable pressures to roll tanks against you. But you are free to overlook that, free to spin it however you like but do not start spreading the !@#$%^&* lines that you wont do what you expected everyone else to do when commanded.

LULZ, just so you know, I personally don't give a damn about terms. I left NPO to fight for TPF during this war because they wouldn't let me post on the OWF. I am at 4 infra and 0 .04 tech(down from 8k infra), and yet I still think your sore #$$ is funny. I could see the writing on the wall awhile ago as well Grub, you aren't the only person here with half a brain(funny because most of OWF has less than that). Maybe you guys should have entered the war on the other side then(Again just take out your !@#$ on me and not the NPO or TPF since I alone and smacking a hornets nest with a stick), since if that is the way your membership feels you guys may as well. There is still time Grub go and do it(and I mean declare war on me not everyone else ), you might manage to knock away my last 4 infra, I know that would make you happy.

EDIT: Nothing that I say here should be construed to be either the views of the TPF or the NPO. These views are those of myself and have no sponser

Edited June 14, 2009 by jimbacher

[Branimir]

Accept the !@#$%^&* terms, or don't, the choice is yours and nothing to do with me until you start speaking !@#$%^&* about Polaris.

We didn't start speaking about Polaris. We didn't even mention your alliance. We dont want to come for you or do we hate you Grub.

The thing is what it is, brotherhood gone, but we are not here to provoke you.

We are here to try to stand our ground, the last ground we have to stand on. It has nothing to do with you and all with us and our enemies and haters.

And it is our choice, for better or worse.

Edited June 14, 2009 by Branimir

[Ogaden]

We didn't start speaking about Polaris. We didn't even mention your alliance. We dont want to come for you or do we hate you Grub.

The thing is what it is, brotherhood gone, but we are not here to provoke you.

We are here to try to stand our ground, the last ground we have to stand on. It has nothing to do with you and all with us and our enemies and haters.

And it is our choice, for better or worse.

Well said.

[mhawk]

LULZ, just so you know, I personally don't give a damn about terms. I left NPO to fight for TPF during this war because they wouldn't let me post on the OWF. I am at 4 infra and 0 .04 tech(down from 8k infra), and yet I still think your sore #$$ is funny. I could see the writing on the wall awhile ago as well Grub, you aren't the only person here with half a brain(funny because most of OWF has less than that). Maybe you guys should have entered the war on the other side then, since if that is the way your membership feels you guys may as well. There is still time Grub go and do it, you might manage to knock away my last 4 infra, I know that would make you happy.

Grub has helped TPF on some important issues that came up during this war, please be respectful of that help. What happened with the orders, needs to stay with the orders. Not our place to comment on it.

Edited June 14, 2009 by mhawk

[Seerow]

95% on a bad month? Azaghul was just in this thread saying how MK was averaging 80% when sending reps. Either you have some supernatural organizational skills that reach into [ooc] RL[/ooc] or your math is off.

And an average of 3 days late can come from many places; 1 slot not being used (or able to be used), a nation going inactive (sorry to bust your bubble, but a lot of these nations will [ooc]be going away for a week or so over the summer. Don't expect vacation plans to be cancelled because someone on an online game is being silly[/ooc] or people just missing an update. Sure, we can manage one specific aid cycle at a high efficiency, but take about thirty-five aid cycles, and things will drop off somewhat at points.

Azaghul and I differ in several of our methods, from what I understand. Also realize my efforts were mostly around the time of MK paying back reps and rebuilding from the UJW, possibly one of their most active periods, so it is possible I am biased in my opinion from this experience. I may also question Aza's number of 80%, I doubt he had calculated it the same way you are because I find it hard to believe the average MK member is sending their aid two days late. If they are that is something I never would have accepted in my time there.

However during the time I was there I was incredibly active, on days we had aid going out Id be on 10+ hours a day making sure everything was going where it should be, and recruiting temps to cover anyone who wasn't available to make sure we kept on schedule. Part of the reason I decided to step down as LHT was because I couldn't handle those activity levels anymore, and wanted to defer to someone who would be better able to keep up with it. Of course there were other factors but that is another discussion entirely.

I realize the 1k tech restriction would hinder the ability to get cover for anyone missing, but even then it's not unreasonable. I'd still say a 85-90% completion rate should not be out of the question, and think your 70% numbers are very much below par.

As to the summer vacations, you have nation sitting as an option as always. Indeed for the most part it should lead to higher activity levels within the alliance because people aren't busy with homework or whatever.

Personally were I the one directing the terms I'd say 1/3 of the tech had to be paid by someone with 1k tech or more, but wouldn't care who sent the money, and the other 2/3 of the tech. As far as I'm concerned the tech coming from large tech nations is a penalty specifically to them to make them shed excess tech, or even buy more tech to send off, and it should stay. It was one of the few twists Karma has put on their terms that I approve of, as it is a better form of punishment than just reps from anyone.

However the amount doesn't need to be so high, the rest can be generated as it is in every other similar situation.

[Nintenderek]

We have no plans to attack you, Emperor Grub. As far as I know we never had and never will.

I wish you would have read that thread I linked you to earlier.

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...t=0&start=0

[Ragashingo]

Oh please, you can't believe anything coming out of Doitzel's mouth.

I know this was several pages ago and I suspect plenty have told you that you are wrong, but its worth repeating.

You are wrong. Wake up and join us in reality.

[Ogaden]

I wish you would have read that thread I linked you to earlier.

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...t=0&start=0

Even in the long winded expose of the absolute nadir of our relations, we still never planned on attacking them.

For the record, I have read all of the various dirty laundry of our history.

[Delta1212]

Even in the long winded expose of the absolute nadir of our relations, we still never planned on attacking them.

For the record, I have read all of the various dirty laundry of our history.

I'm not sure how you're going to take this, but you really do remind me a bit of HeinousOne back in his NPO days. Possibly a bit more well-spoken, but very similar all the same.

[Gn0xious Jr]

Stop blaming Pacifica. They weren't the one railing for war.

Stop fooling yourself, NPO knew full well what would happen when they attacked OV.

Perhaps they didn't know that the Hegemony would fall to pieces, but they knew that the defensive pacts would be activated with OV's allies.

[Ogaden]

I wonder where NPO's respect for sovereignty was when they took away GPA's nukes for a year.

I think we would prefer GPA's terms to the ones we were offered.

[Ogaden]

I'm not sure how you're going to take this, but you really do remind me a bit of HeinousOne back in his NPO days. Possibly a bit more well-spoken, but very similar all the same.

HeinousOne has mentioned this to me before.

[Teriethien]

Even in the long winded expose of the absolute nadir of our relations, we still never planned on attacking them.

For the record, I have read all of the various dirty laundry of our history.

Teriethien chokes.

[18:52] <Dilber|dinner> I expect we'll have to kill them in 1-2 months

[18:52] <Dilber|dinner> but they'll die easy

No you didn't plan to attack Polar, you just wanted to kill them.

[fupresti]

Even in the long winded expose of the absolute nadir of our relations, we still never planned on attacking them.

For the record, I have read all of the various dirty laundry of our history.

Sure, you never actually inserted the knife into the back of Polaris but you paid for it, sharpened it, trained the user how to thrust it and promised to reward them afterward.

[Nintenderek]

Even in the long winded expose of the absolute nadir of our relations, we still never planned on attacking them.

For the record, I have read all of the various dirty laundry of our history.

From that thread.

[18:52] <Dilber|dinner> I expect we'll have to kill them in 1-2 months (referring to Polar)

[18:52] <Dilber|dinner> but they'll die easy

EDIT: Damn, Teriethien beat me to it while I was going through the entire post looking for it

Edited June 14, 2009 by Nintenderek

[Hydro]

I think we would prefer GPA's terms to the ones we were offered.

I'm suprised KARMA didn't demand for the NPO's immediate disbandment. Consider yourselves lucky to even be offered terms.

[Derka Derek]

Well, guess I'll stick my head in this topic since everyone else in the cyberverse already has one hundred times. I got to page 30 or so before I gave up trying to read the whole damn thread, so forgive me if I've missed anything.

First off, people really don't know the meaning of the word Karma, however instead of just pointing this fact out I'll assist the unknowing individuals. There are many meanings of the word Karma, however they all mean the same thing in principle.

The doctrine of fate as the inflexible result of cause and effect; the theory of inevitable consequence.

(Both bad and good I must add.)

Now, what that does really mean is "what goes around, comes around". I have throughout the entire course of this conflict, always thought that Karma wished to 'give' to NPO what they have 'given' to so many others. Being a long time player, I understand this wish, for I too have witnessed quite a few things I don't agree with.

Some apparently see this as nothing but revenge, well revenge, in it's own way, is similar to Karma. You see the form of karma that's going around right now is that of revenge. By that I of course mean individuals taking revenge on other individuals that have formerly wronged them (as well as many others). I'll admit I've heard the phrase "two wrongs don't make a right". In my humble opinion, what's happening right now is not wrong, no it's not wrong at all, in fact, it couldn't be more right. It's not wrong because it's deserved, the NPO in my eyes deserve what is happening to them and they deserve the terms that they've gotten. I know that many of you have not been with us in this community on Planet Bob long enough to witness with your own eyes the atrocities that the NPO have, countless times dished out to many alliances. However I can assure you the atrocities have been many and they have been great. Many alliances have done similar, some are a part Karma I've heard, but none to the extent of the New Pacific Order.

Now, a little overview, just so no one overlooks any of my main points here. It is to the best of my knowledge that Karma wanted to give to the NPO what the NPO have been giving out to many alliances for the past two years. The whole purpose of Karma (I believe) was to decimate the Order as terribly as they have decimated others. There is no mercy involved in that plan whatsoever, which I'm fine with to be quite honest. So there you have it, my straight up opinion.

It's truly beyond any man to be able to grasp every last detail that's happening right now. Everyone just kind of throws in their own little part of the story and then picks a side. Besides, these huge PR wars are hugely unnecessary, but so amazingly fun to watch and be a part of.

Edited June 14, 2009 by Derka Derek

[flak attack]

I think we would prefer GPA's terms to the ones we were offered.

GPA did nothing. You did something. Criminals deserve a worse punishment than the innocent.

I'm not sure how you're going to take this, but you really do remind me a bit of HeinousOne back in his NPO days. Possibly a bit more well-spoken, but very similar all the same.

God did I hate him back then. Good to see he's changed as much as he has.

Edited June 14, 2009 by flak attack

[NoFish]

I think we would prefer GPA's terms to the ones we were offered.

Really? You'd prefer to never be allowed to have more than 13 nukes (as an alliance) ever again? I think we might be able to come to an agreement on terms, my good man.