kriekfreak Posted October 9, 2009 Report Share Posted October 9, 2009 Well they sent Haflinger to threaten war so i can only assume theyre really pissed No, no, you are mistaken WickedJ. Haflinger threatened Stickmen on a personal note. So that shouldn't be a problem and makes things all clear between Invicta and Stickmen, or not...? Well it seems that Invicta did try to rally their allies into attacking us but they all smarted out and refused to commit purplecide. So they needed a backdoor, which in this case was the above described scenario. Ofcourse you can anticipate that other purple alliances will reply to this post, and they will tell you there was no such things as Invicta rallying support. Well if they weren't rallying support why did one of Invicta's purple allies told me this? And I promise you, this purple haze doesn't have anything to do with this story. I swear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wickedj Posted October 9, 2009 Report Share Posted October 9, 2009 No, no, you are mistaken WickedJ. Haflinger threatened Stickmen on a personal note. So that shouldn't be a problem and makes things all clear between Invicta and Stickmen, or not...? Well it seems that Invicta did try to rally their allies into attacking us but they all smarted out and refused to commit purplecide. So they needed a backdoor, which in this case was the above described scenario. Ofcourse you can anticipate that other purple alliances will reply to this post, and they will tell you there was no such things as Invicta rallying support. Well if they weren't rallying support why did one of Invicta's purple allies told me this? And I promise you, this purple haze doesn't have anything to do with this story. I swear. Well you know how iFOK is a puppet of FOK and all that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KillerKoel Posted October 9, 2009 Report Share Posted October 9, 2009 Well you know how iFOK is a puppet of FOK and all that... Stickmen is obviously a Puppet of C&G. Everyone knows this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolph Posted October 9, 2009 Report Share Posted October 9, 2009 Stickmen is obviously a Puppet of C&G. Everyone knows this. No, you have it wrong. Stickmen is obviously a secret puppet of SF...Oh shi- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freelancer Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 I'm late to this party and after 28 pages the TLDR is that Avalon feels disrespected that the stickmen took the bull by the horns and decided to shake up the purple team ? Get over it !!! On a side note, I welcome any revolution that adds any new twist to the planet, no matter what color, given the possibilities that one of our allies could have the ability to sanction Altheus just makes me giggle.. occ Keep up the good work boys and get back to me when you pull this off, I have a few cash donations to your nations and a few sanction sugjestions when the time comes /occ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingoist Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 Stickmen is obviously a Puppet of C&G. Everyone knows this. C&G can pull my strings ANYday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altheus Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 On a side note, I welcome any revolution that adds any new twist to the planet, no matter what color, given the possibilities that one of our allies could have the ability to sanction Altheus just makes me giggle.. Awww, you care! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porksaber Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 Yes, that's the stunt I'm speaking of.Not the sending of SPAM to alliances that aren't interested as that's what the OP is regarding. I couldn't possibly be trying to stay on topic... Obviously people didn't know who to vote for. So if you think about it, we're doing our best to make the purple sphere a more democratic place to live and do business. You know, informing the masses and all. We get stuff done. Serious stuff. It would be pretty tough to argue this seeing as how we managed to get a senate seat. Just as a point of interest, I'd also like to take this opportunity to urge you to try to stay on topic. Now if you'll excuse me, I need to drive my armies through town and down these people who are putting up political signs and campaigning for all kinds of offices. I can't believe it myself. They all feature the names of candidates and everything. This is relevant to my interests as it identifies an alternative to those candidates I support! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stetson76 Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 Obviously people didn't know who to vote for. So if you think about it, we're doing our best to make the purple sphere a more democratic place to live and do business. You know, informing the masses and all. We get stuff done. Serious stuff. It would be pretty tough to argue this seeing as how we managed to get a senate seat. Just as a point of interest, I'd also like to take this opportunity to urge you to try to stay on topic. Now if you'll excuse me, I need to drive my armies through town and down these people who are putting up political signs and campaigning for all kinds of offices. I can't believe it myself. They all feature the names of candidates and everything. This is relevant to my interests as it identifies an alternative to those candidates I support! I don't recall anyone saying that Purple Unity owns those seats. No one has said that you can't campaign for them. The topic as you should recall is Stickmen sending SPAM messages to alliances that don't want it sent to them. Specifically Avalon. No where have you agreed to honor their request not to be SPAM'd. Instead, you've chosen to derail the topic by attempting to call out Purple Unity (which Avalon is not even part of) for trying to keep the poor Stickmen down. If you guys will agree to not SPAM alliances that don't want to be, this whole issue will be over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jorost Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 (edited) Let me clarify a few things: Invicta has never been an alliance that could be described as belligerent. That said, I will admit that, yes, I was extremely angry over the recent developments with the Stickmen. It's not just the senate thing. Hell, the united purple alliances have four or five times Stickmen's numbers. If we can't GOTV to win all three senate seats that's our problem. What bothers me about the Stickmen is what I consider an undisguised attempt to disrupt the sphere. This was evident from the very beginning in the leaked logs about the (then-planned) move to purple. In my opinion, when you move to a place, it is inherent upon you to adapt to the cultural norms of your new home. I would not move to the Netherlands, for example, without learning to speak Dutch and educating myself on the customs, social mores, and history of the country. But Stickmen didn't do that in Purple. Instead, what they did was tantamount to an American moving to Amsterdam and then expecting everyone speak English while bombing around the neighborhood in his pickup truck and demanding that the local cafe carry Coors Light. What we have been striving for is Purple unity. Unity. All for one and one for all, as the Musketeers put it. We set up institutions to foster and protect that unity. We try to balance the interests of the sphere against our individual alliance interests when we can. But Stickmen don't seem interested in that. From the very beginning, in those leaked logs I mentioned, it was clear that they intended to do as they pleased, without regard for anyone but themselves. So why did Stickmen come to Purple? It certainly wasn't for trades. They seem to trade mostly amongst themselves. And it certainly wasn't for the company, since it's evident that they have nothing but contempt for us. The only answer I can think of is that they just wanted to cause trouble, whether for their own amusement or at the behest of their sponsors. (The above three paragraphs will look very familiar to anyone following this thread on the iFOK or FOK forums. What can I say? I believe in recycling. ) So, back to the idea of war. A lot of people in purple believe that this entire situation was "trap" intended to goad us into attacking. An excuse to start Karma War II, and possibly even to leave NPO without any allies when they get out of terms. Machiavellian? Maybe. But stranger machinations have played out in the World of Bob. I have no intention of allowing that to happen. I know that any aggression against iFOK or Stickmen would be met with a response from their allies, notably FOK, against whom my little alliance stands no chance. I am not about to allow my members' nations, and those of our allies, to be destroyed on a fool's errand. Have I spoken words in anger? Yes I have. And if I have been intemperate, then I apologize. But put yourselves in my position for a moment. To paraphrase Kermit the Frog, it's not easy being purple. For reasons that I have never fully grasped, we are viewed with utter, undisguised contempt. Alliances that I have never even spoken to hate us with a passion that is usually reserved for child murderers and Michael Vick. Don't misunderstand me -- I'm not trying to play the victim card here. But in that environment it's not hard to see enemies around every corner. I would also suggest that there has been anger and ill-chosen words on both sides here. I apologize for my part. Edited October 10, 2009 by Jorost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thom98 Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 (edited) I agree with Jorost Edited October 10, 2009 by Thom98 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmansfield68 Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 *reason for edit* forgot to include the necessary blessings before the signature and added a tl;dr by request. tl;drs are ONLY for morons who cannot comprehend the English Language. Otherwise, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Reccesion Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 Jorost could not have put it in any better form. I for one loved the read, and best of luck to Invicta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spearo Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 Instead, you've chosen to derail the topic by attempting to call out Purple Unity (which Avalon is not even part of) for trying to keep the poor Stickmen down. I believe it was infact purple unity derailing the thread to talk about purple