The GMs Court

[Fizzydog]

[quote name='Zoot Zoot' date='15 July 2010 - 11:02 PM' timestamp='1279252903' post='2374095']
Which they dont, as ive told you over and over again.
[/quote]
I edited it out, but I guess you got in before the edit.

[Executive Minister]

Again, make like the Viet Cong and make em' pay for trodding on you... you're in Asia, right? Bring out the bamboo sticks of death.

[Captain Enema]

Considering Malatose's history of biological weapons you should have shot your cruise missiles at him. At least he is right next door, you might have actually hit something.

[iamthey]

[quote name='Zoot Zoot' date='16 July 2010 - 04:49 AM' timestamp='1279252140' post='2374074']
Cruise missiles wont go from fizzys location to china.
he would need to use an ICBM modified for the deployment of chemical or Biological warfare

and those are the rules i got told when i was shooting them off at pravus.
[/quote]

For the record we do not do rolls for CM's, ICBM's and the like. (unless they are nukes) Just go by what makes sense.

[Fizzydog]

I still have one left.

[Sal Paradise]

[quote name='Fizzydog' date='15 July 2010 - 09:37 AM' timestamp='1279211834' post='2373010']
United Isocoles supports this action.

PRIVATE TO RF:

We can supply you with munitions and even aircraft but sadly cannot fight with you.
[/quote]

So Fizzy sends these two messages at the same time apparently.

Triyun gets the first one, because it's public, which I assume gives him the IC excuse to monitor transmissions between Fizzy and and Kevin KIngswell.

Though he doesn't monitor transmissions between other nations that offered their support. Fortunate for him that they never sent a private transmission offering munitions and aircraft. Good thing he decided to spy on the one that did.

And good thing the GMs allowed time machines too. I got into a discussion on IRC about why time machines should be allowed, but no one agreed with me. I've been gone for a few days, so I must have missed when time machines were allowed, and the thread where Triyun RP'd making one.

This is quite obviously the case, because the IC reason for Triyun to monitor Fizzy's transmissions occurred at the very moment Fizzy sent the classified transmission. Or maybe Triyun's spies are just that fast. Or maybe Fizzy's internets are a series of tubes. And those tubes got filled up and delayed his classified message from arriving, then Triyun's spies crawled into the tubes and found the message.


So can I ask a GM to tell me what is the ruling that allowed this to happen?

1) Time machines
2) Super spies
3) The internet is a series of tubes
4) Other (please specify)

Edited July 16, 2010 by Sal Paradise

[Captain Enema]

Sal has a shockingly good point...

I'm curious to see how this plays out. A retcon seems in order here.

[Triyun]

Actually its pretty standard practice IRL to do signal intercept with military powers you are at war with. Intercepting a message is pretty easy, decoding it is not. We were at war with Kevin Kingswell at the time. We decoded the message later on. The fact that it is standard practice also does not mean that we would announce China in fact does it. That omission in the DoW was deliberate on my part. In fact that'd be something that we would want to remain classified for future events so if such an incident happened again, someone would not be cautious and we could detect the hostile power in the future doing the same thing.

Edited July 16, 2010 by Triyun

[Captain Enema]

[quote name='Triyun' date='15 July 2010 - 11:03 AM' timestamp='1279213403' post='2373068']
[img]http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/9805/uispyroll.png[/img]

Requesting spy roll to break encryption and monitor communications due to public statements of support for warring China.
[/quote]

Except this spy roll came after you heard his public statement. He sent his private message at the same time. You started eavesdropping afterwards. I saw no rolls against Kingswell, though I didn't look that far back either so I might have missed it.

[Sargun II]

This isn't a real-time strategy game. How do we know that the messages were sent at the [b]exact[/b] same time? How do we know that there wasn't a slight delay, like in the form of a few minutes? We don't. Triyun isn't omnipotent, so he wouldn't be able to post literally immediately when Fizzydog posts as well. Triyun had to get on, read, decide to do a spy roll, and then respond. It's reasonable to assume that as soon as Fizzydog gives public support, Triyun would start intercepting. In fact, that's exactly what Triyun did - he started intercepting right when Fizzydog started giving public support.

Fizzydog didn't specify they were sent at the exact same time, and due to the logical nature of posts we can also assume that the private message was sent after the public message, so Triyun's roll would be legitimate.

[Captain Enema]

Then again it can be safely assumed that Fizzy sent the message at nearly the same time. Further, what government machine works so well that it can immediately order its forces to start intercepting anything?

Haven't seen that one yet.

So no, Triyun's roll is not legitimate for intercept the message he did, however, all future messages would be fair game.

[Sargun II]

"Nearly" the same time is not the same as exactly the same time. Your laughable but wrong joke against governments is just that: laughably wrong. Governments are incredibly efficient when they're in the business of democracy: a military commander says "do it" and you do it. If you're at war, you're understandably going to be monitoring for any secret transmissions, and when somebody suddenly voices support to forces against you you're not going to want to waste any time at all. The US and Russia both intercept transmissions all of the damn time, even though they're not at war.

Let's not forget to mention that neither of us have proof that the messages were sent at the same time or after another: so both of our points are based on our opinions on how posts are read.

[Malatose]

[quote name='Tidy Bowl Man' date='15 July 2010 - 09:48 PM' timestamp='1279255705' post='2374182']
Considering Malatose's history of biological weapons you should have shot your cruise missiles at him. At least he is right next door, you might have actually hit something.
[/quote]

I agree. He should have hit me with WMDs. Of course, what happens after I am not responsible for.

[Sal Paradise]

[quote name='Triyun' date='16 July 2010 - 06:57 AM' timestamp='1279288652' post='2374426']
Actually its pretty standard practice IRL to do signal intercept with military powers you are at war with. Intercepting a message is pretty easy, decoding it is not. We were at war with Kevin Kingswell at the time. We decoded the message later on. The fact that it is standard practice also does not mean that we would announce China in fact does it. That omission in the DoW was deliberate on my part. In fact that'd be something that we would want to remain classified for future events so if such an incident happened again, someone would not be cautious and we could detect the hostile power in the future doing the same thing.
[/quote]

It would be reasonable to assume that you monitor transmissions between nations you are at war with, without RPing them, and I guess also reasonable to assume that you don't announce this, even to your own spies.


[quote name='Triyun' date='15 July 2010 - 09:59 AM' timestamp='1279213167' post='2373063']
Covert Actions:

[b]Signal Intercepts are ordered between UI and RF.[/b]
[/quote]

And they then fired up the time machine to tell their past selves to intercept signals between UI and RF. Or maybe they were doing it all along without knowing and you finally informed them what they'd been doing? I know I was planning on RPing my spy agency as overly paranoid and turning on itself too.

The problem of the ambiguity of the grammar seems to be solved here.


[quote name='Triyun' date='15 July 2010 - 10:03 AM' timestamp='1279213403' post='2373068']
Requesting spy roll to break encryption [b]and monitor communications[/b] due to public statements of support for warring China.
[/quote]

You asked for a spy roll to monitor communications. Assuming that you claim to have been monitoring their communications all along, because that's what nations do, and you seem to think this should require a spy roll, did you ask for a spy roll when the war started or is this spy roll retroactive to justify something that was already happening and so obviously already happening that it didn't need to be mentioned?

[Triyun]

[quote name='Tidy Bowl Man' date='16 July 2010 - 03:23 PM' timestamp='1279290162' post='2374451']
Except this spy roll came after you heard his public statement. He sent his private message at the same time. You started eavesdropping afterwards. I saw no rolls against Kingswell, though I didn't look that far back either so I might have missed it.
[/quote]

Because Kingswell sent no reply back. Otherwise you would have seen us spy roll against him. Cryptologists need messages in order to decode. If we saw any classified transmissions there which we had reasonable suspicion to decode other than Fizzy's there would have been similar action. Sargun's right, this was an extremely common practice by the US and Russians, but also it was common going back to even World War I, with the British intercepting communications between the Mexicans and Germans which partially contributed to the US entering the war.

