Ardus Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 DH & Co's unceasing condescension is what brought them to their current predicament. mom dh said mean things about me moooommmmm... The unceasing ineptitude of this scrapyard armada you've cobbled together is what brought you to... well the last five or so years, really. And it's going to bring you to ruin again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiggah Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 I believe this is the first time ODN has faced such odds in 5+ years? no wonder the bawwing. Its okay, see all the major CN alliances around you? They've all faced similar odds atleast twice or more before in the same time period, they're all around. I know its a challenge to consider more than one post at a time, but check context. The "bawwing" was from a GOONS member complaining about empty war slots and when his point went over the head of Starfox, I tried to explain. This is an unprecedented dogpile. It's not bawwing to acknowledge that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruler with Plan X Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Being the studnet of history that you are, you will also note that Ragnarok, Sparta, and FARK were all in Contiuum prior to the Karma war, right? Even Gramlins was there, though they had left months earlier, not on the even of war as Rok, Sparta, and FARK. You took a very strange history course. Fark and RoK were never in Q. Fark got an offer, but after we discussed it with SF NPO got mad at us for not keeping it secret. We did have an MDoAP with NPO, but that was there for purely political reasons by Jan '09. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Wally Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 You took a very strange history course. Fark and RoK were never in Q. Fark got an offer, but after we discussed it with SF NPO got mad at us for not keeping it secret. We did have an MDoAP with NPO, but that was there for purely political reasons by Jan '09. Yep correct Plan X. RoK did have a treaty with NPO at one stage too but it was cancelled before Karma got in motion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 (edited) Ahhh so you went in based on need? Well it all makes sense. Yes. Our coalition both needs and desires the victory that is required. Other desires are subordinate to that need. Just like every winning coalition in CN history. Keep trying to convince us we should deliberately hamstring ourselves so that your side, with a long history of fscking both friends and enemies, can regain the top spot and impose arbitrary demands as they sit fit on all 'lesser' alliances. Your own emphatically included. Take an honest approach to the question and I will listen. Spout typical partisan nonsense and I will not. I know its a challenge to consider more than one post at a time, but check context. The "bawwing" was from a GOONS member complaining about empty war slots and when his point went over the head of Starfox, I tried to explain. This is an unprecedented dogpile. It's not bawwing to acknowledge that. It's bawing just to say such a thing, because it isn't in any way sense or possible interpretation anywhere near unprecedented. Far more overwhelming 'dogpiles' have been routine in Cn and I dont recall you ever objecting until now. Edited January 30, 2013 by Sigrun Vapneir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 (edited) Double post please erase. Edited January 30, 2013 by Sigrun Vapneir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pingu Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Keep trying to convince us we should deliberately hamstring ourselves so that your side, with a long history of fscking both friends and enemies, can regain the top spot and impose arbitrary demands as they sit fit on all 'lesser' alliances. Your own emphatically included. Take an honest approach to the question and I will listen. Spout typical partisan nonsense and I will not. I assumed, given the company you keep, that your plan was to recreate the brutal hegemony of old that did just as you say. If it's not, you need to re-think. The present benign order which we defend is far more tolerant and tolerable than the likely outcome should your motley conglomeration allow itself to be manipulated into delivering the world once more to the imperialists of old. Happily, we do not require you to 'hamstring' yourself any further. Your cause is manifestly unjust, your organization laughable, your fate gloomy whatever the outcome of the present fisticuffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 (edited) I assumed, given the company you keep, that your plan was to recreate the brutal hegemony of old that did just as you say. If it's not, you need to re-think. The present benign order which we defend is far more tolerant and tolerable than the likely outcome should your motley conglomeration allow itself to be manipulated into delivering the world once more to the imperialists of old. Happily, we do not require you to 'hamstring' yourself any further. Your cause is manifestly unjust, your organization laughable, your fate gloomy whatever the outcome of the present fisticuffs. WTF Pingu are you totally senile? I said nothing even vaguely resembling that. Quit putting words in my mouth or we will have a problem. The present 'order' you defend is no order at all, simply tyranny of the best connected. Our cause is manifestly just, our organisation is good though it could be better, it's making our opposition look bad at least, and my fate could not be better or more certain. I shall fight for the right and honourable cause, and shy away from the opposite, as long as my last citizens draw breath. I have been here a good long time and I expect to turn off the lights once y'all are done. If you intend to force another fate on me you better have both power and stamina. I know its a challenge to consider more than one post at a time, but check context. The "bawwing" was from a GOONS member complaining about empty war slots and when his point went over the head of Starfox, I tried to explain. This is an unprecedented dogpile. It's not bawwing to acknowledge that. It's absolutely bawwing because it is flat out not true. Every war DH has been in so far has been a dogpile for their side. This is, by comparison, quite an even engagement. Quit lying, please. Edited January 30, 2013 by Sigrun Vapneir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 (edited) Again I apologize for double post. Edited January 30, 2013 by Sigrun Vapneir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pingu Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 WTF Pingu are you totally senile? I said nothing even vaguely resembling that. Quit putting words in my mouth or we will have a problem. The present 