Jrenster Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Alright, well I await to see your claims be substantiated. Until then, they are just words without meaning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brucemania Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Hmm i am wondering if this means that doomhouse will not defend MK if they are attacked ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Apocalypse Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Jrenster' timestamp='1339686129' post='2983393'] Alright, well I await to see your claims be substantiated. Until then, they are just words without meaning. [/quote] Just like the OP. [quote name='brucemania' timestamp='1339686291' post='2983396'] Hmm i am wondering if this means that doomhouse will not defend MK if they are attacked ? [/quote] heh. Edited June 14, 2012 by Johnny Apocalypse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote name='brucemania' timestamp='1339686291' post='2983396'] Hmm i am wondering if this means that doomhouse will not defend MK if they are attacked ? [/quote] You mean the fact that JA is calling you guys out on publically taking a crap on MK is indictive of DH not wanting to defend MK? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brucemania Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Well i am thinking what the slant will be if they defend MK and the apperently stated he knows the words he used words ..and what the difference would be to anyone definding a ALLY ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Apocalypse Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote name='brucemania' timestamp='1339686656' post='2983404'] Well i am thinking what the slant will be if they defend MK and the apperently stated he knows the words he used words ..and what the difference would be to anyone definding a ALLY ... [/quote] he's right i know the words because i used words Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrenster Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Johnny Apocalypse' timestamp='1339686355' post='2983398'] Just like the OP. [/quote] Well no, it's only meaningless when/if you substantiate your claims. It's interesting because you are in exactly the same position, and yet we are wrong and you are right simply because we made a post about it and you did not. You don't care too much for what MK is doing, you've announced it in this thread, and I'm pretty sure you'll be going in for MK anyways. Edited June 14, 2012 by Jrenster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brucemania Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote]Johnny Apocalypse Eh I think this war was possibly the dumbest move to make....[/quote] There you go Johnny your words .. So i guess it will be okay for Umbrella to support MK during this conflick which is of course the right thing to do .. but cause NPO says the same thing it is wrong for us to support our Allies ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merrie Melodies Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Johnny Apocalypse' timestamp='1339685281' post='2983377'] Well I guess Brehon isn't around so we've got you to play revisionist word games with instead. The truth is you don't really have any objections to this war at all, in fact this war actually works to your benefit because it means you get to make statements like the OP to try and look like you have the moral high ground to rally people to your sphere of influence. I'm sure when you were informed of the potential war you didn't actually tell your allies that you'd make a thread with such blatant moral posturing in which you denounce the legitimacy of the war did you? You're not fooling me, you're still a bunch of snakes. [/quote] This comment at NPO: If you planned on honoring your treaty then you publicly should have kept your mouth shut about your grievance with the cb, how is bashing your allies cb while trying to take a hypocritical high road actually supporting your ally? All you have done with this thread screw over MK's pr. Edited June 14, 2012 by Merrie Melodies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brucemania Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) Dam i got beat to the punchline That is my point Merrie Melodies .. one would assume that through Doomhouse Umbrella will honor their Treaty and defend MK Edited June 14, 2012 by brucemania Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote name='Jrenster' timestamp='1339686942' post='2983412'] Well no, it's only meaningless when/if you substantiate your claims. It's interesting because you are in exactly the same position, and yet we are wrong and you are right simply because we made a post about it and you did not. You don't care too much for what MK is doing, you've announced it in this thread, and I'm pretty sure you'll be going in for MK anyways. [/quote] Yes because Umbrella made a public announcement with the sole purpose of saying MK's reason was BS in an official capacity. Your emperor's announcement does not equate JA's individual posts, but you know whatever floats your boat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Apocalypse Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Jrenster' timestamp='1339686942' post='2983412'] Well no, it's only meaningless when/if you substantiate your claims. It's interesting because you are in exactly the same position, and yet we are wrong and you are right simply because we made a post about it and you did not. You don't care too much for what MK is doing, you've announced it in this thread, and I'm pretty sure you'll be going in for MK anyways. [/quote] All I see in the OP are a bunch of blanket statements designed to cover your asses against being found out that you were okay with this all along. So it is pretty meaningless when you actually know it's all complete bs. [quote name='brucemania' timestamp='1339687182' post='2983414'] There you go Johnny your words .. So i guess it will be okay for Umbrella to support MK during this conflick which is of course the right thing to do .. but cause NPO says the same thing it is wrong for us to support our Allies ? [/quote] Let me just set this straight for the pair of you. I do indeed think this war is dumb so obviously I'm not really in favour of it, you also claim that you're not in favour of it. The problem I have is that you were actually in favour of it and that you are essentially lying and taking a steaming !@#$ on MK to better yourselves politically. I don't agree with the war but I agree even less with your treachery. Don't try and portray this as me agreeing with your stance because your stance is a complete 180 from what it was prior to the DoW. You see, I actually think this war is a terrible idea whereas you only claim to feel the same way. You are lying, I am not. This is the difference between my condemnations of this war and your condemnations. Also it should be noted that while I used to have authority in Umbrella, I'm just a retired rank and file member these days but that doesn't mean I don't know what's going on or what you guys are playing at. Edited June 14, 2012 by Johnny Apocalypse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New Frontier Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Ever honourable, Pacifica. Only a shame that, entirely unpredictably, your newfound friends have stooped to this kind of rough housing. I, for one, am shocked, and in awe of your noble choice. Brehon doesn't lie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princess Doomee Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote name='Reyas' timestamp='1339643534' post='2982667'] You should have switched things up and declared war on FAN and FARK. [/quote] Afraid to do your own dirty work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrenster Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1339687790' post='2983440'] Yes because Umbrella made a public announcement with the sole purpose of saying MK's reason was BS in an official capacity. Your emperor's announcement does not equate JA's individual posts, but you know whatever floats your boat. [/quote] Except this is an argument of our intentions, not of the quantity of words we have thrown at the screen. The only difference is that JA thinks we're being snakes, but has yet to provide evidence for it. [quote]All I see in the OP are a bunch of blanket statements designed to cover your asses against being found out that you were okay with this all along. So it is pretty meaningless when you actually know it's all complete bs.