Shayne Rivai Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 [quote name='Haflinger' timestamp='1309574047' post='2746446'] Yay, someone gets it: surrendered alliances aren't sovereign, that's what surrender means. I still don't think the government ban was a good idea, but at least it wasn't permanent. [/quote] Hence why they wave a white flag and not their own, aye? While I could see why you would think that the government ban was a bad idea, from the way EgoFreaky made it sound, Keve was nullifying any and all progress made during discussions. This isn't a challenging question, just an honest one. Do you mean to say you would have rather they gave up and continued fighting when it was only 1 person with absolute power that was unraveling their diplomatic negotiations? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex987 Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Hereno' timestamp='1309566624' post='2746316'] Yeah, what an !@#$%^& he is for jumping onto the bandwagon of not wanting his alliance's leader ousted by a foreign party over pocket change. At this point I'm convinced you really don't believe what you're posting. Come on, nobody is [i]that[/i] stupid. [/quote] Lol, learn to read before you learn to troll? His post was about the CB, which nobody was airing disagreements on when the war started. He was not at the thread arguing against the CB (or at least I did not see him). Unless my Space-time continuum knowledge is off and the CB is after the war, what he's actually doing is hopping on the anti-R&R bandwagon trying to pile on reasons to hate us when in reality these reasons were perfectly fine before the war. Funny how certain events change objectivity of others eh? Edited July 2, 2011 by Alex987 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EgoFreaky Posted July 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Hereno' timestamp='1309566624' post='2746316'] The point I was trying to make was that the absence of Keve from our planet makes the rescinding of the term completely useless. If you don't care about anyone's opinions, then why post an essay in the OP? Think about it for a while and get back to me when you're ready. [/quote] Fair enough, but there where more then just one term, plus when Keve gets back from wherever he is he might rejoin this realm and then he can return, so him leaving really doesn't make a difference when it comes to the terms one way or the other. We could have left that one term and then discuss it again if he ever returns, does that make more sense? You quote simms and then misunderstand him... read again what you quoted, he never says we don't care about anyones opinion.. Hell everyone cares about someones opinion. For us it was our allies, they supported us, yet we know not all of them agreed with the terms. They might still not agree with it, but the least we could do was give them a little insight into our reasoning. Isn't it better to support your ally even if you don't agree with them then support them while they don't even have the decency to try and explain? Once more, i regret not a letter of these terms or how we followed it up. People that still dislike it, thats up to them. But for others who wanted to know i made an explanation. I'm not forcing anyone to read it you know Edit: [quote name='Shayne Rivai' timestamp='1309580549' post='2746552'] Hence why they wave a white flag and not their own, aye? While I could see why you would think that the government ban was a bad idea, from the way EgoFreaky made it sound, Keve was nullifying any and all progress made during discussions. This isn't a challenging question, just an honest one. Do you mean to say you would have rather they gave up and continued fighting when it was only 1 person with absolute power that was unraveling their diplomatic negotiations? [/quote] Not going to stress how Keve acted or anything anymore, just pointing out this is the right question you ask. Because with Keve no peace, we where done dealing with him as emperor simple as that. Edited July 2, 2011 by EgoFreaky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinuteVariance Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 The more you guys post, the worse you make it all sound. If you wanted to announce something, you should have just announced it. This is justification and backpedalling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmbroseIV Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 [quote name='MinuteVariance' timestamp='1309587364' post='2746672'] The more you guys post, the worse you make it all sound. If you wanted to announce something, you should have just announced it. This is justification and backpedalling. [/quote] You've graduated from posting incredulous and inaccurate walls-of-text to bumping the thread with (what I'm sure you believe are) witty, persuasive catchphrases. It won't make the slightest bit of difference, but at least you're learning something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stockhunter Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 Very nice o/ R&R! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Janova Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 [quote]They haven't acknowledged that they made a mistake. What announcement did you read? [/quote] It would be too much to hope for an alliance to do that explicitly (without being forced to) on these boards. It's dressed up in a wall of self-justifying text, but the fact is that they have (i) rescinded the terms that people found objectionable and (ii) claimed that they never meant them to be permanent in the first place, despite clearly and explicitly writing them as such. That's about as clear a statement that those terms were a mistake that you're likely to see considering no-one is in a position to force R&R to apologise for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthkill Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 We aren't apologizing for them. We don't believe them to be a mistake. Take that as an official statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haflinger Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 [quote name='Shayne Rivai' timestamp='1309580549' post='2746552'] While I could see why you would think that the government ban was a bad idea, from the way EgoFreaky made it sound, Keve was nullifying any and all progress made during discussions. This isn't a challenging question, just an honest one. Do you mean to say you would have rather they gave up and continued fighting when it was only 1 person with absolute power that was unraveling their diplomatic negotiations? [/quote] Yeah... No. At the time UINE surrendered Keve was already nowhere in sight. They didn't have to deal with him anyway; all they needed were terms that restricted UINE's actions, they didn't need a government ban. The war started because of Keve's inaction and failure to communicate with his government. Let the other alliance's government deal with it, you don't need to enforce a coup via surrender terms especially when it's intensely apparent that one will happen on its own anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EgoFreaky Posted July 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Haflinger' timestamp='1309622172' post='2746900'] Yeah... No. At the time UINE surrendered Keve was already nowhere in sight. They didn't have to deal with him anyway; all they needed were terms that restricted UINE's actions, they didn't need a government ban. The war started because of Keve's inaction and failure to communicate with his government. Let the other alliance's government deal with it, you don't need to enforce a coup via surrender terms especially when it's intensely apparent that one will happen on its own anyway. [/quote] Yes and no, don't forget we already dealt with it before when Keve wasn't around, result was Keve came back and scrapped the deal because only he as emperor could make such a deal. So as long as there was the possibility for him to do the same we had no interest in any deals just so we could start all over a week later. [quote name='Bob Janova' timestamp='1309606835' post='2746790'] It would be too much to hope for an alliance to do that explicitly (without being forced to) on these boards. It's dressed up in a wall of self-justifying text, but the fact is that they have (i) rescinded the terms that people found objectionable and (ii) claimed that they never meant them to be permanent in the first place, despite clearly and explicitly writing them as such. That's about as clear a statement that those terms were a mistake that you're likely to see considering no-one is in a position to force R&R to apologise for them. [/quote] Ahuh, sure bob, if that makes you sleep better at night I'm not entirely sure if you're giving your honest opinion here (in which case you may have it, no problem) or that you're trying to start an argument about if it's backpaddling or not, if so, you wont get it, cause it's irrelevant, the explanation was there for people who wanted it. In the end the exact reasons why we did anything don't really matter all that much do they, just what the current situation is. Edited July 2, 2011 by EgoFreaky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Janova Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 So you actually support permanent terms, and removing people from government in terms? I gave you more credit than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgoods45 Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 (edited) Congrats, UINE. Edited July 2, 2011 by Jgoods45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinuteVariance Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 I've said it before and here it comes again - the more you post EgoFreaky, the more it seems like apology and backpedaling. In which case, on behalf of all members of UINE, apology accepted. No hard feelings bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayzie Posted July 3, 2011 Report Share Posted July 3, 2011 [quote name='Alex987' timestamp='1309565101' post='2746295'] O rly? And where were you standing up for YOUR beliefs when on the war announcement thread everybody was saying "Good show R&R, the only real CB I've seen in the past X years." Guess you pick and choose what bandwagons to hop on? [/quote] You got me, I wasn't online for them few hours. I don't really get this supposed whitty comeback. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EgoFreaky Posted July 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Bob Janova' timestamp='1309632056' post='2747024'] So you actually support permanent terms, and removing people from government in terms? I gave you more credit than that. [/quote] .... you're joking right? Who do you think wrote the terms.. UINE? edit: I support terms that solve/fix an issue period. I'll give you, the term "permanent" could have been worded differently since keeping a term after it accomplishes its intend/lost its value makes no real difference, someone suggested indefinitely, we could have gone with that too, we did not, no use crying about it now, no real difference in the end though, since we knew when the time was to release them from terms. Removing someone from gov? In a case like this? Hell yeah not a single doubt about that at all and would do it again in the same situation without a second thought. Hell we should probably have done that after the 2nd or 3rd broken deal and save ourselves a lot of time and effort. [quote name='MinuteVariance' timestamp='1309654654' post='2747242'] I've said it before and here it comes again - the more you post EgoFreaky, the more it seems like apology and backpedaling. In which case, on behalf of all members of UINE, apology accepted. No hard feelings bro. [/quote] I've not said it before so here it comes - the more you post MinuteVariance, the more it seems you can write but not read. In which case, on behalf of the educational system, our bad, no refunds though. Edited July 4, 2011 by EgoFreaky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Chocolate Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 [quote name='EgoFreaky' timestamp='1309460770' post='2745231'] If you think we believe we did [u]anything[/u] in the best interest of [b]UINE[/b] you're delusional,[/quote] [quote name='EgoFreaky' timestamp='1307504147' post='2726582'] [b]Fellow citizens of bob,[/b] Today we accepted the official surrender from the Union of Integrated National Entities and the following peaceterms where agreed upon... It's our wish that with this kickstart UINE can start rebuilding towards a better future, where situations like this can be avoided. [i]Signed,[/i] [b]For R&R,[/b] EgoFreaky - President Simms - Vice-President KingLC - Minister of Defense[/quote] Yup - got to love politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Black Hawk Posted July 4, 2011 Report Share Posted July 4, 2011 [quote name='Rebel Virginia' timestamp='1309485150' post='2745487'] [color="#0000FF"]So, let me guess. The UINE holding an election is the out RnR needed to back out of these atrocious terms after you realized that they didn't quite go over with the world as well as you had hoped? Masterly done.[/color] [/quote] Removing Keve from power was the wrong move. They should have just thrown him into an alliance that was rolling Legion for the durations of the negotiations. In fact, this should be the new standard for tricky negotiations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EgoFreaky Posted July 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2011 [quote name='White Chocolate' timestamp='1309749888' post='2748096'] Yup - got to love politics. [/quote] Not really, wishing an action will cause something to happen does not equal it being the reason for the action, as it wasn't here. It's called (possible) side effects. Our main priorities through all this was make damn sure each and every member of UINE knew to stay the $%&@ away from our protectorate(s), since the message wasn't clear the first 10+ times and to make sure it was settled permanently this time. Mission accomplished don't you think. [quote]Removing Keve from power was the wrong move. They should have just thrown him into an alliance that was rolling Legion for the durations of the negotiations. In fact, this should be the new standard for tricky negotiations.[/quote] You sir, will be invited next time we negotiate terms XD Though that would just have meant a vacation on another AA, not like there where any nations to hit right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piratemonkey530 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) As the new Prime Minister of UINE I find EgoFreaky and R&R an honorable person and alliance. I agree with the terms and we are working diligently to improve UINE and make her future brighter. R&R is, in fact, a very classy alliance and through some conversations with Ego, I have come to the conclusion that Ego is just doing his job in protecting his allies and protectorate after UINE raided. These terms are gracious because we were not forced into disbandment from a war both costly and destructive. I will not question R&R's intentions and if they should or shouldn't have banned Keve because we, UINE, accepted the terms and we have peace now. What is done is done and we are working swiftly to improve our image in Planet Bob. The terms have been lifted because we fulfilled them. What UINE did to begin with was wrong, R&R just gave us these terms as a means to an end. Ego mentioned that it was not in the best interest of UINE and that is obvious. Why the hell would the terms be in our best interest? It should be in R&R's best interest and of her protectorate. If they hurt us, they shouldn't care, if they help us, then wonderful. We are not R&R's friend, buddy, nor mate. We were their enemies and now we have ceased to be enemies with these terms and the lifting of them. o/UINE o/R&R May our future be friendlier. Thank you EgoFreaky for this thread. Edited July 7, 2011 by Piratemonkey530 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schattenmann Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 [quote name='Piratemonkey530' timestamp='1310016474' post='2751195'] As the new Prime Minister of UINE I find EgoFreaky and R&R an honorable person and alliance. I agree with the terms and we are working diligently to improve UINE and make her future brighter. R&R is, in fact, a very classy alliance and through some conversations with Ego, I have come to the conclusion that Ego is just doing his job in protecting his allies and protectorate after UINE raided. These terms are gracious because we were not forced into disbandment from a war both costly and destructive. I will not question R&R's intentions and if they should or shouldn't have banned Keve because we, UINE, accepted the terms and we have peace now. What is done is done and we are working swiftly to improve our image in Planet Bob. The terms have been lifted because we fulfilled them. What UINE did to begin with was wrong, R&R just gave us these terms as a means to an end. Ego mentioned that it was not in the best interest of UINE and that is obvious. Why the hell would the terms be in our best interest? It should be in R&R's best interest and of her protectorate. If they hurt us, they shouldn't care, if they help us, then wonderful. We are not R&R's friend, buddy, nor mate. We were their enemies and now we have ceased to be enemies with these terms and the lifting of them. o/UINE o/R&R May our future be friendlier. Thank you EgoFreaky for this thread. [/quote] Are you by chance a resident of Stockholm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piratemonkey530 Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1310055089' post='2751396'] Are you by chance a resident of Stockholm? [/quote] I find it foolish to continue to hate an alliance which didn't actually do anything wrong and your own alliance was the one who initiated the violence. Did R&R trespass on our sovereignty? Yeah I think so. Did they have the right to? Yeah I think so. Why? Because UINE was the alliance that did something wrong, not R&R. R&R weren't the criminals, UINE was and that is an obvious fact. That isn't opinion. Why would I defend UINE when it is clear we did something wrong? It would lead absolutely no where and continue to hurt our image. So the only way sometimes to move forward is to realize your mistakes, apologize, and move on. That's it. R&R is not an enemy to us. Do you want me to hate on R&R? I could but I won't. What good would that do? Edited July 7, 2011 by Piratemonkey530 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinuteVariance Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 (edited) I can't believe my own gov likes to eat poo this much. I'm sick of it. We were controlled by a semi-inactive but nice guy, now we're controlled by weak willed, semi-inactive guys I don't really know. I do know that statements like these from Pirate on the OWF make me want to be violently sick. I quit UINE. RnR if you think I'm worth raiding - bring it. No PM for me, I'd rather burn. Edited July 8, 2011 by MinuteVariance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REGHAR73 Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 [quote name='MinuteVariance' timestamp='1310116944' post='2752278'] I do know that statements like these from Pirate on the OWF make me want to be violently sick. RnR if you think I'm worth raiding - bring it. No PM for me, I'd rather burn. [/quote] I agree MV - I'm with you on that one - barbecue anyone? RnR did us no favours Pirate and if anything it spiraled the UINE into chaos - I find your comments unworthy of the position you hold and we are no 'poo' eaters as it was delicately put by mv. Also for you to be shooting off posts like this on this matter without prior discussion is rank out of order. I for one am not part of your opinion. RnR did what they thought was best. The AID's guys I spoke to would have been happy with the reps. Draw your own conclusions but I am personally sick of this level of public weakness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haflinger Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 [quote name='MinuteVariance' timestamp='1310116944' post='2752278'] I can't believe my own gov likes to eat poo this much. I'm sick of it. We were controlled by a semi-inactive but nice guy, now we're controlled by weak willed, semi-inactive guys I don't really know. I do know that statements like these from Pirate on the OWF make me want to be violently sick. I quit UINE. RnR if you think I'm worth raiding - bring it. No PM for me, I'd rather burn. [/quote] I have to admit, I kinda like this person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinuteVariance Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 [quote name='Haflinger' timestamp='1310311195' post='2753893'] I have to admit, I kinda like this person. [/quote] There is no way I am not putting that in my sig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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