A Message from the Emperor of the New Pacific Order

[brucemania]

Facts? So are you admitting to me that I'm correct, and that the terms on the table are actually more lenient to NPO than the ones that Farrin offered?

 

Well, thank you then. That's all I wanted to hear. :)

 

Putting the blame? The implication here is clearly that NPO isn't actually responsible for the post-war fracturing of the eQ coalition. If you aren't, then who is? I'll leave the question open to some of the former eQ member alliances to answer.

 

It was a joint effort through a lot of the coalition members internally when it comes down to it.  and i am not admitting to you being correct on anything when all is said in done but then again you want to spin and twist something for you to use as fact. Lets face it this is TOPs modus operandi. You use people and then twist things to your own benefit. going back to even the TOP/IRON against Polar war during peace terms you went for reps even though IRON if i recall did not want them even though after about two or three rounds IRON did all the work after Polar was knocked down and you sat by until the talks and collected reps. You pissed IRON off then and you did it again this war from what the world hears. I had actually predicated at the beginning of this conflict and told people what you would do this war with terms or reps becoming part of the process. It is what you guys do and then after all is said and done you blame the other guy. You may currently have the political gain you are seeking right now but on thing i am sure this war has done is woke up a few people. I am will probably be correct in the next few months a couple of our current coalition will actually see the same and they will fracture away regardless how this ends.

[Starfox101]

 

Sure ...what ever you say. The goal is for you guys to not only hamper our 30 nations and with it the recovery process we use. In doing so as well you hoping to fracture the coalition and put the total blame on NPO that this war continues longer. If you had any thought of actually ending the war with any terms they would be less as you know we will not settle for hampering our lower tiers recovery. If you had good intentions then you would of conceded by now for them nations to be able to send aid to lower tier nations and if tech was your only concern about the upper tiers then you would put a limited restriction on the ability to for them nations to acquire tech. Your using these facts to try and splinter our side and as well put the blame on us that this process is not being finnished. Same tactic i would assume that used to get them from the EQ side to join your coalition in putting the blame totally on us for EQ as well.

 

It's everyone's fault but yours!

 

And please, enough with the vague predictions of the future. I remember how the last vague predictions turned out for NG and NSO. 

Edited January 31, 2014 by Starfox101

[Krashnaia]

 

 

Wait, weren't IRON and XX among the loudest voices insisting DH needed to go down in the run up to the last war?  And wasn't it XX who disregarded our coalition's plans and forced our allies to come in on the opposite side?

 

No, it was NPO who screwed up everyone else so that their allies on the other side would get an easy ride. Then you attempted to frame XX for the fiasco but, as the current events show, no one bought your bullshit.

[brucemania]

 

It's everyone's fault but yours!

 

i said it was a combination of everyone not just NPO ..and thanks i look hot there :)

Edited January 31, 2014 by brucemania

[Starfox101]

 

i said it was a combination of everyone not just NPO ..and thats i look hot there :)

Is this combination a 99% to 1% or...what?

[hartfw]

 

 

 

Wait, weren't IRON and XX among the loudest voices insisting DH needed to go down in the run up to the last war?  And wasn't it XX who disregarded our coalition's plans and forced our allies to come in on the opposite side?

 

 

 

No, it was NPO who screwed up everyone else so that their allies on the other side would get an easy ride. Then you attempted to frame XX for the fiasco but, as the current events show, no one bought your !@#$%^&*.

 

I'm not sure he's wrong.  IRON was one of the loudest down with DH voices when they were around, and XX did counter and bring NG in regardless of all the plans to avoid that.  

 

That said, that doesn't make there be any truth in the revisionist NPO had no interest in any demands and saved DH from harsh demands, and brehon made no secret out of blaming XX and explaining that they were only in it for themselves and thus screwed the coalition, in a way that didn't make it seem likely the two would be on the same side going forward.

[brucemania]

 

 

 

 

I'm not sure he's wrong.  IRON was one of the loudest down with DH voices when they were around, and XX did counter and bring NG in regardless of all the plans to avoid that.  

 

That said, that doesn't make there be any truth in the revisionist NPO had no interest in any demands and saved DH from harsh demands, and brehon made no secret out of blaming XX and explaining that they were only in it for themselves and thus screwed the coalition, in a way that didn't make it seem likely the two would be on the same side going forward.

