LiquidMercury Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 I determine right from wrong. Such is implied in the Doctrine. Although right and wrong are subjective to the person doing the determination (for NSO it is obviously you, for the rest of CN not so much) I will say that I whole heartedly agree with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fallen Fool Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) Why do you need a piece of paper to say you can do this?The Cyberverse is populated by irrelevant e-lawyers, and petty demagogues. As annoying or unnecessary as this may seem, the fact of the matter is that by publishing this doctrine publicly the NSO shores up the foundation of their intervention in any future conflict they feel compelled to participate in and hopefully have a stronger defense against accusations of "bandwagoning" from the peanut gallery.What does NSO define as an injustice?The injustices of "peace," "love" and "happiness" are too numerous to list in a platform for discussion such as this. Edited August 9, 2009 by Fallen_Fool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulmar Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Not at all. I was merely pointing out that just because your views differ from another alliance, which they often do, does not mean you can insert yourself into a conflict without rhyme or reason. What if you don't know everything about the situation? Would you just jump into it not knowing who actually faulted who?And here's another question. Would this doctrine exist if you weren't in Frostbite. They do have a reason, its "because we want to". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schattenmann Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 It will be very interesting to see how this plays out over the course of the next month or so. First night is a fizzle so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan Moldavi Posted August 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Well...yeah, of course you could do any one of those things. That's your sovereign right as an alliance. Correct, and to you and those like you that seem to find some pleasure in pointing out the obvious please see Article IV. The bottom line is that while it may be the sovereign right of every alliance to act in accordance with this Doctrine that doesn't mean that such actions actually take place commonly or even regularly. Justice is rarely seen in the Cyberverse these days on any real scale or through any concentrated effort in regards to foreign affairs or activities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyperion321 Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) It's just a Admin given right. You have the same right to do so if you wish, you just choose not to. I disagree with this doctrine. It goes against my convictions and I consider it as an unjust threat to anyone who declares an offensive war. I think I can declare war on NSO now. Awesome. Edited August 9, 2009 by Hyperion321 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haflinger Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Ivan, how does this doctrine coexist with any existing MDPs or MDAPs you may have or gain in the future. Does the Moldavi Doctrine supercede those treaties? Or are they held above the doctrine? If you can explain to me how an MDP or MADP (which as far as I know the NSO does not have) could possibly conflict with this Doctrine, I'd love to hear it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Looks like you're setting yourself up to build up even more of an image later on. Genius move again Ivan, enjoy the publicity from both this and whichever future moves you decide to pull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan Moldavi Posted August 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 First night is a fizzle so far. Sounds a bit like sour grapes since we wouldn't consider a tech raid sufficient manifestation to activate the Doctrine. Declared wars only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nintenderek Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 I disagree with this doctrine. It goes against my convictions and I consider it as an unjust threat to anyone who declares an offensive war. I think I can declare war on NSO now. Awesome. Go ahead. Just expect them to fight back. You have just as much of a right to declare war for being unjust as they do on you. It is the way of the Cyberverse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiquidMercury Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Sounds a bit like sour grapes since we wouldn't consider a tech raid sufficient manifestation to activate the Doctrine. Declared wars only. What if the war happens before the DoW a la NPO on OV? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan Moldavi Posted August 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 I disagree with this doctrine. It goes against my convictions and I consider it as an unjust threat to anyone who declares an offensive war. I think I can declare war on NSO now. Awesome. Feel free. If you can sell enough infra then you can declare upon me. My nation name is Pierconium. If you feel this act to be unjust then prove the rightness of your convictions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fallen Fool Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 I disagree with this doctrine. It goes against my convictions and I consider it as an unjust threat to anyone who declares an offensive war.You favor aggressive war? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 You favor aggressive war? What's wrong with aggressive war? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llanowar Elf Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) Personally i like the doctrine lol Edited August 9, 2009 by Llanowar Elf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan Moldavi Posted August 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 What if the war happens before the DoW a la NPO on OV? A declaration of war doesn't necessarily culminate in a statement in this venue. If an entire alliance is mobilized and tanks are on the move war has been declared, whether explicitly stated or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyperion321 Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) Feel free.If you can sell enough infra then you can declare upon me. My nation name is Pierconium. If you feel this act to be unjust then prove the rightness of your convictions. Spartan policies and actions are not determined by whether or not you feel it is right. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me with this post that you wish us to come to you before we start a war and prove ourselves to you, lest we be attacked if you disagree. Edited August 9, 2009 by Hyperion321 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiquidMercury Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 A declaration of war doesn't necessarily culminate in a statement in this venue.If an entire alliance is mobilized and tanks are on the move war has been declared, whether explicitly stated or not. It's only a real war if it's on [ooc] facebook [ooc] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doitzel Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Just as it is within FOK's rights and sovereignty to sit on their hands and let injustice happen, if that is what they choose. Your readiness to exercise that right makes this announcement seem a little shallow to those of us who agree with it in spirit. I guess I'll believe it when I see it; at the moment it seems like another NSO PR stunt -- the last of which was, ironically, an aggressive perpetration of injustice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fallen Fool Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) What's wrong with aggressive war?Were you to be amoral, then it would certainly have its uses.I was just under the impression that certain of the "Karma" alliances didn't like just attacking people for having differing opinions. Edited August 9, 2009 by Fallen_Fool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimaera Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Correct, and to you and those like you that seem to find some pleasure in pointing out the obvious please see Article IV. The bottom line is that while it may be the sovereign right of every alliance to act in accordance with this Doctrine that doesn't mean that such actions actually take place commonly or even regularly. Justice is rarely seen in the Cyberverse these days on any real scale or through any concentrated effort in regards to foreign affairs or activities. It seems to me that I'm not the one only pointing out the obvious. Logically, this entire Doctrine points out the obvious. It is, basically, an Optional Defense and Aggression Pact you've signed with all of Planet Bob. Given that such actions as you have outlined are always options, even if they are rarely selected, what this really does is just put into words that which all alliances could do if they felt like. I see no problem with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schattenmann Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) Sounds a bit like sour grapes since we wouldn't consider a tech raid sufficient manifestation to activate the Doctrine. <Schattenmann> A raid is a war. <Schattenmann> :colbert: Declared wars only. To: Schattenmann From: deestroyer Date: 8/7/2009 11:23:13 PMSubject: War Declared! Message: War has been declared on you Sooooooo Criteria met, where do we go from here? Edited August 9, 2009 by Schattenmann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 It has its uses.I was just under the impression that certain of the "Karma" alliances didn't like just attacking people for having differing opinions. Sovereign rights are fun, despite a one time deal banner, no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan Moldavi Posted August 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Spartan policies and actions are not determined by whether or not you feel it is right. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me with this post that you wish us to come to you before we start a war and prove ourselves to you, lest we be attacked if you disagree. Umm, no. It was a direct response to you stating that you consider it "awesome" that you can declare upon the NSO. You really are bad at this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiquidMercury Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Spartan policies and actions not determined by whether or not you feel it is right. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me with this post that you wish us to come to you before we start a war and prove ourselves to you, lest we be attacked if you disagree. Hyperion, I'm going to say that Ivan probably means that no piece of paper is going to prevent him from defending who he wants or attacking who he wants. If he see's what he considers injustice he'll attack. If one of his allies with or without a treaty is getting hit, he'll defend. It's a matter of doing exactly what he wants, which is absolutely allowed all of all alliances, yet is unlikely to ever happen by most for the fact that it takes [ooc] balls of steel [ooc] in that it generally nullifies the e-lawyering of treaties while still keeping their intent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.