[/quote] I actually have no idea what you're talking about. I personally know our thoughts about it before the war happened, and it was definitely the ones up here. Your big dig at us is that we were okay with the war before it happened but you have nothing to show for it. We are just arguing in circles until you show everybody what the hell you're talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhaan Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 I would like to echo what many have stated already. People stand by their friends, and they should, unless their friends are doing something stupid, in which case they need to be friend enough to call a spade a spade. Honoring treaties is noble, but following your heart is just. It's never easy to do the right thing. That's where true leadership comes into play, imo. You don't believe in this war, but you'll fight it because you're friends are. It's harder sometimes to stand up to friends than enemies. Doing what's right doesn't always earn you popularity votes. You may be accused of whatever for backing out of a treaty, and maybe you should consider how your treaties are worded in the future, but I don't see how you can go to war in the name of "honoring treaties" and "supporting allies" when you don't support the justification. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote name='Jrenster' timestamp='1339688466' post='2983454'] Except this is an argument of our intentions, not of the quantity of words we have thrown at the screen. The only difference is that JA thinks we're being snakes, but has yet to provide evidence for it. [/quote] You agreed to a war and then immediately publically berated your ally for having a weak CB. I think your intentions are well noted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrenster Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 MK is not our ally what the hell? Our priority is supporting our ally. It was a difficult choice considering we did not agree with the circumstances with the war. Those are our intentions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Apocalypse Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) [quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1339689264' post='2983474'] You agreed to a war and then immediately publically berated your ally for having a weak CB. I think your intentions are well noted. [/quote] Pretty much this. The entire OP is in itself self-contradicting, at first glance it appears as though NPO are being just and honourable by saying things like "we will defend our allies" and "we won't impose reparations" but the fact is this thread is just an attempt to one up their allies which they are so valiantly claiming to be ready to defend just so they can move up the political pecking order once again. These same people who months ago trusted you enough to get over the stigma of NPO being the same NPO from years back. You did not need to make this statement at all, if you found this war so disagreeable why did you choose to let your allies proceed and why did you not object enough to it to ensure it didn't happen? At the end of the day it's just dirty politics which is what I'd like to see more of but don't expect everyone to buy your party line. Loyalty to allies? Yeah right. Edited June 14, 2012 by Johnny Apocalypse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote name='Jrenster' timestamp='1339689528' post='2983478'] MK is not our ally what the hell? Our priority is supporting our ally. It was a difficult choice considering we did not agree with the circumstances with the war. Those are our intentions. [/quote] You're essentially badmouthing your allies who will support MK by your posturing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred von Tirpitz Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote name='Delta1212' timestamp='1339677583' post='2983290'] Apparently. [/quote] So that it then? Someone has to declare a war on your allies to make sure you visit the owf? or even visit CN in general? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horatio Longworth Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote name='Alfred von Tirpitz' timestamp='1339690500' post='2983513'] So that it then? Someone has to declare a war on your allies to make sure you visit the owf? or even visit CN in general? [/quote] Actually, this is about the point we get pre-empted for taking a side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Greenberg Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Brehon' timestamp='1339642834' post='2982605'] [b]The New Pacific Order, despite our ancient history, does not support this kind of warlord-dominated anarchy. [/b] However, we are an alliance that wants to stand by its honor and its commitments, regardless of the costs. We have many allies with a probable stake in this conflict, even if they are on a side whose actions we cannot get behind. We view it as our sacred duty to be at their back, especially when they have been at our side when we needed it most. The New Pacific Order is fully aware of which side most of our allies stand on, and we will fully back them, via force of arms if needed. [/quote]Okay, I read this too fast originally. Do what you have to do, but realize your allies aren't going to cut ties with MK after this, and MK isn't going to magically change their attitude either. Edited June 14, 2012 by Ryan Greenberg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delta1212 Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 [quote name='Alfred von Tirpitz' timestamp='1339690500' post='2983513'] So that it then? Someone has to declare a war on your allies to make sure you visit the owf? or even visit CN in general? [/quote] There are other ways, but this one does work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brucemania Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Well regardless of the CB i do not see were stating that we will help our Allies if need is so much a big deal but of course it is NPO and whatever we do will get jumped on regardless. I can see if MK gets countered the rest of DH defending them and Johnny of course your retired but as a retired former Gov member one could assume you still have the respect and voice of your AA and their opinions. To be honest as well Johnny I would be one of the first to stand up and say to that fact and salute you and say Awesome to Standing up for you allies. It all comes down to interpretation and how you want to see it. Fact is the CB may not be the most solid but we have allies tied to it and if so and called for we are stating we are behind them if needed. We got pre empted if i recall for not showing intention or any kind of support ( I think you remember that Johnny) and even discussions people said a silent NPO is a dangerous NPO... well guess what we are here and loud and that is what it is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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