[Zoot Zoot]

[quote name='Triyun' date='16 July 2010 - 05:35 PM' timestamp='1279298102' post='2374591']
Because Kingswell sent no reply back. Otherwise you would have seen us spy roll against him. Cryptologists need messages in order to decode. If we saw any classified transmissions there which we had reasonable suspicion to decode other than Fizzy's there would have been similar action. Sargun's right, this was an extremely common practice by the US and Russians, but also it was common going back to even World War I, with the British intercepting communications between the Mexicans and Germans which partially contributed to the US entering the war.
[/quote]


Unrestrained submarine warfare contributing the to murder of hundreds of people wasnt a catalyst at all.

[Triyun]

[quote name='Zoot Zoot' date='16 July 2010 - 06:52 PM' timestamp='1279302753' post='2374731']
Unrestrained submarine warfare contributing the to murder of hundreds of people wasnt a catalyst at all.
[/quote]

I think you need to read the word [b]partial[/b] rather than make smart $@! remarks to try and show off.

[Zoot Zoot]

[quote name='Triyun' date='16 July 2010 - 07:00 PM' timestamp='1279303188' post='2374744']
I think you need to read the word [b]partial[/b] rather than make smart $@! remarks to try and show off.
[/quote]

Hit a nerve? I think so.
Regardless, as much as TBM's argument is valid, im swayed more by sarguns and Triyuns explanation simply because of its plausibility, but I would say the actions taken by triyun are close to the godmodding line but not quite.

[Shatner]

I'm swayed by the fact that Fizzy recognized it IC to the point that his nation capitulated.

[JEDCJT]

I would like two spy rolls on Eggman Empire. Here it is:

[img]http://i731.photobucket.com/albums/ww320/LordJedcjt/spyodds.png[/img]

One for encryption, one for cyberwarfare

[Lynneth]

[quote name='JEDCJT' date='19 July 2010 - 06:58 PM' timestamp='1279558695' post='2378973']
I would like two spy rolls on Eggman Empire. Here it is:

[img]http://i731.photobucket.com/albums/ww320/LordJedcjt/spyodds.png[/img]

One for encryption, one for cyberwarfare
[/quote]
Fail: 1-10
Win: 11-100

[IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v284/Lynneth_del_Serpentas/AE/Thing284.png[/IMG][IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v284/Lynneth_del_Serpentas/AE/Thing285.png[/IMG]

A win, a fail. Cyberwarfare is failure.

[Kevin Kingswell]

Would the GM's allow me to create a made up tropical island near America. The island would be quite small big enough for about three cities at most and of course I would give up the Foundation in Antartica.

Is this okay?

[Il Terra Di Agea]

[quote name='Kevin Kingswell' date='19 July 2010 - 04:08 PM' timestamp='1279580907' post='2379458']
Would the GM's allow me to create a made up tropical island near America. The island would be quite small big enough for about three cities at most and of course I would give up the Foundation in Antartica.

Is this okay?
[/quote]
... No, that is not okay. CNRP uses earth as a model, and so long as it is not an RPed, massive, artificially created island (By the way, an island that big would not be feasible for any nation to build, let alone one with the resources of a nation in Antarctica). So, no, I can say, on my own behalf, you should not be allowed to do that.

[Kevin Kingswell]

[quote name='Il Terra Di Agea' date='19 July 2010 - 06:39 PM' timestamp='1279582779' post='2379501']
... No, that is not okay. CNRP uses earth as a model, and so long as it is not an RPed, massive, artificially created island (By the way, an island that big would not be feasible for any nation to build, let alone one with the resources of a nation in Antarctica). So, no, I can say, on my own behalf, you should not be allowed to do that.
[/quote]

*sigh*

Okay so I have to find a real life tropical island that no one has taken then? Also I wasn't going to actually build the island like Naboo did I meant I would just RP the island as having been around for a long time but been left uninhabitated for many years.

Edited July 19, 2010 by Kevin Kingswell

[Il Terra Di Agea]

[quote name='Kevin Kingswell' date='19 July 2010 - 04:46 PM' timestamp='1279583144' post='2379502']
*sigh*

Okay so I have to find a real life tropical island that no one has taken then? Also I wasn't going to actually build the island like Naboo did I meant I would just RP the island as having been around for a long time but been left uninhabited for many years.
[/quote]
In short, yes. As I said in my earlier post, if the island isn't there IRL, you have to make it, and it's implausible to do so. So yah, you will need to find a real island that no one is RPing.