Londo Mollari

No more announcements from Ragnarok for at least 3 months.

[quote name='Joe Stupid' timestamp='1327892228' post='2910009'] [center][img]http://images.wikia.com/cybernations/images/c/c2/RoKFlag.jpg[/img][/center] [center][IMG]http://www.knowledgerush.com/wiki_image/2/2a/IIM.jpg[/IMG][/center] Denizens of Bob, You may have heard many stories flying around about the great alliance of Ragnarok, and none of them are true. Bob and I are still the legimiate leaders of Ragnarok and no silly forum changes are going to disprove any of that so with out further ado: Ragnarok hereby cancels our ODoAP with NATO, and our MDoAP with The Combine. We also sentence the usurper and poser Adel to ZI. Signed, Bob Ilyani, Emperor Joe Stupid, Regent All glory to the legitimate Ragnarok. [/quote] Hmmm. I... see.

[quote name='Bob Ilyani' timestamp='1327615568' post='2907596'] Yeah for sure this is totally happening And, if I may add a little bit of clarification, Hoo resigned from Ragnarok maybe 2 months ago and joined his own AA, The Bear Cavalry. Kait posted in Ragnarok's forums the intention of joining her husband after the conclusion of the war with CSN. Now that the war has been concluded, we consider Kait's words to be in effect and thus she is no longer a member of Ragnarok. Her remainder on the Ragnarok AA is not approved nor permitted by Ragnarok's government, and we do not hold any sort of protection over The Bear Cavalry. [/quote] [s]This is NOT how you treat someone who served as leader of your alliance.[/s] EDIT: I see that I've not been paying attention AT ALL for some time.

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1327222562' post='2904643'] Honestly, it's only because people aren't willing to treat NPO in the way NPO treated others(karma with a lower case) that it is possible for them to continue existing as a major alliance. I think that's a change of sorts. Also Londo, you still hate Polar for Grub's anti-raiding crap in 2009, so I really don't like this rhetoric from you. I don't know what kind of terms are being offered to Polar, an alliance that lost 3/4ths of its NS in the first 3 months of 2011 and has lost 2/3rds in this war. I'd like some consistency in the "moving on" crowd. [/quote] Polar has never paid for past actions, nor do I believe they have changed. The fact that nearly everyone still has their own reason to hate Polar should be a marvelous clue why I would not include them in the story of building the new world. Furthermore, FAN has had two satisfactions against NPO. The first was watching Karma come along and beat the tar out of NPO and force NPO to give peace to FAN as a precondition for NPO's own peace. The second was participating in a beatdown of NPO that... you helped orchestrate. What does FAN want to do, war NPO for years? We didn't find that behavior to be acceptable from NPO, so why would we find it acceptable from FAN? FAN is a sovereign alliance and their one inexorable goal seems to be to repeatedly attack NPO. While they have that right, at some point it becomes something more like RKUNU's endless war and something less like interesting or compelling political play. I like FAN, but if FAN continues to let their past history with NPO define who they are, then NPO really and truly won VietFAN, because they destroyed what FAN was. FAN was not an obsessed, monomaniacal entity before VietFAN. It is FAN's choice now to let NPO's victory over them continue, or to reclaim a healthy identity as they once had.

[quote name='He Who Has No Name' timestamp='1327218289' post='2904612'] We were hunted mercilessly across this world and the next for [i]two years[/i] in a sadistic pogrom. We will [i]always[/i] have justification to level with NPO. [/quote] NPO has been punished for past behaviors. NPO has changed, just as much as FAN has. All of us have changed. The world is no longer what it was. It is time to let go and build the new world, such as it may be, from the ashes of the old. And if we can dream mighty dreams and find a new story within ourselves... then perhaps our deeds may yet match those of days of legend. When men were roaring tigers and leaders were angry gods. [img]http://i.pbase.com/o6/30/52730/1/116567116.Vo9WEPwG.sr0028.JPG[/img]

Not announcing treaty cancellations is like not telling any of your friends you broke up with your girlfriend.

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1326823485' post='2901569'] With Athens actively involved in developing chains such that their allies got hit ~but not by them~, I wouldn't really expect anyone from TLR to understand. [/quote] That is of course the nature of political power. One tends to be intimately involved in coalition war-planning and discussions. Most of our allies were with us when wars came. Those who chose to stand elsewhere had typically made their choice well in advance. Moreover, all our allies were made more secure by virtue of the influence that we accrued through such exercise. We did a sterling job of acquitting ourselves to our allies. I don't need to justify myself to you to validate our existence, but I find that I have profound distaste for having the name of the home and community I and many others built sullied for your cheap amusement. Athens was many things, but the word 'traitor' was never and will never be ascribed to our house.

I think I've seen nearly all of them rolled.

I need to get back into the business of negotiations...

I didn't know your name was Yala Misr.

[quote name='King Xander the Only' timestamp='1326387289' post='2898127'] tl;dr We're a walking target just waiting for someone to roll us and put us out of our misery. But hey, good luck moving forward! [/quote] That's what I got out of reading this too.

[quote name='Kajdav' timestamp='1325818452' post='2893669'] I see no reason to be ashamed. The shorter amount of time it takes for an alliance to achieve its objective, the better. [/quote] If your objective is to basically offer up your members as tech raid targets, as it undoubtedly was in your case, I suppose that is true.

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1325194632' post='2888719'] It sucks that Oly got the short end of the stick in general, so it's good to see this peaced out. [/quote] We were fine once we got a counter on Sparta. Before that I was worried I'd run out of nukes. That would have made me one sad llama. [quote name='jraenar' timestamp='1325206614' post='2888837'] ATHENS IS BEST GREECE. [/quote] ATHENS IS BEST GREECE! [quote name='Rush Sykes' timestamp='1325208165' post='2888850'] A well earned victory against, lets face it, outnumbered odds. Well done Olympus. [/quote] [img]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_3IjRgoGWUBo/TA14j1902WI/AAAAAAAAAl0/qaoCn-MRiCE/s400/never-tell-me-the-odds-demotivator.jpg[/img] [quote name='bakamitai' timestamp='1325212110' post='2888891'] Not Jar Jar. [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcOsw-dhCos"]Zathras[/url]. [/quote] You just had to bring Babylon 5 into this didn't you? [quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1325213674' post='2888915'] That's not true. You guys always go to bat, just Olympus was kind of smushed in this war. [/quote] Yeah? Well, you should see the other guy. A good fight to Guru Order. Good luck in your rebuilding, gentlemen.

[quote name='Doitzel' timestamp='1324425017' post='2882869'] That's assuming everyone wants to become such a player. A lot of people want to simply participate in the broader international politics without the responsibility of leadership. Games like this are escapist. A richer public aspect to the game allows the more casual people to dip in and participate at their leisure and also makes it easier for the more talented and ambitious to present themselves. In either case the backroom exclusivity is not a benefit. A diaspora to even more, smaller alliances only further fractures the community and with the relative isolation of non-leadership players that sort of regression is not sustainable. [/quote] Given how easy it is to suffer a damaging loss of PR by engaging in dealings in public, how would you propose to move away from a world of backroom deals to a more public one? (p.s. it's been all backroom for a long long time, certainly since i've started playing). Furthermore, how is a weaker force supposed to make plans against a stronger one if not in secrecy? How do you think Karma was put together? I'm not suggesting that you and Vox didn't contribute, but Karma wouldn't have happened without the will and ability to make political manuvers in secrecy. How do you propose to encourage a more public political scene? I don't think we even have one of those in real life.

[quote name='Evella Vada' timestamp='1324344762' post='2882244'] Look at all the haters =D We're doing it right! O/ GPF [/quote] This may come as news to you, but getting people to dislike you for no real reason in politics is generally considered a poor idea. Tread lightly, young ones.

Not too bad guys. A few factual inaccuracies but that's journalism for you.

[quote name='He Who Has No Name' timestamp='1324360637' post='2882433'] The root problem is that the majority of the game space - that is, the parts of the gameplay experience that actually allow any significant impact on something besides your "character" - has been constructed almost entirely as metagame aspects by players, and access has been kept extremely exclusive. The chances of any average Joe signing up for CN and being able to lead an alliance of even passing influence are, basically, zero. That is a broken game. People are not going to bother sticking around if the best they can ever reasonably hope for are to be pawns in somebody else's chess game. The fact that CN still has as MANY nations as it does is a small miracle - and a waiting-to-happen psychology treatise on abusive relationships. If Admin wanted to fix this game, he would need to confiscate the creation and control of those metagame aspects from the community and build them as functional, integral aspects of the core gameplay itself, in a way that the majority of the player base could feasibly hope to one day partake in. The player base powers-that-be right now will screech like little girls if that happens, and so it won't happen. Backroom powerbrokers and kingmakers are ultimately going to be the death of this game. Fitting that they will ultimately destroy everything they worked so hard to keep for themselves. [/quote] I disagree. I was a government member at 15 days old, an alliance leader at 60 days old, a 1 million NS+ alliance leader at 170 days old, a 5 million NS+ alliance leader at 400 days old, and so on. I think I accomplished a fair amount. I could also point to other people like Hoo who became major alliance leaders pretty quick. Roquentin was a relatively unknown MK member before he became leader of Umbrella. It does take a lot of work and dedication to rise to the level of politically influential alliance leader, but it is certainly possible, and lesser degrees of activity confer lesser rewards. It is not a winner take all system.

