The Overtime Accords

[Tygaland]

[quote name='New Frontier' timestamp='1304401518' post='2704883']
Opinions that clearly weren't strong enough to cause you to leave or cancel the treaties.
[/quote]

You may ditch your friends over disagreements, that is your prerogative. I prefer to let them know what I think in the hope it may influence them in some way. Either way, it does not prove the case you are trying to prosecute here.

[Beefspari]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1304401548' post='2704884']
GOONs are prats, details at 11.
[/quote]
Compelling argument sir, I can see why you're such a well-respected poster. I consider my points resoundingly debunked. Unless I may be permitted to counter with... you're a doo-doo head?
[img]http://meru.xfury.net/images/aeris/aerisdisL5.jpg[/img]

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Pingu' timestamp='1304401567' post='2704885']
I do believe that you, sir, are mad.

Whether in the British or American sense of the word I am not certain.

Either way, don't ever change
[/quote]
On the contrary, it is ODN which has torn its hair out over spam messages and world norms to receive what is in the end a Moldavi "apology." You will see how sorry CoJ is if you attack CoJ again; you can take that to the bank. And since ODN required terms despite our never attacking TFE, if ODN involves its protectorates in its wars in the future, you'll also find out what inappropriate in regards to your protectorates really means.

Edited May 3, 2011 by Schattenmann

[Joe Stupid]

I normally don't care, but that's a lot of reps to GOONS. Enjoy it.

[Rebel Virginia]

[quote name='Kalasin' timestamp='1304401472' post='2704881']
I never said anything about deserved reps, I just said that NPO's allies should have expected reps after they dogpiled GOONS. And calling me 'Kalashin' is not a particularly witty insult - in fact, it's not even witty at all.
[/quote]
[color="#0000FF"]If the "insult" does not appear witty, well, that's because it wasn't meant to. Not that I'm not spilling over the top with wit. I am. It's just I seem to have gotten your name wrong. My mistake.

Anyway, you were defending GOONS. That GOONS' policy is to demand reparations from anyone who attacks them (even in the defense of an ally) wasn't even your argument. It was that GOONS was unjustly dogpiled, and it was unfair, and that they deserve the money so that they can rebuild from the unjust dogpile by NPO's allies. Yes, that's what you said, and I felt it was important that I point out how idiotic it was.[/color]

[Beefspari]

[quote name='LittleRena' timestamp='1304401691' post='2704891']
Except for the 3 alliances who didn't attack GOONS but are lumped into the rep agreement, regadless of if they pay or not, they are still in that section of the agreement. So maybe you should extend your argument to "attacking an ally of GOONS will result in paying GOONS"
[/quote]
Ardus already explained that for you if you care to read. But you already said you don't care so I don't know why you keep coming back. Unless it's just to remind us you like making arguments without reading the counter-arguments and just saying things that make no sense to make yourself look worse.
[img]http://meru.xfury.net/images/aeris/aerisdisL8.jpg[/img]

[Rebel Virginia]

[quote name='Caliph' timestamp='1304401589' post='2704888']
Idiotic sequence of logic?

Concepts like "justified" are based in morality, which is entirely subjective to your own moral compas.
Alliance A has a policy of you do action X they will do action Y.
You do action X. Therefore they do action Y.
Very logical, perhaps you can explain what is illogical and "idiotic" about it?
[/quote]
[color="#0000FF"]Bah. I suppose it is logical. Doesn't mean I'll ever agree with the policy though. But enough of that. I couldn't care less what GOONS' policy is. As I said before I'm only here before of Kalasin's silly statements.[/color]

[MitchellBade]

[quote name='Sardonic' timestamp='1304397778' post='2704745']
Nah, I don't think we'll be attacking NPO again, for a very, very long time (if ever). It's too much paperwork.
[/quote]
aww so the 6 month non-aggression period is just a tease? you continue to disappoint DH and co.

[LittleRena]

[quote name='Beefspari' timestamp='1304401848' post='2704898']
Ardus already explained that for you if you care to read. But you already said you don't care so I don't know why you keep coming back. Unless it's just to remind us you like making arguments without reading the counter-arguments and just saying things that make no sense to make yourself look worse.
[img]http://meru.xfury.net/images/aeris/aerisdisL8.jpg[/img]
[/quote]

I did read and it comes out to the samething, reps that would have gone to MK are going to GOONS, so you know, attack MK/Umb, pay GOONS.

Also, I wasn't aware I could make myself look any worse, but if we're keeping score, am I in triple digit negatives yet?