unity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stetson76 Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 Believe what you want. The fact is that from the very begining the Stickmen have been claiming that the OP is about stopping them from running a canidate for the purple senate. No one in this entire thread has suggested that. Since Avalon doesn't particpate in the purple sphere senate elections, you couldn't have been responding to them could you? They said nothing about you not running a candidate. Therefore you must be talking to the Purple Unity alliances. Which is where the derailment began. Had you said, something along the lines of "Avalon, we respect your right to neutrality in the senate elections, we'll actually put some effort into determining who to spam next time" this would have been a 10 post thread. Instead, you've come up with things like your cute avatar which makes this point very clearly: the Purple Unity alliances are keeping the poor Stickmen down by...oh right, by not being involved in a non-member politely ask you to stop spamming them on a subject they don't have any stake in. We haven't said "don't run a senator on purple or else," or even "don't spam our alliances." My, whatever could we be thinking voicing our support for a fellow purple alliance who has shown us respect and therefore that we respect in turn? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KillerKoel Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 Believe what you want.The fact is that from the very begining the Stickmen have been claiming that the OP is about stopping them from running a canidate for the purple senate. No one in this entire thread has suggested that. Since Avalon doesn't particpate in the purple sphere senate elections, you couldn't have been responding to them could you? They said nothing about you not running a candidate. Therefore you must be talking to the Purple Unity alliances. Which is where the derailment began. Had you said, something along the lines of "Avalon, we respect your right to neutrality in the senate elections, we'll actually put some effort into determining who to spam next time" this would have been a 10 post thread. Instead, you've come up with things like your cute avatar which makes this point very clearly: the Purple Unity alliances are keeping the poor Stickmen down by...oh right, by not being involved in a non-member politely ask you to stop spamming them on a subject they don't have any stake in. We haven't said "don't run a senator on purple or else," or even "don't spam our alliances." My, whatever could we be thinking voicing our support for a fellow purple alliance who has shown us respect and therefore that we respect in turn? Pure Genius lawl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kriekfreak Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 Actually Stenson, I don't agree with you. If Avalon truly wished to prevent us from 'spamming' them next time, they would use the appropriate back channels instead of trying to call us out on the OWF (which has the opposite effect on me). I believe strongly that there was another factor that pushed them to the OWF, but that is a thing that I will not clarify on any further. The point of Avalon is that we should never have messaged their nations because they are a neutral alliance when it concerns the senate race and some of their members 'could' be tricked into voting for us, thus making them not-neutral. Our point is that we never forced their nations to do so. These messages weren't send to Avalon only but to the whole of purple. All they needed to do is delete the message and be done with it. It's not like we are spamming them with messages all day, every day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SyndicatedINC Posted October 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 Actually Stenson, I don't agree with you. If Avalon truly wished to prevent us from 'spamming' them next time, they would use the appropriate back channels instead of trying to call us out on the OWF (which has the opposite effect on me). I believe strongly that there was another factor that pushed them to the OWF, but that is a thing that I will not clarify on any further. If you want to imply that this 'other factor' was someone in PEACE, go ahead. It would however make you incorrect. Actually I imagine that they would have told us not to if we asked them a choice. Why would we seek to contact you through back channels, when no one from Stickmen sought private channels before spamming? As spamming all of a sphere is rather public so was our complaint. The point of Avalon is that we should never have messaged their nations because they are a neutral alliance when it concerns the senate race and some of their members 'could' be tricked into voting for us, thus making them not-neutral. Our point is that we never forced their nations to do so. These messages weren't send to Avalon only but to the whole of purple. All they needed to do is delete the message and be done with it. It's not like we are spamming them with messages all day, every day. The point of Avalon is that mass messaging another alliance's members in an attempt to undermine the standing policies of that alliance, is and has been considered uncouth at best. The fact that none of