 

sshh dont tell no one .. i aint right if it is not NPO get blamed for everything :)

[Caliph]

With how many wars have targeted NPO lately, these terms offered to NPO seem more like an offer for them to voluntarily damage themselves to make it easier on whatever alliances are pushing these terms to put NPO in the same position where they need to accept terms in the next war against them again, then the next one after that, etc. If that is the case it makes much more sense for NPO to continue fighting until they are given a reasonable peace and damage their enemies as their NS goes down, instead of voluntarily reducing their strength as those opposing them rebuild for next time during that.

 

The last war targetting NPO was DH/NPO war a few years ago.  With a track record of once every 2-3 years, that ain't bad at all.

 

 

NPO are getting screwed for honouring a treaty. Try again.

 

 

This is nothing new.  Get over yourself.   Try again.

[Starfox101]

 

The last war targetting NPO was DH/NPO war a few years ago.  With a track record of once every 2-3 years, that ain't bad at all.

 

 

 

 

This is nothing new.  Get over yourself.   Try again.

Get with the times. Any war that includes NPO is automatically about them due to their center of the universe mentality. It's also never their fault for any mistakes, and they are always the victim - no matter what. If you wish to debate any of this, you're clearly a TOP puppet!

[Daimos]

Get with the times. Any war that includes NPO is automatically about them due to their center of the universe mentality. It's also never their fault for any mistakes, and they are always the victim - no matter what. If you wish to debate any of this, you're clearly a TOP puppet!

 

The NpO coalition made this about NPO when they decided to levy terms on Pacifica in a conflict we did not start.  Hence we are all still at war because of it.  It’s really that simple.

[Starfox101]

 

The NpO coalition made this about NPO when they decided to levy terms on Pacifica in a conflict we did not start.  Hence we are all still at war because of it.  It’s really that simple.

Like I said:

 

It isn't your fault.

It's all about Pacifica. 

You are the victim.

TOP bad. NpO ebil. 

 

We don't need thirty Pacificans spouting the same nonsense. I'll summarize it all here for you and you can all quote this post whenever you feel like making an argument against someone, because this is the only content of every post I see from Pacificans.

[Stefano Palmieri]

Get with the times. Any war that includes NPO is automatically about them due to their center of the universe mentality. It's also never their fault for any mistakes, and they are always the victim - no matter what. If you wish to debate any of this, you're clearly a TOP puppet!

You're giving TOP far too much credit. Umbrella have had a raging hard on for/obsession that's borderline creepy with NPO for years (and its almost as if there's a precedent for them going nocb on NPO and getting others to do the heavy lifting for them).

[brucemania]

Like I said:

 

It isn't your fault.

It's all about Pacifica. 

You are the victim.

TOP bad. NpO ebil. 

 

We don't need thirty Pacificans spouting the same nonsense. I'll summarize it all here for you and you can all quote this post whenever you feel like making an argument against someone, because this is the only content of every post I see from Pacificans.

 

 

Now now thirty people can not be wrong and you the only person to be right ... tell me it aint so

[WarriorSoul]

Having read this entire thread at one sitting

 

A little break in the tension:

 

WHY WOULD YOU DO THAT?

[Amossio]

You're giving TOP far too much credit. Umbrella have had a raging hard on for/obsession that's borderline creepy with NPO for years (and its almost as if there's a precedent for them going nocb on NPO and getting others to do the heavy lifting for them).

hahaha I agree, all us, we're the masterminds behind everything! I think the general consensus around our membership for the terms are disbandment, all leaders are to retire from public faces into GPA. Please be aware part of the terms will also apply to TLR, except in terms of disbanding I'm sure you lads can do that all by yourselves, say hi to rush, I still love him. 

[Stefano Palmieri]

hahaha I agree, all us, we're the masterminds behind everything! I think the general consensus around our membership for the terms are disbandment, all leaders are to retire from public faces into GPA. Please be aware part of the terms will also apply to TLR, except in terms of disbanding I'm sure you lads can do that all by yourselves, say hi to rush, I still love him. 

I never said you were masterminds, just you can never let the NPO thing go and iirc DH-NPO was your idea and yall did let GOONS and MK do all the work. But I guess this is the owf and you will just make up whatever you want from my posts *shrugs*

Also thé disbanding thing was cute the first time Goldie and Pearl came out with that BS. Edited January 31, 2014 by Stefano Palmieri

[trimm]

So many you didn't mention one of importance in response and instead direct people to read through 43 pages of mostly nonsense to maybe find what you're hinting at. All I need is one good reason to be convinced, not whatever nonsense reasons you don't think are even worth repeating.

