hertugen Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 He's basically like Planet Bob's Jesus. Wait, I thought that would be Walford. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shahenshah Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Wait, I thought that would be Walford. Lets Stick to the topic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flak attack Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 i think i can guess what alliances you have been in from your post It's not a guess when he says which one. You guessing that he was LUE is like me guessing that you're in Legion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corinan Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 As I no longer have access to the thread, I will have to rely on as much as I remember, which cited stuff that Lord Brown had collected such as a signature suggesting that Moo was anti-Francoism moreso than anything else. Can you be more specific regarding this "OOC threatening of harm"? My memory of the dispute between Umbrae and RC is a bit hazy but I seem to recall some back and forth between the two via PM or some such. I seem to remember RC telling Umbrae that he hoped he got shot while Umbrae was (OOC: deployed overseas.) This was after Umbrae supposedly mocked RC's experiences in law enforcement. Or something. The whole thing seemed a bit silly to me and not much more than a penis waving contest. By the way, while we're on this issue, I insist on the immediate expulsion and ZI of ChileRelleno for multiple personal attacks towards myself. Your Imperial Officers did absolutely nothing to show even disapproval of his blatant abuse and insults, which are far worse than those NPO has made other alliances expel members for. Yes, I've witnessed Chiles outbursts towards you in at least two separate instances. If RC could be booted for what was said to Umbrae, you'd think Chile would have gotten the boot for the things he's said about you. Instead his behavior was always seemingly shrugged off. "Well that's Chile for ya!" He's another one the PCIA would have sniped had it been allowed to survive. Pacifica would have been awash in a cleansing baptismal fire. It would have been glorious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eretz Yisrael Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Except it was only shut down because the IOs that knew they were in the line of fire whined about it. The PCIA would have done Pacifica a whole lot of good if it was left in the right hands. Namely mine and Ivans, of course. Instead it was castrated and ultimately dropped due to the whining of cancerous agents like Zhadum. You should have just let us play the surgeon, Pacifica. It would have avoided a lot of mess. Yes. Of course. Done a lot of good in yours and Ivan's hands. Mhmmm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corinan Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Yes. Of course. Done a lot of good in yours and Ivan's hands. Mhmmm. I don't know why that seems like such a laughable notion to you. It's not much of a stretch to think that Pacifica would be in a much better position today if we had been allowed to to what was needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eretz Yisrael Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I don't know why that seems like such a laughable notion to you. It's not much of a stretch to think that Pacifica would be in a much better position today if we had been allowed to to what was needed. It's a laughable notion because 1, apart from being a regular member and beating the stuffing out of our enemies, I don't seem to recall you doing much, and 2, PCIA was nothing more than a witch hunting organization with promises of false power to lord over other members in an attempt to recruit them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebel Virginia Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Yes. Of course. Done a lot of good in yours and Ivan's hands. Mhmmm. I don't know. For some reason I'm not entirely convinced that Ivan would have been so deluded as to think that MK would be riding to Pacifica's rescue. And Fark. And the rest of the world.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corinan Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 (edited) It's a laughable notion because 1, apart from being a regular member and beating the stuffing out of our enemies, I don't seem to recall you doing much, and 2, PCIA was nothing more than a witch hunting organization with promises of false power to lord over other members in an attempt to recruit them. 1. True, I was just a regular member before Ivan picked me up for PCIA duties. No disputing that. So what? 2. You could have called it that if you wanted, but at least the witches we were hunting were real. Real in the sense that they were people who were/are doing Pacifica harm. I don't know. For some reason I'm not entirely convinced that Ivan would have been so deluded as to think that MK would be riding to Pacifica's rescue. And Fark. And the rest of the world.... I'm willing to bet that it wouldn't have progressed to the point to where Pacifica needed any help. There wouldn't have been a war. Well, at least not the Karma War that we know of now. Edited October 2, 2009 by Corinan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eretz Yisrael Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 1. True, I was just a regular member before Ivan picked me up for PCIA duties. No disputing that. So what?2. You could have called it that if you wanted, but at least the witches we were hunting were real. Real in the sense that they were people who were/are doing Pacifica harm. I'm willing to bet that it wouldn't have progressed to the point to where Pacifica needed any help. There wouldn't have been a war. Well, at least not the Karma War that we know of now. Contrary to what is posted around here in an attempt to defame the Order, I can guarantee you not a single soul in the Order seriously expected MK or Fark to help us. Ah, but I forgot. Ivan is utterly invincible to the risks of foreign affairs. He would have never gotten us into a world war that would see most of our allies desert us and deal serious damage to the alliance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corinan Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Contrary to what is posted around here in an attempt to defame the Order, I can guarantee you not a single soul in the Order seriously expected MK or Fark to help us. Ah, but I forgot. Ivan is utterly invincible to the risks of foreign affairs. He would have never gotten us into a world war that would see most of our allies desert us and deal serious damage to the alliance. I didn't say we wouldn't get into any wars. I'm just saying the Karma War would have probably been avoided. Oh and Ivan never got us into a losing war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChairmanHal Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 ... I believe the palming was a critical hit. Nahh...he's got to the airport, unfortunately he crashed on the runway. Also this /m/ alliance and m alliance people keep talking about, they must have been horrible to get a mention. No, NPO needed to do three things to ensure it always stayed on top: 1. Maintain a strong set of leaders in place who despite their personal differences could keep a massive alliance moving forward despite the tendency for massive alliances to become bogged down with bureaucracy. Individuals will become disgruntled and leave, quit Planet Bob, etc. The alliance must move forward or stagnate and become vulnerable, irrelevant and perhaps die. 2. Keep the OoO. NPO-NpO plus a few more sanctioned alliances = victory. Over my time on Planet Bob every conversation about taking down NPO I had with others OOC either ended with, "well Polaris will back them up so..." or "but first we have to split the Orders, otherwise there isn't a point of trying". Side note: That was also a key for Electron Sponge to maintain power, among others. 