Joint VE/GOONS Announcement

[Gofastleft]

[quote name='Diomede' timestamp='1282607643' post='2428308']
Cheat on you
[/quote]

well in my mind the best friend is also a girl.

[Jeffro]

Didn't really expect this, but good luck to both of you.

Edit: Grammar.

Edited August 24, 2010 by LordJohnson

[AAAAAAAAAAGGGG]

GOONS owning - check
VE owning - check
Sweet treaty - check
Tears being harvested - check

Good work, everyone. You earned your 5 minute break.

[bartimaeus46]

Congrats to my allies in VE and GOONS

o/ VE
o/ GOONS

[Smooth]

[quote name='Rebel Virginia' timestamp='1282606278' post='2428273']
[color="#0000FF"]I fail to see the difference. And so does GOD if I recall correctly, considering they don't believe in new identities. But nice save, really. "At least we don't condone EZI." Boy, you guys really are an example for the rest of us.[/color]
[/quote]

Oh, I'm sorry. It sounded for a second like you were telling us that just because friends don't agree on all accounts, they cannot be friends. So silly of me. I could have sworn that wasn't accurate.

[quote name='Sal Paradise' timestamp='1282607090' post='2428291']
VE is not a moralist alliance. They are an opportunistic alliance and they always have been.
[/quote]

Pretty much.

Edited August 24, 2010 by Smooth

[Tarikmo]

This is a horrible announcement, it shouldn't of ever been posted. I support.

[Banksy]

VE needs even more treaties imho.

[Mandolus]

[quote name='Rebel Virginia' timestamp='1282606762' post='2428282']IC: Considering it is a practice endorsed by your eternal friend GOD and your newfound friend in GOONS, I feel it is quite relevant considering that by having treaties with these alliances you are by proxy endorsing a practice that you supposedly detest. It simply reeks of hypocrisy.[/color]
[/quote]

To be fair you have to REALLY ask for it to be an Enemy of GOONS. And I know of at least one EoG rogue who just keeps coming back over and over and over and has been doing so for the better part of a year now. He's a good newbie war exercise but if he wasn't kept on a short leash he could actually do some damage.

[Arcturus Jefferson]

[quote name='Prodigal Moon' timestamp='1282603357' post='2428184']
This has got to be a joke, right? I've watched VE try to promote itself as some sort of moral leader these past few years, and now you go and sign with GOONS?
[/quote]
I think we all knew how much that posturing was worth anyway - perhaps this is just VE's way of admitting it?

[Dylan Carter]

Good treaty, great flag.
o/GOONS
o/VE

[Aurion]

Oh no, VE is capable of getting along with and even liking people who aren't shining beacons of morality.

Whatever shall we do, this is truly a [i]momentous[/i] revelation.

...

Wait.

Grats to both. Optional or not, you both just picked up one of the best allies to have around these parts.

Edited August 24, 2010 by Aurion

[im317]

[quote name='Mandolus' timestamp='1282605602' post='2428254']
Quick everyone post your approval/disapproval of this treaty based on where your current alliance falls in the web
[/quote]

so as a former member of VE and a current member of an alliance with a MDoAP with them i should just hail this? sorry to disappoint you with what im about to post then.

this totally shocks me and i wonder what Egore thinks about it. however i think what this really shows is that this GOONS is not the old GOONS.

good luck with this guys, and VE i will be on your forum in a minute to hear how this came to be

GOONS and VE

Edited August 24, 2010 by im317

[D34th]

[quote name='im317' timestamp='1282610305' post='2428363']
this totally shocks me and i wonder what Egore thinks about it.
[/quote]

Egore should be really happy, after all VE is treating the alliance who was one of the main reason of their disbandment.

[AnCapistan]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1282610661' post='2428369']
Egore should be really happy, after all VE is treating the alliance who was one of the main reason of their disbandment.
[/quote]

Nope. I'm fairly certain that alliance is dead.

You should know, you helped kill it.

Edited August 24, 2010 by Mr Damsky

[Vesalius]

This treaty is a work of art. Makes me a little misty.

[Arcturus Jefferson]

[quote name='Mr Damsky' timestamp='1282611101' post='2428375']
Nope. I'm fairly certain that alliance is dead.
[/quote]
Well duh. The old VE disbanded.

[D34th]

[quote name='Mr Damsky' timestamp='1282611101' post='2428375']
Nope. I'm fairly certain that alliance is dead.
[/quote]

Yeah I know GOONS =/= GOONS if you like to think in this way, good for you, may be it make things less embarrassing.

[AnCapistan]

[quote name='Arcturus Jefferson' timestamp='1282611338' post='2428378']
Well duh. The old VE disbanded.
[/quote]

derp


[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1282611348' post='2428380']
Yeah I know GOONS =/= GOONS if you like to think in this way, good for you, may be it make things less embarrassing.
[/quote]

Hey man. Your alliance didn't mind signing a protectorate with them. And Polar wasn't exactly GOONS best friend.

Edited August 24, 2010 by Mr Damsky

[Xanaetos]

It's understandable that many people are surprised and confused by this treaty - it does appear to be quite an unlikely pairing.