'order' you defend is no order at all, simply tyranny of the best connected. Our cause is manifestly just, our organisation is good though it could be better, it's making our opposition look bad at least, and my fate could not be better or more certain. I shall fight for the right and honourable cause, and shy away from the opposite, as long as my last citizens draw breath. I have been here a good long time and I expect to turn off the lights once y'all are done. If you intend to force another fate on me you better have both power and stamina. If you win, you will more than likely usher in a new age of tyranny. Not by intent, probably - I don't know you to be a fascist - but by enabling those who enjoy that sort of thing. If you've been here a 'good long time' you may remember what your chums did last time they were given free rein. If you lose, we will most likely point and laugh. I meant nothing more sinister than that when referring to your fate - you will be either an enabler of tyranny or someone who failed, despite very strong odds. Simply trying to open your eyes to what your 'side' is likely to create, given the opportunity. We will not easily give them such an opportunity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 If you win, you will more than likely usher in a new age of tyranny. Not by intent, probably - I don't know you to be a fascist - but by enabling those who enjoy that sort of thing. If you've been here a 'good long time' you may remember what your chums did last time they were given free rein. If you lose, we will most likely point and laugh. I meant nothing more sinister than that when referring to your fate - you will be either an enabler of tyranny or someone who failed, despite very strong odds. Simply trying to open your eyes to what your 'side' is likely to create, given the opportunity. We will not easily give them such an opportunity. Nation Created: 1/4/2007 11:28:02 AM (2,217 days old) This was my second nation. Believe me I remember. I am still pissed that Pacifica was not exterminated. I woul have done it if I could... and yes Pacificans know this. I fought for Karma as long as my alliance .gov would allow, and a bit longer. If we lose, you will have to fight us to the bitter end. Extermination is your only option - and the one your masters will call for first last and always. I am no enabler of tyranny. You jump many logical leaps, you assume the winners will become tyrannical eventually. Yes, they probably will. Eventually. I will fight them to the last death if they do, eventually. But let's deal with here and now instead of 'eventually' shall we? The only tyrants on the board are your own masters. Others, *might* become tyrants, eventually, IF we win. Until then, why not join the side of the angels, eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sardonic Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Spare the dramatics, the time when such wars of extermination were waged ended a long time ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pingu Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Your Excellency, Sigrun Vapneir: I make a logical projection, not an assumption. If your side wins, tyranny will follow. Your shambling horde is not composed of angels, and my side contains neither masters nor servants. Nor exterminators. It appears you and I will have difficulty communicating, given our very different understanding of the realities of global politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Your Excellency, Sigrun Vapneir: I make a logical projection, not an assumption. If your side wins, tyranny will follow. Your shambling horde is not composed of angels, and my side contains neither masters nor servants. Nor exterminators. It appears you and I will have difficulty communicating, given our very different understanding of the realities of global politics. Indeed. No offense, but your day appears to have been some time back, and the modern terms appear to escape you. My 'shambling horde' is not composed of angels, no. But in comparison? They might as well be. My primary concern right now is the ridiculously lenient terms they intend to demand. I gotta admit, being around as long as I have, being as utterly cynical as I am... remembering what your current allies have done... I am ok with that. Really. We will ALL be better off if my side wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkerNinja Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Both Sigrun and Pingu appear to be in fine form. How Sigrun can at once regret the failure to exterminate NPO, and simultaneously work to restore them to power in a war that they orchestrated is beyond my comprehension. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pingu Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Indeed. No offense, but your day appears to have been some time back, and the modern terms appear to escape you. My 'shambling horde' is not composed of angels, no. But in comparison? They might as well be. My primary concern right now is the ridiculously lenient terms they intend to demand. I gotta admit, being around as long as I have, being as utterly cynical as I am... remembering what your current allies have done... I am ok with that. Really. We will ALL be better off if my side wins. The meaning of some words may have changed since 'my day' which, by your previous testimony, is not much older than yours: but the realities of power, ego, fear and opportunism are the same as they ever were. Your alliance of convenience, whipped into a frenzy of fear by experienced propagandists, will last no longer than it takes to put new tyrants atop the international order. You, yourself, admit above that this is the likely outcome, but prefer to focus only on the short term. To know that this is what you are about, yet claim comparative angelic status, is arrogance beyond anything of which you can accuse the victims of your current aggression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 (edited) Both Sigrun and Pingu appear to be in fine form. How Sigrun can at once regret the failure to exterminate NPO, and simultaneously work to restore them to power in a war that they orchestrated is beyond my comprehension. Then allow me to explain. It would have been better, in my estimation, to turn the NPO AA into a wasteland to devastate any that wore it, to make a charred smoldering crater of everything they had built, as was done with /b/, as a warning to those who would do the same. But I got overruled and that moment is long gone now. Of course the TOP AA should have been dealt with no differently. Properly dealt with, this could have been a good opportunity for TOP to dismember some of their most disreputable leaders and reform as something a paradoxian might view without feeling utter revulsion and