Announcement from Non Grata

[Captain Flinders]

A tongue in cheek joke leads to a raid of a semi protected, largely unknown, AA and reps have already been offered?

This drama is terribly stale. I'll pass thank you.

[Logan]

Well I hope after this stunt you all stop acting like you have suffered some great offense done by us.

[SpoiL]

[quote name='Bob Ilyani' timestamp='1311398061' post='2761913']
Ugh, not another tech raid thread.

Plain and simple[s], the fact that NG told Tetris they were posting the announcement puts a lot of the blame onto Tetris's shoulders... They were given the opportunity to say "let's make a joint announcement" or "wait, let us get our own announcement ready", but they didn't. Regardless of whether or not raiding the alliance afterwards was a bad move (I don't give a $%&@ tbh) the fact that NG did notify Tetris and told them they were making the announcement nullifies many of the arguments made in this thread.[/s]
[/quote]

Plain and simple, dick move.

[Heft]

Well that sure was a pointlessly !@#$%* move, NG. Well done?

[xplicit313]

My favorite part of all of this was when NG got butthurt. Good show gents, lots of great PR coming your way =) Glad I could get TAA good protectorates in the end.

o/ Tetris
o/ TAA

[Greg23]

TAA sounds too much like IAA for me to like them so that makes me not care...

And lets be honest here, who really cares about a small raid. This games too stale, everyone start killing each other.

NG start up more drama, just not against IAA >_>

And honestly if you guys are all so mad about NG, start up a karma type war against them and do something, otherwise stop complaining on the owf.

[xplicit313]

[quote name='Greg23' timestamp='1311453495' post='2762264']
TAA sounds too much like IAA for me to like them so that makes me not care...

And lets be honest here, who really cares about a small raid. This games too stale, everyone start killing each other.

NG start up more drama, just not against IAA >_>

And honestly if you guys are all so mad about NG, start up a karma type war against them and do something, otherwise stop complaining on the owf.
[/quote]


I may be wrong here, but it kind of sounds like you were just complaining on the owf. Nah that couldn't be...

[HeroofTime55]

[quote name='Franz Ferdinand' timestamp='1311439962' post='2762138']
For your first question, when SLCB and TAA signed their protectorate treaty, there was no cancellation period, thus The Armada Alliance were fair game during that period, until Tetris posted the treaty they signed with TAA. During that period of no protection, The Armada Alliance would be classed like other alliances without treaties or protection. [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=101980"]Check here for the SLCB treaty.[/url]

For your second question, it was me who informed Non Grata, mine and TAA's protector about what I had learnt that day from TAA's government about their plans for the future and what they thought of their new protector. I passed this information on to the relevant people at Non Grata, who acted upon it by calling a meeting with TAA. TAA was hesitant during the talks and were deliberately trying to buy time. They never truly responded to Non Grata's questions about their future, thus Non Grata's actions to help clear up the situation.
[/quote]
Wow, way to throw them under the bus. Remind me to never tell you anything in confidence.

I'm really disappointed in you here, Franz.

[Franz Ferdinand]

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1311466733' post='2762415']
Wow, way to throw them under the bus. Remind me to never tell you anything in confidence.

I'm really disappointed in you here, Franz.
[/quote]
HoT, Non Grata had a right to know where they stood in regards to their protecting of TAA at the time due to the transition of protectors.

[HeroofTime55]

[quote name='Franz Ferdinand' timestamp='1311467104' post='2762421']
HoT, Non Grata had a right to know where they stood in regards to their protecting of TAA at the time due to the transition of protectors.
[/quote]
TAA had a right to take their time and make the proper decision. They told you, as a fellow protectorate, in confidence, what they were mulling over. You then threw them under the bus by forcing the issue. I guess to suck up to NG or something. A rather pathetic move, but if you really want to be such a leech in the shadow of NG, it can't be helped.

You sacrificed all trust anyone might have in you or your alliance. For what gain? Nothing. Nothing at all. Considering the speed with which NG has shown it is willing to throw it's "protectorates" in the trash.

[greenacres]

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1311467711' post='2762428']
TAA had a right to take their time and make the proper decision. They told you, as a fellow protectorate, in confidence, what they were mulling over. You then threw them under the bus by forcing the issue. I guess to suck up to NG or something. A rather pathetic move, but if you really want to be such a leech in the shadow of NG, it can't be helped.

You sacrificed all trust anyone might have in you or your alliance. For what gain? Nothing. Nothing at all. Considering the speed with which NG has shown it is willing to throw it's "protectorates" in the trash.
[/quote]

Really? All trust? It's a wonder why anyone even listens to you anymore using your own logic. Come on now, quit it with the !@#$@#$ sweeping generalizations.

[HeroofTime55]

[quote name='greenacres' timestamp='1311467975' post='2762433']
Really? All trust? It's a wonder why anyone even listens to you anymore using your own logic. Come on now, quit it with the !@#$@#$ sweeping generalizations.
[/quote]
Why hello there, greenacres. It's been awhile.

For the record, nobody has ever listened to me.

[Hyperion321]

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1311468618' post='2762442']
Why hello there, greenacres. It's been awhile.

For the record, nobody has ever listened to me.
[/quote]
and yet you keep talking.

[Greg23]

[quote name='xplicit313' timestamp='1311454441' post='2762272']
I may be wrong here, but it kind of sounds like you were just complaining on the owf. Nah that couldn't be...
[/quote]
Ill give you that one there. I dont complain about people doing things, just not doing anything. After my 5 long years of bob I've never seen the place so annoying. It almost makes me wish NPO was back to crushing GATO for the hell of it, almost.