You could have literally gone back one stinking page in the thread. Stop being so lazy. I am not going to reapaet myself just because poor little Methrage decided to jump in on the end of a conversation and doesn't want to do any legwork for himself. Cry me a bleeding river, then build yourself a bridge and get over it.

[Neo Uruk]

You could have literally gone back one stinking page in the thread. Stop being so lazy. I am not going to reapaet myself just because poor little Methrage decided to jump in on the end of a conversation and doesn't want to do any legwork for himself. Cry me a bleeding river, then build yourself a bridge and get over it.

To be completely fair, going back one page in this thread requires reading this monstrosity.

[iamthey]

Having read this entire thread at one sitting, I'm going to reply to the only posts worth a damn.

There should quite honestly be a medal for this. It's not the casualty count that makes the man, but the psychological torments endured while reading these terrible threads.
 

This is all you need to know about TOP's motivations here.  Well, that and their ruthless desire to be a Hegemony even more dominant than NPO's at its heyday.  But who could fault them, any alliance that gets powerful enough dreams of godhood.  We certainly did. :)

In reality this is actually retribution for mary's ban on huggles. Edited January 31, 2014 by iamthey

[Starfox101]

 

A little break in the tension:

 

WHY WOULD YOU DO THAT?

I'm not sure how I missed that. You are a god among mortals.

 

 

 

Now now thirty people can not be wrong and you the only person to be right ... tell me it aint so

If you're assuming I'm alone you wouldn't be in this situation, now, would you? Wishful thinking, though. 

[Neo Uruk]

In reality this is actually retribution for mary's ban on huggles.

In that case we should never cave!

[Letum]

It isn't your fault.

It is our fault for not allowing the previous war to cripple DH-sphere enough to prevent them from coming back at us (and blocking people enough to get them to stop going after DH), and also our fault for preventing the attack on Polar back when it still had (a dubious) chance of success.
 

It's all about Pacifica.

Pacifica, at this point, is a fairly secondary cog in a strategic game involving XX, TOP and IRON. NPO just happens to be louder.
 

You are the victim.

TOP and Polaris are the victims of our intransigence and attempts to exploit this war so as to damage their PR position.
 

TOP bad. NpO ebil.

TOP has shown themselves to be one of the most competent (politically and technically) alliances, and the biggest winners of this conflict. NpO, whilst less strategically savant, has shown an undue level of moralist backbone that might well not even be in their best interest.

[Amossio]

I never said you were masterminds, just you can never let the NPO thing go and iirc DH-NPO was your idea and yall did let GOONS and MK do all the work. But I guess this is the owf and you will just make up whatever you want from my posts *shrugs*

Also thé disbanding thing was cute the first time Goldie and Pearl came out with that BS.

Well since I have no idea who you even are, I'm not exactly going to take you seriously, especially as to what you're saying is assumption, obsessed, now that's cute. Talking about cute, my statement wasn't cute, just an observation based on your alliances great activity levels.....On a serious note, how is it we're not letting NPO "thing" go?? Could you clarify what you mean by thing as well?? Please also describe how and who we're using to our heavy lifting as per your other idiotic statement?? 

Edited January 31, 2014 by Amossio

[OsRavan]

Worthy? Deserve? Are you high?

This is politics. And, as a famous scholar once said, War is an extension of politics by other means. Your side lost. The other side won, and is attempting to leverage that victory to accomplish a political goal. It has literally zero to do with worthiness or deservedness.

 

Politics matter.  If you think it is the only thing that motivates... in this game or in life... than you have my pity.

 

No one on the NPO side is forcing top or polar to adopt our code of honor.  But nor will we be forced to abandon it by them.

 

Some of us recognize that reps and terms should NOT be the default.  That the default should be an honorable war fought to defend allies, mutual respect between opponents, and then a hand shake and you go your separate ways... to those of us that believe that, than there are some principles more important than post war standing or politics.  A foreign concept to you i gather? ::Grins::.

 

You may mock the concept of friends greater than infra.  But your mocking it doesn't change the fact that many of us embrace it.  We don't give a damn about any stat except maybe casualties.