[quote name='Krack' timestamp='1324151535' post='2880641'] Proper management of meatshields is kind of like being a crack dealer. You give them a little of something they want as part of a bargain ... then in return you use them to eliminate anyone they could run to in the future ... then, when there is no where else to go, you constantly remind them that they do as you say or you're cutting them off from the good stuff. Ambition and self-respect. Neutrals aside, the vast majority of CN are meatshield (or aspiring-meatshield) alliances. [/quote] Meatshield nations? Absolutely not. I support treating people who don't fight or respond to orders as resources to be harvested or people to attack for sport when wars are few and far between. Here is why: [b][u]Reasons why having meatshield nations in your alliance is bad[/u][/b] - Makes IA coordination a lot harder, as you don't know who will do what. [i](Harder to get aid, leadership attention, education, etc to deserving members. Hurts the useful members)[/i] - Damages alliance members morale. [i](Alliance members are instinctively aware of all the factors on this list)[/i] - Damages the reputation of an alliance (laughingstock), which hurts you politically. [i](Sparta have mostly had a solid layer of muscle under the fat, but having the fat at all has always killed them politically)[/i] - Can cause enemy coalition planners to overestimate your alliance, sending in more NS on you than they would have otherwise, causing the fighting membership to perform worse, causing you to become more of a laughingstock. [i]As a classic example, see FAN+TOP vs Legion in GWIII.[/i] - Can cause enemies in a coalition war to clamor to the coalition leadership to simply pile onto you (or to pile on regardless), in the hope of hitting easy targets that deliver minimal damage. [i]As an example, notice GOD's magnetism to easy targets, such as GDA, UPN, etc.[/i] A lot of people seem to have taken this question to be alliance-based. I am not sure what a meatshield alliance is. I am not sure that I buy the term. Is an alliance a meatshield for being a good team player and subordinating their individual interests to the goals of a greater coalition, or other alliances? If this is the case then MK was a fine meatshield, for the duty they did in Karma and the TPF war. So was Athens, for our actions in noCB and DH-NPO war. So is essentially every alliance. I don't consider it demeaning for an alliance to help their friend's goals for an era or a period of time - in fact, cooperation pretty much necessitates this. The way I see alliances is mostly in terms of whether they won't fight or put out a good effort in a war. You have all kinds of alliances - alliances who are big and ripped, with muscles and hard bodies like MK, alliances who are fat and out of shape but somewhat muscular like Sparta that everyone makes fun of for being fat but can still beat up some guys, alliances that are small but ripped (like BAPS) who can really get in there and put a hurting on people but aren't quite big enough to deliver the death pounding to the big guys all by themselves. Then you have the guys that are fat, weak, out of shape, avoid wars at all costs, make excuses about why they can't fight, and rely on their buddies to accomplish anything at all. An alliance like the old NATO is the prototypical example of this (unconvinced whether or not they are still like this, but suspicious). These are the ones I see as the meatshield alliances. I think they are of marginal use unless they are very large. If they are very large they can do some damage in a war to your enemies just by their sheer numbers, they can tie up a significant alliance. If they are smaller and crappy, then you've expended a treaty (with all the effort that goes into maintaining that relationship and the perception that having increasing numbers of treaties gives). So, big "meatshield alliances" of minimal quality can be ok allies (as good as a much smaller competent alliance), but midsized and smaller ones just aren't really worth the treaty slot.

[quote name='chefjoe' timestamp='1324014254' post='2879647'] Have fun propagating mushrooms throughout MHA.....even if those mushrooms are just in the form of clouds [/quote] Mushroom clouds are overrated. Mushroom stamps are the new big thing.

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha Good job MK

[quote name='SirWilliam' timestamp='1324007163' post='2879460'] You will be. Despite what we say most of us will be. [/quote] Welcome to the Hotel California.

[quote name='James Dahl' timestamp='1323974298' post='2878983'] Can we all just lay off Holy Ruler and Islam? [/quote] [IMG]http://files.sharenator.com/britney_alone_88u3_Who_is_the_most_emotional_Girls_or_guys-s300x218-83182-580.jpg[/IMG] Leave Holy Ruler alone!!!

Good work kriekfreak. At long last my warmongering career has born fruit. Juicy fruit. Also, I think I have either warred alongside, warred against, raided with, or been raided by most of the people on this list. Lawl.

[quote name='Sandwich Controversy' timestamp='1323766064' post='2876373'] I think it's time Athens reformed and raided you again [/quote] [quote name='emmabuddie' timestamp='1323766269' post='2876374'] athens was an alliance i approvesbl, good luck! [/quote] [quote name='Mandellav' timestamp='1323777078' post='2876456'] I believe we now have sufficient evidence that the world should have thanked Athens when they raided KoN rather than call them immoral warmongers. [/quote] [quote name='jraenar' timestamp='1323797149' post='2876698'] Hey Londo. Get the band back together?[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzOHq5WbQ8k[/url] [/quote] [quote name='ddog241' timestamp='1323810759' post='2876911'] Londo lets reform athens.... [/quote] Now this would be fun.

[quote name='Max Power' timestamp='1323658038' post='2874534'] Surprised to see this given how important that war was in vaulting C&G to its height in summer 2010. Can you expand on that at all? [/quote] C&G was at its height before Karma, during Karma and in some ways, after Karma. C&G was by no means at its height in summer 2010. In many ways it had already lost a lot of the things that made it great by that point.