nausea. Of course in reality it was only an opportunity to tell more lies and entrench current leadership more deeply in the positions which they use to drag the name of Johann through the deepest sections of Mud. Well, ok. We still live. We still breath. We shall not be breathing to see when you turn this world over to your new masters. Either that will not happen, or you will exterminate us first. To the last breath we shall draw freedom and order, to our last breath we shall resist the alternatives. Edited January 30, 2013 by Sigrun Vapneir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkerNinja Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Then allow me to explain. It would have been better, in my estimation, to turn the NPO AA into a wasteland to devastate any that wore it, to make a charred smoldering crater of everything they had built, as was done with /b/, as a warning to those who would do the same. But I got overruled and that moment is long gone now. Of course the TOP AA should have been dealt with no differently. Properly dealt with, this could have been a good opportunity for TOP to dismember some of their most disreputable leaders and reform as something a paradoxian might view without feeling utter revulsion and nausea. Of course in reality it was only an opportunity to tell more lies and entrench current leadership more deeply in the positions which they use to drag the name of Johann through the deepest sections of Mud. Well, ok. We still live. We still breath. We shall not be breathing to see when you turn this world over to your new masters. Either that will not happen, or you will exterminate us first. To the last breath we shall draw freedom and order, to our last breath we shall resist the alternatives. You'll be happy to know that the chemical sheds are ready for you... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 You'll be happy to know that the chemical sheds are ready for you... Bring em on then. I've been ready for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sardonic Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Then allow me to explain. It would have been better, in my estimation, to turn the NPO AA into a wasteland to devastate any that wore it, to make a charred smoldering crater of everything they had built, as was done with /b/, as a warning to those who would do the same. But I got overruled and that moment is long gone now. Of course the TOP AA should have been dealt with no differently. Properly dealt with, this could have been a good opportunity for TOP to dismember some of their most disreputable leaders and reform as something a paradoxian might view without feeling utter revulsion and nausea. Of course in reality it was only an opportunity to tell more lies and entrench current leadership more deeply in the positions which they use to drag the name of Johann through the deepest sections of Mud. Well, ok. We still live. We still breath. We shall not be breathing to see when you turn this world over to your new masters. Either that will not happen, or you will exterminate us first. To the last breath we shall draw freedom and order, to our last breath we shall resist the alternatives. Has anyone ever told you you're kinda nuts? Because you're kinda nuts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Has anyone ever told you you're kinda nuts? Because you're kinda nuts. Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. And yes, I am completely aware I am 'kinda nuts' in your estimation my dear Sardonic. You should hear the things your courtiers say when you are out of earshit though! Fact is, well-behaved women dont make history. I have made history and I expect to do so again. You are on the wrong side of history today. Again, I promise to look after you once you surrender. Fight as long as you feel you must but dont hold false hope of victory - dont hurt yourselves more than necessary. Come to mama, it'll be alright. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmansfield68 Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 If you win, you will more than likely usher in a new age of tyranny. Not by intent, probably - I don't know you to be a fascist - but by enabling those who enjoy that sort of thing. If you've been here a 'good long time' you may remember what your chums did last time they were given free rein. If you lose, we will most likely point and laugh. I meant nothing more sinister than that when referring to your fate - you will be either an enabler of tyranny or someone who failed, despite very strong odds. Simply trying to open your eyes to what your 'side' is likely to create, given the opportunity. We will not easily give them such an opportunity. Pingu, you forgot to quote the author at the end of that rant. You owe Barack Obama a huge tax donation, and a huge hug. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pingu Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Pingu, you forgot to quote the author at the end of that rant. You owe Barack Obama a huge tax donation, and a huge hug. Is this an example of 'modern terms' to which Sigrun was referring? If I understand you correctly, "polite, reasoned argument" is now called "rant". And what is a "Barack Obama"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 (edited) Nation Created: 1/4/2007 11:28:02 AM (2,217 days old) This was my second nation. Believe me I remember. I am still pissed that Pacifica was not exterminated. I woul have done it if I could... and yes Pacificans know this. I fought for Karma as long as my alliance .gov would allow, and a bit longer. If we lose, you will have to fight us to the bitter end. Extermination is your only option - and the one your masters will call for first last and always. I am no enabler of tyranny. You jump many logical leaps, you assume the winners will become tyrannical eventually. Yes, they probably will. Eventually. I will fight them to the last breath, though, so they will have to wait a good long time for that problem to ever hit me. But let's deal with here and now instead of 'eventually' shall we? The only tyrants on the board are your own masters. Others, *might* become tyrants, eventually, IF we win. Until then, why not join the side of the angels, eh? Edited January 30, 2013 by Sigrun Vapneir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigrun Vapneir Posted January 30, 2013 Report Share Posted January 30, 2013 Is this an example of 'modern terms' to which Sigrun was referring? If I understand you correctly, "polite, reasoned argument" is now called "rant". And what is a "Barack Obama"? Barracks O'bomber, quite an opportunity to get on board etc. Not my favourite guy and entirely without PPV. His problem, let it go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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