 

Here is the reality that is frustrating the top/polar coalition and making them turn red in the face.  Making you spit, curse, insult, and spin.  You have the power to win the war, but you dont have the power to make us adhere to your world view.  You can't make an alliance care for their pixels more than their honor. You cant make an alliance surrender and accept terms.  This, on a side note, is what made MK so great.  Its a shame that top despite all the mkers in it has forgotten this lesson.  MK's strength is that they didnt let infra, politics, or fear of the future bind them down.  They just did what they felt was right even if the rest of the world hated them for it.  And know what? They usually carried the day.  Cause if a nation truly doesnt care about getting rolled, you can't threaten them into toeing your line.

 

So ultimately, top can't win if they refuse to compromise and offer terms that our side feel are not abusive.  Can't win.  Because *top* by their actions are demonstrating they clearly care about their political position and their pixels post war.  You care about tech and status and power over principle.  And that's your Achilles heel.

 

Because if your enemy doesnt care... well then you can beat on that enemy till the cows come home and then scratch your head and scream "why arent they surrendering!  We would surrender!"  And ultimately if top cares about their post war standing, it will reach a point where continued beating on NPO and allies to force terms becomes counter productive and is hurting you in achieving what YOU care about... politics.

 

TLDR: you can only ZI and ZT a nation.  There's nothing else you can do beyond that.  IF an alliance is willing to face that on a principle... than you have no threat to hang over their head.  And no way to force them to accept your demands. 

 

 

I am one who generally hates "Private Channels for the win!" with a passion, but I can think of few things that would harden the stance of my opponents towards negotiating more than what Farrin has done here. Especially given the echo chamber that is the OWF, whose minds could he reasonably expect to change here? Certainly not any of the people whose opinions he would actually need to change given the circumstances.

 

I think you are confusing the point of this thread Trimm.  The point is not to weaken or harden tops stance.  The issue we faced, as that top and polar were spreading misinformation.

 

Some examples: They were claiming different reasons for the terms to different people while telling our coalition that the reasons were secret.

They were giving multiple answers as to who actually wanted terms.

Ive heard several made up stories of not just why they want terms (including in this thread) but what the terms were.

Do you know some in tops coalition thought NPO had agreed to terms already?

 

The thread was making clear NPO's stance.  Nothing more, nothing less.  There was no demand for top to do x y or z.  Simply a clarification of what NPO would and would not do.  I think it telling that apparently top and polar are so embarrassed about their actions they want to hide them from bob.

 

 

I say it again trimm.  I always tell alliances. IF your stance and your demands hold merit... why can't you say it openly?  And if you are afraid to conduct your affairs in the open, maybe you need to rethink your stance.

 

Why don't we have negotiations right here.  On the OWF.  In the public before the eyes of all.  What is there to hide?  Lets lay it all out there.  Each side states their reasons for all to see and what we want.  I dont think my side will be embarrassed to do that.

 

Let's try to keep this civil, shall we?

You are the current head of the opposing sphere, and will continue to be so. Thus, it makes perfect sense to keep you knocked down for as long as possible. Secondly, you continue to overlook the very real fact that many of those seeking to impose terms upon you have very strong and persistant grudges against you. Which is also, in their minds, a pretty compelling reason to keep you down as long as possible. Given the generally fractious nature of coalitions here, I highly doubt there is some nefarious future plot going that extends beyond seeing NSO/NG/NPO get theirs.

Are you then implying that no matter what NPO does, even if NPO takes no aggressive action, if they gain too much NS top will try to take them down as a safety measure? Because they would be a threat then and need to be knocked down for as long as possible? Is that what our planet has turned into?

 

 

[trimm]

I implied no such thing. I am only speaking to what I percive the objectives of the winning coalition to be. Those objectives are not rooted in some grand nefarious scheme to cripple Pacifica for life, or even beyond a relatively short span of time. For the record, I have also not once said I agree with them.

Secondly, I don't have to embrace or share your worldview any more than you do mine. But I also don't have to choose to play by your rules just because you follow them. And the fact of the matter is that your coalition has pretty definitvely lost this war. So if the winners seek to impose a resolution to this conflict that is in keeping with the ideas that they play by, then you can cry to the heavens as to how much you don't like it, but short of a millitary victory on your part you lack the ability to meaningfully alter it.