[Caliph]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1304401124' post='2704877']
If you are incapable or refuse to make value judgments then your posts have no value. They neither add nor subtract. We must all decide what we accept or reject, arguments in support are support. Your rationalization is like cold soup, I spit it out and detest it.
[/quote]
I am making arguments based on facts, cold hard logic and facts. True it is like cold soup, but it is what it is, no spices to change the flavour or the facts of what it is.

My posts here have value in that they are objectively looking at the situation without being influenced by morality. These are the cold hard facts, and using logic we can determine whether your posts and viewpoints are logically sound, or not.

Speaking out against my participation in this discussion for not adopting a "touchy, feeley" emotional response, is illogical.

You performed an action. You knew the consequences. Pretty clear cut case here.
It only gets wierd when you try to muddy the waters by throwing up smoke screens such as morality and emotion.

[Kalasin]

[quote name='Rebel Virginia' timestamp='1304401834' post='2704897']
[color="#0000FF"]If the "insult" does not appear witty, well, that's because it wasn't meant to. Not that I'm not spilling over the top with wit. I am. It's just I seem to have gotten your name wrong. My mistake.

Anyway, you were defending GOONS. That GOONS' policy is to demand reparations from anyone who attacks them (even in the defense of an ally) wasn't even your argument. It was that GOONS was unjustly dogpiled, and it was unfair, and that they deserve the money so that they can rebuild from the unjust dogpile by NPO's allies. Yes, that's what you said, and I felt it was important that I point out how idiotic it was.[/color]
[/quote]

Well then, this appears to be a simple misunderstanding! The declarations on GOONS were not unjust and not unfair and I don't give two !@#$% about whether GOONS 'deserved' the reps or not.

[Sephiroth]

[quote name='LittleRena' timestamp='1304398311' post='2704762']
Well atleast you've been paying attention to this war, it's not like [url=http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=97858]KN declared on MK[/url] and you know [url=http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=98289]NADCs declaration on MK/Umbrella[/url] must have been false, maybe [url=http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=98288]TSI ment GOONS when they said MK[/url].

That's 3 alliances who didn't declare on GOONS but paying reps to GOONS, so you are fine with them paying reps for as you say, having balls?
[/quote]
Kerberos Nexus isn't paying any reps, the treaty has been fixed now to dis-include KN among those paying reps to GOONS and include my signature. Although I do think the reps are excessive GOONS are asking, but I wouldn't pay them reps when I wasn't fighting them. My agreement with MK and ODN on peace include no reps, but I think a joint peace agreement is good for coordination on when to peace out, which is why I'll include my signature on the agreement to end the fighting.

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Caliph' timestamp='1304402027' post='2704903']
I am making arguments based on facts, cold hard logic and facts. True it is like cold soup, but it is what it is, no spices to change the flavour or the facts of what it is.

My posts here have value in that they are objectively looking at the situation without being influenced by morality. These are the cold hard facts, and using logic we can determine whether your posts and viewpoints are logically sound, or not.

Speaking out against my participation in this discussion for not adopting a "touchy, feeley" emotional response, is illogical.

You performed an action. You knew the consequences. Pretty clear cut case here.
It only gets wierd when you try to muddy the waters by throwing up smoke screens such as morality and emotion.
[/quote]
If you have no opinion you have nothing to add. I hope you enjoy the tech that sitting in a comfy AA brings.

[SADeki]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1304401772' post='2704895']
On the contrary, it is ODN which has torn its hair out over spam messages and world norms to receive what is in the end a Moldavi "apology." You will see how sorry CoJ is if you attack CoJ again; you can take that to the bank. And since ODN required terms despite our never attacking TFE, you'll also find out what inappropriate in regards to your protectorates really means.
[/quote]

I think TFE could take on CoJ pretty easily to be honest.

[Yankees Empire]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1304401772' post='2704895']
On the contrary, it is ODN which has torn its hair out over spam messages and world norms to receive what is in the end a Moldavi "apology." You will see how sorry CoJ is if you attack CoJ again; you can take that to the bank. And since ODN required terms despite our never attacking TFE, you'll also find out what inappropriate in regards to your protectorates really means.
[/quote]
I'm truly shaking in my boots.

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Yankees Empire' timestamp='1304402226' post='2704909']
I'm truly shaking in my boots.
[/quote]
Oh yeah you care so little that you wouldn't agree to peace without it. It's hard to be smug when you've spent 2 months throwing a fit over spam.

[Rebel Virginia]

[quote name='Kalasin' timestamp='1304402061' post='2704904']
Well then, this appears to be a simple misunderstanding! The declarations on GOONS were not unjust and not unfair and I don't give two !@#$% about whether GOONS 'deserved' the reps or not.
[/quote]
[color="#0000FF"]You don't care? You don't sympathesize with GOONS? Well, when did this transformation happen? Why, just a few pages ago you were all on about how the piling upon GOONS was unfair and unnecessary and that GOONS ought to get the reparations so that they can rebuild from a war in which they took an undeserved beating with. But I suppose you're right, you don't care. I do hope you can understand how someone such as myself could get confused about your feelings based on your contradictory statements.

