PMoses Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote name='Mogar' timestamp='1309723580' post='2747853'] I dont have less than 70% spy odds on any legion member in my range, how hard is it to buy 50 spies? [/quote] That's five million dollars Mogar, and if you have been reading the worldly spy reports floating around, they don't have the money to spare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Magorium Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote name='PMoses' timestamp='1309677547' post='2747527'] There is one simple way of seeing if Varianz is guilty or not. Varianz if you would so kindly friend, share with us screenshots of your spy screen? I mean you don't have nothing to prove to us, but just saying with this the argument could have been over with by now, or maybe if there is incriminating evidence on there, legion will feel safe about rolling you without making a fail poll [/quote] No Varianz, please dont do it! Please give them a chance to get their balls back Voted Guilty! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pezstar Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote name='KainIIIC' timestamp='1309712081' post='2747735'] we must unite Xiphosis on one side, and pezstar on the other.. Toss in a bit of Lord Fingolfin and... [/quote] Oh lord. Mentioning this is a surefire way to have Legion start screaming about how all of their issues are 100% Pezstar's fault, and it's all because of her that they are in their current position. ALL PEZSTAR'S FAULT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamVimes Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote name='pezstar' timestamp='1309725011' post='2747873'] Oh lord. Mentioning this is a surefire way to have Legion start screaming about how all of their issues are 100% Pezstar's fault, and it's all because of her that they are in their current position. ALL PEZSTAR'S FAULT. [/quote] Well it is, the white forums we had for a day, the fact that quick reply didn't work for me once, i'll come up with more stuff later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleRena Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote name='Mogar' timestamp='1309723580' post='2747853'] I dont have less than 70% spy odds on any legion member in my range, how hard is it to buy 50 spies? [/quote] How do I buy spies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShouAS Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 Question, I am only at 2.7k in infra yet it takes about 10m for a 20day back collection cycle. How exactly do thoes nations with only 20m wc actually manage to do back collections since I am assuming it costs them more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PMoses Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote name='ShouAS' timestamp='1309726557' post='2747882'] Question, I am only at 2.7k in infra yet it takes about 10m for a 20day back collection cycle. How exactly do thoes nations with only 20m wc actually manage to do back collections since I am assuming it costs them more. [/quote] There probably not running full 20 days. Its pretty obvious by there collective surplus in cash, they don't know what a sled is in the first place Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Republic of Bari Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 (edited) The whole spy thing aside, it is truly impressive how the Legion has no sovereignty left as shown in this conversation (and others). Someone, likely the NSO, impugned upon their sovereignty and committed an act that is normally seen as a casus belli. Yet everyone is merely laughing at the Legion, confident that they'll do nothing about it. Rather the NSO is congratulated for providing some amusement and no thoughts are given by the world community as to respecting Legion's borders. The Legion is merely used for communal amusement. They're not a real alliance to the rest of the world, just a pinata to smack around until something funny falls out. The Legion will never fight for itself again. They're a Pacifican puppet now, one that will ride to war only after sufficient cajoling from a half dozen Imperial Officers of course. In peace time they're seen as so useless not even their larger allies will stand up for them in public. They're just kicked around for fun in peace time. Lolegion indeed. To any Legionaries who are here. You call yourself The Legion and once you claimed to be always victorious. Yet today only 1/3 of your membership has nuclear capabilities (97 Manhattan Projects and 80 SDIs out of 234 members). Only 1/6 have Weapons Research Complexes. Not to mention spy reports showing 50 bombers and the like. What kind of military force is that? A pitiful one. Take the energy and vitriol that you were going to use to type an angry reply to me and go to your own forums. Demand to know why your alliance as a whole is not combat ready. Why your fellow Legionaries are not honing their swords so they can defend you and others in the next conflict. Demand to know where the economic and military growth programs are. Go your MDP buddies, Pacifica, and ask for some basic guides. Follow them, audit your members and make sure they are following them. Tech raid a bit or something. Engage in company level training, one military company hitting a micro in a coordinated blitz. Get some starch in your spines so you're not afraid to lose some points of infrastructure to cruise missiles. Learn to coordinate a night time assault. I am your enemy. You know this, I know this. Now do something