3. Maintain the image of the unassailable empire. Related to #2 perhaps, but beyond that. NPO was never going to be loved. Even those that said they loved them actually hated them or put up with their psuedo political philosophy because being allied with NPO granted protection or freedom of action (yes, GOONS 1.0, \m/, FAN, etc. I'm talking about you). NPO didn't need to attack every single alliance that offended them--there were willing partners at the ready. They did however need to be decisive at all times, to roll the propaganda machine at a moment's notice, and keep on message, whatever that message was. They failed miserably at #3, didn't keep #2--though clearly it wasn't all their fault, and as for #1 my very real sense is that much like a professional baseball team that isn't bringing up quality players up through its farm system like it used to NPO started to rely on "free agents". That's fine, but much like baseball, there are only so many quality free agents out there and they don't always work out in terms of the chemistry of the clubhouse. Having said all that, I don't think that NPO is heading to the political dust bin. GPA after all managed to regain sanction and seems to be in better shape than it was before the Woodstock Massacre. I see a similar course for NPO. Smaller, but better able to deal with the challenges it faces in the multi-polar future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eretz Yisrael Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I didn't say we wouldn't get into any wars. I'm just saying the Karma War would have probably been avoided.Oh and Ivan never got us into a losing war. There's no way to tell for sure. If you consider Ivan's unique personality, it's entirely possible he would have gotten us into the same situation under a different pretext. It is rather amusing to see you holding up your idol to such high expectations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corinan Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 (edited) There's no way to tell for sure. If you consider Ivan's unique personality, it's entirely possible he would have gotten us into the same situation under a different pretext.It is rather amusing to see you holding up your idol to such high expectations. Well in this hypothetical scenario, Ivan and I would have been in PCIA, so it's unlikely we would have gotten us into any difficult situations FA-wise since PCIA was IA orientated. Ultimately, yes, there's no way of knowing for sure what would have happened since history would have diverged a great deal. I guess we both agree that things would have turned out differently, one way or another. I consider Ivan a friend and respect him a great deal and I don't think it's placing him on a pedestal for me to state basic facts about his time in NPO. Edited October 2, 2009 by Corinan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hizzy Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 There's no way to tell for sure. If you consider Ivan's unique personality, it's entirely possible he would have gotten us into the same situation under a different pretext.It is rather amusing to see you holding up your idol to such high expectations. It's even more amusing that you actually don't believe he would have done a better job of things. Do you think that, given the options that were before you, NPO chose the best course of action and came out with the best possible outcome? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vhalen Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 It's a laughable notion because 1, apart from being a regular member and beating the stuffing out of our enemies, I don't seem to recall you doing much, and 2, PCIA was nothing more than a witch hunting organization with promises of false power to lord over other members in an attempt to recruit them. So you prefer your witch hunts to be more informal, then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnKirk Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Wait. NPO is still relevant? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TypoNinja Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 No, NPO needed to do three things to ensure it always stayed on top:2. Keep the OoO. NPO-NpO plus a few more sanctioned alliances = victory. Over my time on Planet Bob every conversation about taking down NPO I had with others OOC either ended with, "well Polaris will back them up so..." or "but first we have to split the Orders, otherwise there isn't a point of trying". didn't keep #2--though clearly it wasn't all their fault You're kidding right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hizzy Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 You're kidding right? I think ChairmanHal is referring to before the NoCB war, and I definitely agree with him there. I've said it before and I'll say it again; the OoO was NPO's ace-in-the-hole. As soon as they cancelled it, I knew NpO was going to get rolled, but I also predicted that NPO had dug it's own grave. Had they stuck with Polaris through the NoCB war, they would have received some damage, sure... but it would not have been nearly as devastating, and they certainly would have been able to keep a strong group of allies and avoid a heavier hit like the one they received in Karma. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoffron X Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 It's even more amusing that you actually don't believe he would have done a better job of things.Do you think that, given the options that were before you, NPO chose the best course of action and came out with the best possible outcome? No, we did not choose the best course of action, obviously. We did lose, after all. But to say for sure that Ivan would have done better is just meaningless guessing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord of Destruction Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Wait. NPO is still relevant? Yes, and to ever claim otherwise would be ignorant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnKirk Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Yes, and to ever claim otherwise would be ignorant. Ohhh, Italics. Somebody must be defensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vilien Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Ohhh, Italics. Somebody must be defensive. I think he was just using them for emphasis in order to impart a specific tone. Your argument remains as stupid as it was originally. Nice attempt at a comeback though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord of Destruction Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 I think he was just using them for emphasis in order to impart a specific tone. Your argument remains as stupid as it was originally. Nice attempt at a comeback though. Vilien is correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dethklok Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 NPO is still important, they COULD become a power again, but as of now they are an excellent tech farm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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