Cataduanes Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 Take some responsibility for once. We did, hence this announcement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamacus Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 (edited) @BillnTed It's ironic you say that seeing as when we picked our side we were pretty sure all six of the alliances were going to stick with NPO. I honestly thought we were going to get slaughtered by the combined might of IRON/NPO. We put our money where our mouth was and picked the side we thought was in the right. Based on IRON's reaction I'm guessing NPO went to war without actually checking to see if they were with them. Perhaps next time you should treat your friends with more respect and in return they will respect you. You reap what you sow NPO and all you've ever done is show utter disregard to every other alliance. Edited April 22, 2009 by Jamacus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coursca Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 We did, hence this announcement. I am a relatively open-minded individual and most anyone who knows me will attest to this. That said: Nothing you say will change how I feel about this. Don't waste your breath. You knew what you were doing when you posted this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mussolandia Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 How noble of the ODN to fight in those wars where victory is assured. Stay true to your colors, ODNers. You've been running away from danger since that cursed day you arrived here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enderland Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 I wondered how long it would take for ODN to weasel its way out of its obligations, surprisingly longer than expected.It looks like the Optional Defence Network hasnt learnt a thing, dont sign treaties that you wont honor when the going gets tough. Either declare total neutrality in a conflict or scrap treaties; its hard to see how choosing which treaties you will honor and which treaties you wont somehow gives you the moral highground to decry the actions of others. If I was in IRON now Id be wondering whether or not to take the same approach to treaties as ODN, ignore the Orange Senate Treaty and take ODNs seat, afterall it was only signed so that we could pick or choose wheather or not to actually honor it. To Pansy; if your reading this you can count myself in on your quest. You know exactly what I mean. You know I love you, but I don't think your alliance can even come close to blasting someone else at this point regarding treaties. They at least said this before their allies got attacked :s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cataduanes Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 Don't waste your breath. As you wish. How noble of the ODN to fight in those wars where victory is assured. Stay true to your colors, ODNers. You've been running away from danger since that cursed day you arrived here. Hi Musso B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 ODN, kindly explain what BS you put up with under my watch because I'd love to hear it considering I was one of the most pro-ODN Councilors in recent history.Because, as far as I recall, you guys shot yourselves in the foot more often than not when you had an opportunity to advance yourselves in the FA realm and be taken seriously. Why do you think you lost so many of your government members over the last year? You guys didn't have it together. I also believe that I tried to help you guys repeatedly at the risk of my own reputation and credibility with several allies and friends. I tried to defend you guys after you dropped on Polaris last war. And after the war, I defended you to several individuals in Polaris. So don't give me this load of crap "we aren't going to take IRON's BS anymore." It is not IRON's fault (nor mine) that ODN couldn't make headway in anything you did. Its your own fault. Take some responsibility for once. I may not be in IRON anymore, but I am no less insulted personally at the insinuation that I, in my capacity with IRON, was holding you back. Ridiculous. I think, for once, we actually are taking responsibility. We are taking responsibility for determining our own path. Coursca, in my limited interactions with you I would definitely have to agree that you came across as the most pro-ODN councilor. If you have time I will explain my personal opinions on the interactions between our alliances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 How noble of the ODN to fight in those wars where victory is assured. Stay true to your colors, ODNers. You've been running away from danger since that cursed day you arrived here. Victory assured? We made this decision without knowing what we were up against. We made this decision with full knowledge that we might end up a pile of rubble. The fact that the "other side" backed down after we made our announcement is not something we have control over. Since you remember that far back, I am sure you can recall some wars we fought in which defeat was assured. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coursca Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 How noble of the ODN to fight in those wars where victory is assured. Stay true to your colors, ODNers. You've been running away from danger since that cursed day you arrived here. My name is Coursca and I approve this message. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpoiL Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 How noble of the ODN to fight in those wars where victory is assured. Stay true to your colors, ODNers. You've been running away from danger since that cursed day you arrived here. At the time of this announcement, this announcement hadn't been made. I gotta be honest, I was wondering why ODN was getting an applause(for the most part). Then I checked that fun fact and it put it in perspective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Impero Romano Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 Dear ODN, Please don't make me like you. From, Impero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mussolandia Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 (edited) It is pointless to pretend any stance taken by the ODN is one of principle instead of convenience. These people have never had warm blood in their veins. It doesn't matter which announcement came first or last. Amongst any circle of learned men you could have wandered into in the last few days, the talk was simply what sort of disadvantage the NPO would be facing and who would strike first. It is true, the NPO had not yet blundered whilst the ODN held their discussions. But it doesn't matter. Sun Tzu applies here, this war had been won before it was ever fought and ODN had already picked their side. Edited April 22, 2009 by Mussolandia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joracy Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 Dear ODN,Please don't make me like you. From, Impero I know man, it would really suck D: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portugal Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 It is pointless to pretend any stance taken by the ODN is one of principle instead of convenience. These people have never had warm blood in their veins. It doesn't matter which announcement came first or last. Amongst any circle of learned men you could have wandered into in the last few days, the talk was simply what sort of disadvantage the NPO would be facing and who would strike first. It is true, the NPO had not yet blundered whilst the ODN held their discussions. But it doesn't matter. Sun Tzu applies here, this war had been won before it was ever fought and ODN had already picked their side. Being the underdog doesn't automatically make an alliance one of principles. Siding with NPO's allies just for the sake of it wouldn't accomplish anything except giving them the line of "hey we joined the weak side hail us", which most people with half a brain would also (and rightfully) point as a flaw. Thinking otherwise is ludicrous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ventus ex Gutter Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 It is pointless to pretend any stance taken by the ODN is one of principle instead of convenience. These people have never had warm blood in their veins. It doesn't matter which announcement came first or last. Amongst any circle of learned men you could have wandered into in the last few days, the talk was simply what sort of disadvantage the NPO would be facing and who would strike first. It is true, the NPO had not yet blundered whilst the ODN held their discussions. But it doesn't matter. Sun Tzu applies here, this war had been won before it was ever fought and ODN had already picked their side. Why don't you tell that to the six alliances that bailed last night? They pretty much won the war against...themselves... Fine if you just don't like ODN. I realize that some people just don't like other people. Period. But don't let it blind you. Be happy they're making some sort of effort and/or choice. They could've just as easily said, "To hell with all of this!" and declared neutrality, avoiding any possibility of conflict altogether. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neboe Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 It is pointless to pretend any stance taken by the ODN is one of principle instead of convenience. These people have never had warm blood in their veins. It doesn't matter which announcement came first or last. Amongst any circle of learned men you could have wandered into in the last few days, the talk was simply what sort of disadvantage the NPO would be facing and who would strike first. It is true, the NPO had not yet blundered whilst the ODN held their discussions. But it doesn't matter. Sun Tzu applies here, this war had been won before it was ever fought and ODN had already picked their side. I do not think this war had been won before it was ever fought, but then I'm not privy to the volumes of IRC conversation that no doubt went into the mass exodus of NPO "allies." I also believe the time/date stamps on the announcements are entirely germane to disproving your point. Had the ODN made this announcement knowing that IRON and company were going to turn their backs on the NPO, then perhaps you vitriol would be warranted. This was not the case and the rest of us a left seeing your venom as the rants of some poor soul blinded by the hatred seeded some 3 years ago at the onset of the Citrus War, which is a shining example of just how hot the ODN blood runs, by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeroicDisaster Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 (edited) Funny, someone from Valhalla trolling ODN, an alliance who glorify war, sitting in peace mode, and who dropped NPO. Edited April 22, 2009 by HeroicDisaster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jens of the desert Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 Well obviously it doesn't...you can all take that out of your sigs now as it is redundant. Unless you hunger for peace, in that case, carry on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafael Nadal Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 Well obviously it doesn't...you can all take that out of your sigs now as it is redundant. Unless you hunger for peace, in that case, carry on. I think you're in for a surprise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobbies0310 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 So what was the point of this. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joracy Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 Well obviously it doesn't...you can all take that out of your sigs now as it is redundant. Unless you hunger for peace, in that case, carry on. ...wut? Your post confuses me greatly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jens of the desert Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 (edited) ...wut? Your post confuses me greatly. How does it confuse you greatly? Edit: Now not one word. Edited April 22, 2009 by Jens of the desert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeroicDisaster Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 Well obviously it doesn't...you can all take that out of your sigs now as it is redundant. Unless you hunger for peace, in that case, carry on. I think you should wait a few more updates, and then wait and see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cataduanes Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 (edited) Dunno about the Network but boy i am hungry *Cata wanders off to knock up a green curry Edited April 22, 2009 by Cataduanes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soccerbum Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 (edited) Hi, Cour. We had somewhat of a discussion about this last night, but let me make this a little bit more clear for you. I still <3 you man. ODN, kindly explain what BS you put up with under my watch because I'd love to hear it considering I was one of the most pro-ODN Councilors in recent history. One Councilor does not make a Council. I sat in calls and conversations in which NPO was openly hostile to ODN, yet other IRON Councilors didn't make a single remark about it. Because, as far as I recall, you guys shot yourselves in the foot more often than not when you had an opportunity to advance yourselves in the FA realm and be taken seriously. Why do you think you lost so many of your government members over the last year? You guys didn't have it together. ODN did not shoot ourselves in the foot. ODN wanted an MADP with IRON. And how were we told to get it? Oh, just sign an MDP with Valhalla, an alliance with which we had little relations with to begin with. So for many months, I worked to strengthen the relationship between ODN and Valhalla - hosting them on our forums for a Q&A, talking with many of their government members in private, and so on. And when it finally got to the point where ODN felt comfortable with Valhalla, what happened? It was rejected. And if you call 'dropping Polaris' an opportunity to advance, then you clearly have no idea how hard of a decision it was for the ODN at the time. Yes, we eventually 'dropped' them, but it wasn't something we were going to do lightly just because 'the other camp' wanted us to. I also believe that I tried to help you guys repeatedly at the risk of my own reputation and credibility with several allies and friends. I tried to defend you guys after you dropped on Polaris last war. And after the war, I defended you to several individuals in Polaris. Again, one Councilor does not make a Council. So don't give me this load of crap "we aren't going to take IRON's BS anymore." It is not IRON's fault (nor mine) that ODN couldn't make headway in anything you did. Its your own fault. Perhaps a conversation with FinsterBaby would do you well. Take some responsibility for once. Responsibility? Here is a prime example of the pot calling the kettle black. How can an ex-IRON Councilor tell ODN to 'take responsibility' when IRON just recently dropped their MADP with Pacifica. Hey, it's not ODN's fault that it doesn't sign five million MDPs with the same alliance. I personally don't see any sense in it. I may not be in IRON anymore, but I am no less insulted personally at the insinuation that I, in my capacity with IRON, was holding you back. Ridiculous. Again, you as a Councilor, no. Council in general, yes. Remember how 'revolutionary' it was when IRON proposed switching up Orange Senate seats and everyone hailed them for it? Well, guess what Coursca? ODN brought it up months, if not YEARS before that, yet IRON wasn't happy with it so we held back. Then, oh wait, IRON did it without even talking to ODN about it. Sorta like that time when GOONS came back and it slipped IRON's mind to inform ODN prior to finding out on the OWF. Edited April 22, 2009 by soccerbum879 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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