But my, such transformations! Truly you are a master of change.[/color]

[Kalasin]

[quote name='Rebel Virginia' timestamp='1304402335' post='2704913']
[color="#0000FF"]You don't care? You don't sympathesize with GOONS? Well, when did this transformation happen? Why, just a few pages ago you were all on about how the piling upon GOONS was unfair and unnecessary and that GOONS ought to get the reparations so that they can rebuild from a war in which they took an undeserved beating with. But I suppose you're right, you don't care. I do hope you can understand how someone such as myself could get confused about your feelings based on your contradictory statements.

But my, such transformations! Truly you are a master of change.[/color]
[/quote]

I support GOONS but not for moral reasons, which you would have known if you'd actually read my posts.

[Crymson]

[quote name='Mergerberger II' timestamp='1304394758' post='2704637']
The atrociousness of these terms is too great for words to accurately describe and relate.
[/quote]

Your alliance lacks the moral foundation necessary to render any validity to your comments on these matters.

[SADeki]

[quote name='Crymson' timestamp='1304402431' post='2704915']
Your alliance lacks the moral foundation necessary to render any validity to your comments on these matters.
[/quote]

Well they would know about underhanded tactics and crippling punishments, they did write the book on it after all.

[Caliph]

[quote name='Rebel Virginia' timestamp='1304401941' post='2704900']
[color="#0000FF"]Bah. I suppose it is logical. Doesn't mean I'll ever agree with the policy though. But enough of that. I couldn't care less what GOONS' policy is. As I said before I'm only here before of Kalasin's silly statements.[/color]
[/quote]
I'm not going into whether or not you like the policy. That is irrelevant. You may not like paying bills, but you must pay bills. The cause of not paying bills is not related to whether or not you like doing it. Whether or not you like GOONS' policy here does not change GOONS' policy.

[Yankees Empire]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1304402302' post='2704912']
Oh yeah you care so little that you wouldn't agree to peace without it. It's hard to be smug when you've spent 2 months throwing a fit over spam.
[/quote]
Us: X is what you need to do to get peace.
You: We won't do it.
Us: Suit yourself.
You: *extra effort in more messages and TWiN*
Us: You still need to do x.
You: *more messages and another TWiN*
You: *Agrees to x*

If that's your definition of throwing a fit, then ok.

[Pingu]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1304401772' post='2704895']
On the contrary, it is ODN which has torn its hair out over spam messages and world norms to receive what is in the end a Moldavi "apology." You will see how sorry CoJ is if you attack CoJ again; you can take that to the bank. And since ODN required terms despite our never attacking TFE, you'll also find out what inappropriate in regards to your protectorates really means.
[/quote]

I assure you, my plumage is quite intact. No hair tearing of any sort has gone on anywhere in ODN so far as I know. And I would know, because of all that democracy and transparency you have such difficulty understanding.

Sadly, I know of no bank that accepts your word as valid tender, so I'll have to pass on that kind offer.

That third sentence looks very much like a threat. Most intemperate. And validation for my original point. You, sir, are mad.

[Rebel Virginia]

[quote name='Kalasin' timestamp='1304402400' post='2704914']
I support GOONS but not for moral reasons, which you would have known if you'd actually read my posts.
[/quote]
[color="#0000FF"]I have read your statements, but I must wonder if you have. You had a reputation as a renowned moralist, and based on your reasons for justifying the reparations (it was unfair to dogpile GOONS!) it is quite obvious where your sympathies are. Keep on rocking those flip-flops though. They look great on you.[/color]

[Beefspari]

[quote name='LittleRena' timestamp='1304402025' post='2704902']
I did read and it comes out to the samething, reps that would have gone to MK are going to GOONS, so you know, attack MK/Umb, pay GOONS.

Also, I wasn't aware I could make myself look any worse, but if we're keeping score, am I in triple digit negatives yet?
[/quote]
They're only "paying us" because it was just easier for everyone involved (less terms, less bullet points, and easier to pay money than tech). I doubt any of those alliances would rather pay tech than money. And MK/Umb don't need money more than they need tech. It's my understanding that we're going to be treating some of those as tech deals to send to MK/Umb anyway. If you can find that those alliances would rather pay large sums of tech, then maybe I'll take your complaints seriously.
[img]http://meru.xfury.net/images/aeris/aerisdisL12.jpg[/img]

And I don't keep track of the score myself, that's what WPE is for. In which case you have some work to do. You could study Methrage's tactics if you want to beat him next year.
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