Avalon fell for your ploy is irrelevant, the issue remains that the spam was attempting to encourage behavior contrary to our Senate policy, and in a word we find it rather rude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haflinger Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 I believe it was infact purple unity derailing the thread to talk about purple unity. Actually, it was neither us nor Stickmen. First mention of the Purple Unity senate rotation. Actually Stenson, I don't agree with you. If Avalon truly wished to prevent us from 'spamming' them next time, they would use the appropriate back channels instead of trying to call us out on the OWF (which has the opposite effect on me). I believe strongly that there was another factor that pushed them to the OWF, but that is a thing that I will not clarify on any further. Your paranoia is showing. Avalon is about as independent-minded an alliance as you'll find anywhere. Heck, they don't sign MDPs by policy because they feel such treaties limit their independence too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kriekfreak Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 The point of Avalon is that mass messaging another alliance's members in an attempt to undermine the standing policies of that alliance, is and has been considered uncouth at best. The fact that none of Avalon fell for your ploy is irrelevant, the issue remains that the spam was attempting to encourage behavior contrary to our Senate policy, and in a word we find it rather rude. You would've had a point if we only sent it to you, which we didn't. We never attempted to undermine the policies of Avalon, we gave all of purple information that there are also other people that they can vote for. That you took it as an attempt to undermine your policies says enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Z Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 Personally speaking, I think far more could have been accomplished in the backchannels than showing this to the world. While it is your right to do this affair on a public stage, I wouldn't blame Stickmen if they thought that there were ulterior motives regarding your agenda. Like it or not, it is curious that one would immediately forgo private communications, which usually has a far higher success rate in resolution for matters such as these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petrovich4 Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 What bothers me about the Stickmen is what I consider an undisguised attempt to disrupt the sphere. Duh. No offense, but you have to be blind if you didn't/don't see this. They want friction and some fun without taking their clothes off (lovingly glares at NCC and porky). They have and will continue to start a fun cold war on Purple. If you don't like it, and want to crush them when they're still small, then attack soon. If not, then bide your time and make them make the first fatal mistake where you can capitalise on them diplomatically. Right now, Purple's responses and reflexes to Stickmen are laughable only because you don't take them seriously. If you have tried to engage them and they have not positively responded, then !@#$e son, that means they want to cause some minor drama. Use your strengths against their weaknesses. To many non Purple outsiders, purple nations/alliances are like a fish out of water. Bad, baaaad, baaaaaaad Stickmen!! Adapt and Learn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o ya baby Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 So, I know what I'm doing next senate round. Hey, Stickmen, send me a list of purple nations to send messages to. I'm going to be persuading purple voters to pick your candidate. No, I'm not kidding. Seriously. Send me a friggin' list next time you need to get voted in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SyndicatedINC Posted October 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 (edited) You would've had a point if we only sent it to you, which we didn't. We never attempted to undermine the policies of Avalon, we gave all of purple information that there are also other people that they can vote for. That you took it as an attempt to undermine your policies says enough. Wait so your defense is that instead of just disrespecting one alliance by ignoring proper etiquette and protocol, you disrespected every Purple alliance? Compounding your faux pas by committing multiple violations does not make any single instance less valid. I honestly do not understand why or how you came to believe that such actions were considered acceptable behavior. Whatever led to that belief, hopefully the Stickmen now understand that at least amongst their Purple neighbors, it is not appreciated. Thus we can all together move on to a better understanding of a more polite sphere. Also congratulations on your first Purple Senate seat. Edited October 10, 2009 by SyndicatedINC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thrash Posted October 10, 2009 Report Share Posted October 10, 2009 I would not move to the Netherlands, for example, without learning to speak Dutch and educating myself on the customs, social mores, and history of the country. Remind me to talk to you about this later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts