Omniscient1 Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='The Reccesion' timestamp='1296619054' post='2615559'] This question can be applied to NpO allies as well. It would be interesting to see why they would chose to peace out so fast. [/quote] Has a direct NpO ally surrendered at all yet? [quote name='wickedj' timestamp='1296621371' post='2615613'] We're going to PZI FAR and then pre-empt Fark [/quote] Wait until I get out of anarchy fist and I'll join you in that crusade. I want to fight Smontag again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliph Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='The Reccesion' timestamp='1296618393' post='2615537'] As I was logging onto the CN Forums and FAR Forums a thought came into my head. [b]Could it be that PB and CnG and co. are offering peace to the alliances around Polar and Pacifica and eventually surrounding The Orders and beating the living the snot out of them eventually or is it just regular peace?[/b] [/quote] Yes, this is what is going on, and has gone on in all major conflicts since Karma. Light to no terms for allies of the targets, and harsh terms and a beating for the targets themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirWilliam Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 * no terms for the targets themselves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldie Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='Wishywashy' timestamp='1296620579' post='2615600'] What would be the consequences for pledging not to reenter the conflict, and then, later, well, you know. [/quote] My theory on this, is if you break terms once, there is no reason to ever be offered them a 2nd time. It would take an alliance leader who really hates his membership to pull that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade Craig Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='The Reccesion' timestamp='1296618393' post='2615537'] [b]Could it be that PB and CnG and co. are offering peace to the alliances around Polar and Pacifica and eventually surrounding The Orders and beating the living the snot out of them eventually or is it just regular peace?[/b] [/quote] You clearly have a spy in our coordination channel. Our evil plot has been exposed. All is lost. -Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliph Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='SirWilliam' timestamp='1296631162' post='2615909'] * no terms for the targets themselves [/quote] I stand corrected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the rebel Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='SirWilliam' timestamp='1296631162' post='2615909'] * no terms for the targets themselves[/quote] [quote name='Caliph' timestamp='1296635845' post='2615982'] I stand corrected.[/quote] Caliph why would there be terms when they want to wipe you from the face of the earth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='SirWilliam' timestamp='1296631162' post='2615909'] * no terms for the targets themselves [/quote] OMG you will give us no terms, time to disband Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayzie Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='The Reccesion' timestamp='1296619780' post='2615587'] The same people quit early and allow curbstomps, it's rather annoying now tbqh. [/quote] The wars were going to be curbstomps regardless of people defending their allies or not, when you're outnumbered, you're outnumbered. Obviously, they're going to beat hard on certain alliances who they know will buckle early, so they're free to concentrate elsewhere. You do what you and your alliance can but there's only so much you can do until your alliances needs come first. By that, I mean, when most of your alliance are complaining of bill lock and on the verge of surrender or when acceptable terms come around at the right time for you, if you feel you've done enough, you take them. Sometimes that's two weeks in, sometimes four, sometimes apparently it's 15 hours lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamuella Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 The Recession, do you have any other basic tactics of warfare that amaze and bewilder you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayzie Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='Lamuella' timestamp='1296657485' post='2616150'] The Recession, do you have any other basic tactics of warfare that amaze and bewilder you? [/quote] Have you ever heard of turtling? I hear that's the best war technique. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judge X Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 I am giving this thread the... Captain Obvious award [img]http://www.mediabistro.com/agencyspy/files/original/captain.obvious.jpg[/img] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoppistan Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 (edited) [quote name='joracy' timestamp='1296620198' post='2615597'] Our plan is to give everybody white peace, then randomly preempt all of them in about a month. [/quote] Awesome. Best answer yet. Also, to the OP: Divide and Conquer. Edited February 2, 2011 by Kzoppistan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhawk Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='goldielax25' timestamp='1296633039' post='2615944'] My theory on this, is if you break terms once, there is no reason to ever be offered them a 2nd time. It would take an alliance leader who really hates his membership to pull that. [/quote] You're starting to sound like NPO regarding fan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penkala Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='Sardonic' timestamp='1296621016' post='2615604'] What makes you think we're using tactics? We put a bunch of alliance names on a dartboard and the two darts we threw hit NPO and NpO. From there we just went with it. [/quote] A small riot was started after we hit Pacifica with the second dart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldie Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='mhawk' timestamp='1296664742' post='2616257'] You're starting to sound like NPO regarding fan [/quote] I can see where the comparison could be made, but in all fairness what FAN did to 'deserve' their 2nd war was ridiculous, and NPO did far worse in their terms of keeping their individuals in compliance than the alleged 1/3 of FAN's. That being said, if you agree to do something like not re-enter a war, and then you re-enter, how could you be trusted to follow through again? If people can't uphold the lenient terms of a beige peace, then they probably wouldn't uphold any terms the 2nd time around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilrow Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='goldielax25' timestamp='1296668152' post='2616317'] I can see where the comparison could be made, but in all fairness what FAN did to 'deserve' their 2nd war was ridiculous, [b]and NPO did far worse in their terms of keeping their individuals in compliance than the alleged 1/3 of FAN's.[/b] That being said, if you agree to do something like not re-enter a war, and then you re-enter, how could you be trusted to follow through again? If people can't uphold the lenient terms of a beige peace, then they probably wouldn't uphold any terms the 2nd time around. [/quote] That's a laugh and historical revisionism at best. We not only followed up weekly on everyone to make sure people were in compliance, but stayed in communication with those in charge of making sure we were in terms of who was in and out of compliance. Furthermore, we even expelled members frequently who ignored messages to get in terms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldie Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='Bilrow' timestamp='1296668888' post='2616327'] That's a laugh and historical revisionism at best. We not only followed up weekly on everyone to make sure people were in compliance, but stayed in communication with those in charge of making sure we were in terms of who was in and out of compliance. Furthermore, we even expelled members frequently who ignored messages to get in terms. [/quote] Oh come on, you regularly had people over the soldier/tank limits, enough so that we stopped caring about them and only focused on aid violators. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penkala Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='Bilrow' timestamp='1296668888' post='2616327'] That's a laugh and historical revisionism at best. We not only followed up weekly on everyone to make sure people were in compliance, but stayed in communication with those in charge of making sure we were in terms of who was in and out of compliance. Furthermore, we even expelled members frequently who ignored messages to get in terms. [/quote] There were lots of violations by NPO that we let slip. Lots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilrow Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 (edited) [quote name='goldielax25' timestamp='1296669359' post='2616336'] Oh come on, you regularly had people over the soldier/tank limits, enough so that we stopped caring about them and only focused on aid violators. [/quote] Yeah it's called losing a trade that affected your population count by reducing your citizens. It was never more than handful of people each time and they were quickly resolved with a private message. Guess VE wouldn't know about that since the only experience they have is running and disbanding. [quote name='Penkala' timestamp='1296669579' post='2616338'] There were lots of violations by NPO that we let slip. Lots. [/quote] You could try to pull this line on most people in NPO. But I was responsible for the compliance checks and I know better than that. Yes, there were some of violations each week but it was never the same person. Members who ignored messages or continually were violation problems were expelled. I am sure ghosts were out of complaince but that wouldn't be held against us since our "keepers" had a list of who was a ghost. Edited February 2, 2011 by Bilrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirWilliam Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='D34th' timestamp='1296655781' post='2616123'] OMG you will give us no terms, time to disband [/quote] Well of course I won't, I'm not at war with you guys to begin with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldie Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='Bilrow' timestamp='1296669736' post='2616342'] Yeah it's called losing a trade that affected your population count by reducing your citizens. It was never more than handful of people each time and they were quickly resolved with a private message. Guess VE wouldn't know about that since the only experience they have is running and disbanding. You could try to pull this line on most people in NPO. But I was responsible for the compliance checks and I know better than that. Yes, there were some of violations each week but it was never the same person. Members who ignored messages or continually were violation problems were expelled. I am sure ghosts were out of complaince but that wouldn't be held against us since our "keepers" had a list of who was a ghost. [/quote] Fact: You were never once in the communication channel in which NPO/Karma alliances discussed these things. Fact: Soldier/tank/plane limits were routinely exceeded, and was endemic. Fact: You put FAN in a 2 year war over the things we let slide. Fiction: "Guess VE wouldn't know about that since the only experience they have is running and disbanding." Fact: The alliances that disbanded us, GGA, NPO, GOONShoving. Of the three, one is still here, and that one ain't doing too well right now. Fact: Hard to run when we're on the front lines, sticking it to Order after Order, making it so you just don't walk right for months and years afterward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Horror Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 This is the best tactic in every war. The most clear-cut examples are GWII (where the initiative forced LUE into isolation), but it was also the original tactic pursued by the Unjust Path until TPF bravely peaced out for moral reasons(!). It was used in Karma and TOP-CnG, I assume by both sides. To have any chance of winning a major war, you have to try and make the other side's peripheral alliances surrender before yours do. This isn't a matter of deep opsec or speculation: anyone who doesn't use this tactic is a moron. No offence to anyone not using this tactic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pd73bassman Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 Wow, alliances using a tactic to gain a advantage in war, unheard of!! Tell me again why this topic was made Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilrow Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 (edited) [quote name='goldielax25' timestamp='1296670942' post='2616357'] Fact: You were never once in the communication channel in which NPO/Karma alliances discussed these things.[/quote] And what does that have to do with anything? It was still my primary responsibility, and just because I don't have the stomach to put up with the drivel that comes out of other people's mouths, it was a choice to not be in communication channels. [quote] Fact: Soldier/tank/plane limits were routinely exceeded, and was endemic.[/quote] Lies. [quote] Fact: You put FAN in a 2 year war over the things we let slide.[/quote] Misconstrue of the truth. Keep trying. [quote] Fiction: "Guess VE wouldn't know about that since the only experience they have is running and disbanding."[/quote] Yeah ok. That's why VE disbanded after only one night of war. [quote] Fact: The alliances that disbanded us, GGA, NPO, GOONShoving. Of the three, one is still here, and that one ain't doing too well right now.[/quote] FAN is doing just fine it seems and they participated. There were a few others that participated. But their no longer being around was not caused by anything VE did. LOL. [quote] Fact: Hard to run when we're on the front lines, sticking it to Order after Order, making it so you just don't walk right for months and years afterward. [/quote] Yawn. Yeah ok. Edited February 2, 2011 by Bilrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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