about it or get used to being slapped around in peacetime for amusement while the rest of us build up for a real war. Edited July 3, 2011 by Republic of Bari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeros Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 I think this thread should be Legions cue to go out in a blaze of Glory. Yes Legion, your shame is so great now that the only solution is Seppuku. In death you shall regain your honor. I shall demonstrate. [img]http://multiply.com/mu/hjoshhxh/image/4/photos/3/1200x120/1/hara-kiri.gif?et=CwHDdENMeGBRd5%2Bhxod%2B2A&nmid=193532239[/img] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Janova Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote]Someone, likely the NSO, impugned upon their sovereignty and committed an act that is normally seen as a casus belli.[/quote] The thing about spying is (as I mentioned in the other thread), you can't prove who did it, and that proof is needed as a CB or to use in requesting reps. I'd think, even for Legion, most alliances would not explicitly support unprovoked spying. But when you don't take the elementary steps to protect your alliance from spies, you are leaving yourselves open to this kind of thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nippy Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 We also caught Varianz spying on us. We shrugged it off, however, after he explained it was just 'voyeurism'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleRena Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote name='Bob Janova' timestamp='1309728413' post='2747896'] The thing about spying is (as I mentioned in the other thread), you can't prove who did it, and that proof is needed as a CB or to use in requesting reps. I'd think, even for Legion, most alliances would not explicitly support unprovoked spying. But when you don't take the elementary steps to protect your alliance from spies, you are leaving yourselves open to this kind of thing. [/quote] Other people have been doing it and posting logs since then though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varianz Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote name='nippy' timestamp='1309730390' post='2747911'] We also caught Varianz spying on us. We shrugged it off, however, after he explained it was just 'voyeurism'. [/quote] I thought that was between you, Sardonic and I?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nippy Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote name='Varianz' timestamp='1309730949' post='2747917'] I thought that was between you, Sardonic and I?! [/quote] Just don't release the tape, son. I'd hate to see Sardonic's name tarnished in such a fashion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PMoses Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 [quote name='LittleRena' timestamp='1309730865' post='2747915'] Other people have been doing it and posting logs since then though. [/quote] Which is exactly the reason why win or lose, The Legion should be doing something about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agni365 Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 I voted guilty... What did I vote for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Letum Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 [quote name='Republic of Bari' timestamp='1309727590' post='2747891'] Yet today only 1/3 of your membership has nuclear capabilities (97 Manhattan Projects and 80 SDIs out of 234 members). Only 1/6 have Weapons Research Complexes. [/quote] Not quite sure why you are using "only" there. This is where all 200-299 member alliances stand in terms of wonder ratios: [quote] NG WRC: 27% SDI: 40.8% MP 50.6% GPA WRC: 24.5% SDI: 48.5% MP: 45.1% VE WRC: 21.9% SDI: 43.5% MP: 45.4% [b]Legion WRC: 20.4% SDI: 35% MP: 41.3%[/b] RIA WRC: 15% SDI: 31.9% MP: 34.29% RnR WRC: 14.9% SDI: 22.6% MP: 29.1% LoSS WRC: 10.8% SDI: 16.7% MP: 22.3% GOONS WRC: 5.4% SDI: 11.5% MP: 23.1% [/quote] If you exclude GOONS, who'd be expected to have fewer wonders since most of them are new, Legion is pretty much right in the middle of the pack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Republic of Bari Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 [quote name='Letum' timestamp='1309752103' post='2748132'] Not quite sure why you are using "only" there. This is where all 200-299 member alliances stand in terms of wonder ratios: If you exclude GOONS, who'd be expected to have fewer wonders since most of them are new, Legion is pretty much right in the middle of the pack. [/quote] Legion dates back to GWI. Taking a quick look at some other GWI alliances: NPO: Slightly over 50% with MP, slightly under 50% with the SDI. Slightly under a quarter for WRC. Average NS is [u]LESS[/u] than the Legion. ODN: Between 40 and 50% for both SDI and MP. About a fifth with WRC. Kind of sad really considering their average NS, but still ahead of the Legion by a bit. NpO: Over 50% with the MP, under 50% with the SDI. TPF: Around 2/3s for both MP and SDI. A newer alliance of course. FAN: Above 50% MP, right at 50% for SDI. I fail to see how member count has anything to do with it. The Legion has a tradition that dates back to GWI and yet they have a lower percentage of wonders than other alliances that formed up in the GWI to GWIII era (counting TPF as coming from GWIII era TF). By all means though keep patting the Legion on the head and going "Hey you compare well to the GPA". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Letum Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Republic of Bari' timestamp='1309753460' post='2748143'] Legion dates back to GWI. Taking a quick look at some other GWI alliances: NPO: Slightly over 50% with MP, slightly under 50% with the SDI. Slightly under a quarter for WRC. Average NS is [u]LESS[/u] than the Legion. ODN: Between 40 and 50% for both SDI and MP. About a fifth with WRC. Kind of sad really considering their average NS, but still ahead of the Legion by a bit. NpO: Over 50% with the MP, under 50% with the SDI. TPF: Around 2/3s for both MP and SDI. A newer alliance of course. FAN: Above 50% MP, right at 50% for SDI. I fail to see how member count has anything to do with it. The Legion has a tradition that dates back to GWI and yet they have a lower percentage of wonders than other alliances that formed up in the GWI to GWIII era (counting TPF as coming from GWIII era TF). By all means though keep patting the Legion on the head and going "Hey you compare well to the GPA". [/quote] ... Founding Date? Seriously? Only about 20 of Legion's nations have a seniority that stretches back that far. That's completely arbitrary. It just sounds like you're trying to make up a measure that simultaneously makes that wonder ratio reflect negatively on Legion, but make a similar one not reflect negatively on VE, because they were "only" refounded in late 2007. 4 years quite obviously not being enough to buy up wonders, even though they were only invented in 2007. And of course, LoSS, RIA and RnR have all been around since 2006, but let's ignore that part too. Edited July 4, 2011 by Letum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalasin Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 [quote name='Letum' timestamp='1309756079' post='2748161'] ... Founding Date? Seriously? Only about 20 of Legion's nations have a seniority that stretches back that far. That's completely arbitrary. It just sounds like you're trying to make up a measure that simultaneously makes that wonder ratio reflect negatively on Legion, but make a similar one not reflect negatively on VE, because they were "only" refounded in late 2007. 4 years quite obviously not being enough to buy up wonders, even though they were only invented in 2007. And of course, LoSS, RIA and RnR have all been around since 2006, but let's ignore that part too. [/quote] Whatever. If you compare Legion with other fail alliances they may look alright. It doesn't change the fact that they're a terrible alliance and would get destroyed by anyone competent. Just look at their activity levels, warchests and tech count. Plus their FA policy sucks (although tbf they tried to realign with ODN and C&G ages ago but we wouldn't have them back because they were so sucky. They were even prepared to cancel on Pacifica and the rest of their ex-Heg allies.) I feel a tiny bit sorry for them but I honestly think they would do themselves a favour by disbanding. Nice to see you standing up for your allies, anyway. At least someone is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShouAS Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 [quote name='Letum' timestamp='1309756079' post='2748161'] Founding Date? Seriously? Only about 20 of Legion's nations have a seniority that stretches back that far. That's completely arbitrary. [/quote] I think he was implying that legion should have a collective experience from when they were founded, to use to actually train nations. Instead they appear to be less well informed then some small mircos I have seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayzie Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 [quote name='Mogar' timestamp='1309723580' post='2747853'] I dont have less than 70% spy odds on any legion member in my range, how hard is it to buy 50 spies? [/quote] You're not the first person to post this, just the last one I spotted while skimming through this dumb thread, but do you realise you get 70% odds on someone with the same spies as yourself when they're not set to severe threat level? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 [quote name='LittleRena' timestamp='1309725450' post='2747877'] How do I buy spies? [/quote] My spies tell me you know how. [quote name='Bob Janova' timestamp='1309728413' post='2747896'] The thing about spying is (as I mentioned in the other thread), you can't prove who did it, and that proof is needed as a CB or to use in requesting reps. I'd think, even for Legion, most alliances would not explicitly support unprovoked spying. But when you don't take the elementary steps to protect your alliance from spies, you are leaving yourselves open to this kind of thing. [/quote] Normally proof should be considered necessary, however it's not like the Sith are even denying it. It appears to me this thread was a bluff and it's been called. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Liebenow Posted July 5, 2011 Report Share Posted July 5, 2011 [quote name='Sigrun Vapneir' timestamp='1309787725' post='2748334'] Normally proof should be considered necessary, however it's not like the Sith are even denying it. It appears to me this thread was a bluff and it's been called. [/quote] [i]Someone[/i] hasn't seen Varianz's spy screen in the other topic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoppistan Posted July 5, 2011 Report Share Posted July 5, 2011 I don't even see my name in the poll. I demand a recount! This election is fraudulent! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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