What isn't understandable is that many people seem to support the idea that the Entente is in the wrong here, and that by signing a treaty with an alliance that doesn't share 110% of Viridia's own viewpoint on various CN-related topics of discussion (like Tech Raiding), Viridia itself is compromising its own morality. Where in the rules does it say we cannot have friends who have different opinions on certain aspects of CN? Where is it written that by signing a treaty with an alliance that's different than your own, you yourself forfeit your own morality; your own point-of-view? Where is it chiseled in stone that friends must be the exact mirror of each other when juxtaposed?

Viridia has found a friend in GOONS; a friend that many alliances in CN would be honored to have. And while we have our differences ... so what? We believe what we believe, and they believe what they believe. We don't argue over each other's beliefs, so I honestly cannot see why those who aren't even members of the Entente or the GOONS find the need to argue over our differences for us. The beliefs of the GOONS don't compromise the beliefs of Viridia, and vice versa. It's ridiculous to believe that they do, yet sadly, many people seem to have fallen to that special level of idiocy - a level from which they may never return.

[Il Impero Romano]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1282610661' post='2428369']
Egore should be really happy, after all VE is treating the alliance who was one of the main reason of their disbandment.
[/quote]

We talked with GOONS for about 4 months before even getting to the ODP level. You should know us better then to think we would sign anything with them if there was a semblance of meaningful and material similarity between their modern incarnation and that of the past. What this treaty should be a sign of is this GOONS is not the old GOONS, by any means aside from superficial graphics and mild raiding, and once you get underneath the stupid OWF threads and crying, they are a very reasonable bunch with a pragmatic outlook that is both respectable and rational.

Clinging to old stereotypes often has good reason, but having investigated it personally (and yes, when we first started talking with them my opinion was much the same as yours), I can say that in this case the characterization does not fit who they really are. Should they be more mindful of keeping their raiding under control sometimes in my personal opinion? Perhaps, though that alone should not forsake a friendship. Does that mean they deserve the reputation they have now or the reputation of the old GOONS? No. It does not.

In my opinion, not being able to accept or befriend those who operate differently from yourself is a pigeon hole, damning he who thinks that way into a circular routine of irrational hate. We are not that type of group, and that fact has zero bearing on the traditional Viridian values which we hold dear.

Edited August 24, 2010 by Il Impero Romano

[Rebel Virginia]

[quote name='Mr Damsky' timestamp='1282611101' post='2428375']
Nope. I'm fairly certain that alliance is dead.

You should know, you helped kill it.
[/quote]
[color="#0000FF"]You're right. That VE is dead, although I don't believe the NpO had anything to do with its demise. You can't blame them for all your failings you know.[/color]

[Malkavias]

This. Is. Awesome.

[Xavii]

Allies becoming better friends, I love it!

[DictatatorDan]

[color="#FF0000"]Smart move VE. I hope you get all of what you deserve out of this relationship, and more.[/color]

[D34th]

[quote name='Mr Damsky' timestamp='1282611440' post='2428382']
Hey man. Your alliance didn't mind signing a protectorate with them. And Polar wasn't exactly GOONS best friend.
[/quote]

I didn't knew that Polaris disbanded and GOONS was one of the main reasons that made it happen. In fact Polaris protected GOONS when they came back, this just show that we can be magnanimous with our defeated enemies, and I think you remember that when GOONS came back they said "We aren't like the old GOONS" and with this they fooled some people, may be Polaris included, but after 1 year or more of their rebirth, we all can see that if there is some difference between the old GOONS and the new GOONS are just in their name and in their leadership but their behavior are the same, may be less worse but the new GOONS haven't the same power and the same political capital of the old one so may this is the reason of their less worse behavior until now. But nice to see you tried the "See who is talking" argument, this doesn't make it VE decision look better.

[quote name='Il Impero Romano' timestamp='1282611653' post='2428388']
We talked with GOONS for about 4 months before even getting to the ODP level. You should know us better then to think we would sign anything with them if there was a semblance of meaningful and material similarity between their modern incarnation and that of the past. What this treaty should be a sign of is this GOONS is not the old GOONS, by any means aside from superficial graphics and mild raiding, and once you get underneath the stupid OWF threads and crying, they are a very reasonable bunch with a pragmatic outlook that is both respectable and rational.

Clinging to old stereotypes often has good reason, but having investigated it personally (and yes, when we first started talking with them my opinion was much the same as yours), I can say that in this case the characterization does not fit who they really are. Should they be more mindful of keeping their raiding under control sometimes in my personal opinion? Perhaps, though that alone should not forsake a friendship. Does that mean they deserve the reputation they have now or the reputation of the old GOONS? No. It does not.

In my opinion, not being able to accept or befriend those who operate differently from yourself is a pigeon hole, damning he who thinks that way into a circular routine of irrational hate. We are not that type of group, and that fact has zero bearing on the traditional Viridian values which we hold dear.
[/quote]

Can you enlighten me about the differences between old GOONS and the new one? I know their name aren't the same and the leadership is different, I could agree with you say that Sardonic is very reasonable with a pragmatic outlook that is both respectable and rational. But their practices are the same of the old GOONS, as I said before may be less worse, but of course they need to be more careful now since they haven't the same power NS wise or Political speaking.

Edited August 24, 2010 by D34th