[King Xander the Only]

[quote name='Greg23' timestamp='1311474527' post='2762493']
Ill give you that one there. I dont complain about people doing things, just not doing anything. After my 5 long years of bob I've never seen the place so annoying. It almost makes me wish NPO was back to crushing GATO for the hell of it, almost.
[/quote]
That could probably be arranged.

[MaGneT]

[quote name='Franz Ferdinand' timestamp='1311467104' post='2762421']
HoT, Non Grata had a right to know where they stood in regards to their protecting of TAA at the time due to the transition of protectors.
[/quote]
As an alliance that was going through a merge, they should know how difficult it can be to facilitate every little detail. Sometimes finding a treaty partner isn't instant. If one of DT's protectorates wanted a new protector, I can assure you that we'd watch over them until they found that new protector. If they were being vague, we'd be patient with them. That's the point of a protectorate. You hold their hand. There's really no defending what was done here. Now, I don't think anyone hates NG over this. I surely don't. I'm pretty stunned by their lack of regard for the well being of someone they were supposed to protect, but the fact is, there wasn't much damage done. The issue that people like me are taking is the utter lack of goodwill and the seeming malice towards TAA from some.

Some in NG have said that it wasn't done properly. That's respectable. In a situation like this, however, one or two opinions don't necessarily represent the government of an alliance. Personally, I'd like to see NG's government step up, take responsibility for an ill-judged action and try to make things right with TAA. I'd be in the front row applauding them the whole way if they chose that route.

[Sir Humphrey]

[quote name='Franz Ferdinand' timestamp='1311439962' post='2762138']
For your first question, when SLCB and TAA signed their protectorate treaty, there was no cancellation period, thus The Armada Alliance were fair game during that period, until Tetris posted the treaty they signed with TAA. During that period of no protection, The Armada Alliance would be classed like other alliances without treaties or protection. [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=101980"]I passed this information on to the relevant people at Non Grata, who acted upon it by calling a meeting with TAA. TAA was hesitant during the talks and were deliberately trying to buy time. They never truly responded to Non Grata's questions about their future, thus Non Grata's actions to help clear up the situation.
[/quote]
NG's subsequent actions simply suggest that any hesitancy by TAA to be completely forthcoming was entirely justified. If anything, NG's actions confirm the disincentive for protectorates to communicate with NG regarding FA concerns, which seems to be the opposite of what you think TAA should have done.

[FeaR_LeSs]

[quote name='MaGneT' timestamp='1311476676' post='2762514']
As an alliance that was going through a merge, they should know how difficult it can be to facilitate every little detail. Sometimes finding a treaty partner isn't instant. If one of DT's protectorates wanted a new protector, I can assure you that we'd watch over them until they found that new protector. If they were being vague, we'd be patient with them. That's the point of a protectorate. You hold their hand. There's really no defending what was done here. Now, I don't think anyone hates NG over this. I surely don't. I'm pretty stunned by their lack of regard for the well being of someone they were supposed to protect, but the fact is, there wasn't much damage done. The issue that people like me are taking is the utter lack of goodwill and the seeming malice towards TAA from some.

Some in NG have said that it wasn't done properly. That's respectable. In a situation like this, however, one or two opinions don't necessarily represent the government of an alliance. Personally, I'd like to see NG's government step up, take responsibility for an ill-judged action and try to make things right with TAA. I'd be in the front row applauding them the whole way if they chose that route.
[/quote]

Magnet we offered reps for the damage and said we were sorry. There is nothing more we can do. We will not make a whole new thread about this as we want this to end. Everyone makes mistakes and everyone learns from them.

[Jacapo Saladin]

[quote name='MaGneT' timestamp='1311476676' post='2762514']
As an alliance that was going through a merge, they should know how difficult it can be to facilitate every little detail. Sometimes finding a treaty partner isn't instant. If one of DT's protectorates wanted a new protector, I can assure you that we'd watch over them until they found that new protector. If they were being vague, we'd be patient with them. That's the point of a protectorate. You hold their hand. There's really no defending what was done here. Now, I don't think anyone hates NG over this. I surely don't. I'm pretty stunned by their lack of regard for the well being of someone they were supposed to protect, but the fact is, there wasn't much damage done. The issue that people like me are taking is the utter lack of goodwill and the seeming malice towards TAA from some.

Some in NG have said that it wasn't done properly. That's respectable. In a situation like this, however, one or two opinions don't necessarily represent the government of an alliance. Personally, I'd like to see NG's government step up, take responsibility for an ill-judged action and try to make things right with TAA. I'd be in the front row applauding them the whole way if they chose that route.
[/quote]

Stop postulating from your pulpit, sir pope.

[Give Me Water]

[quote name='FeaR_LeSs' timestamp='1311483158' post='2762558']
Magnet we offered reps for the damage and said we were sorry. There is nothing more we can do. We will not make a whole new thread about this as we want this to end. Everyone makes mistakes and everyone learns from them.
[/quote]
If I were NG gov, I would put a muzzle and leash on this one.
Just sayin.
Your post makes no sense [i]again[/i]. So why would you even post another thread anyway? That would be stupid, accomplish nothing, and just be a waste of space.
One member offering some cash because he's a nice guy is hardly "reps" but I guess this is of little importance.
Do you believe that NG was fully to blame? Your post certainly says so, an I'm pretty sure no one else in NG have this belief.

[MaGneT]

[quote name='FeaR_LeSs' timestamp='1311483158' post='2762558']
Magnet we offered reps for the damage and said we were sorry. There is nothing more we can do. We will not make a whole new thread about this as we want this to end. Everyone makes mistakes and everyone learns from them.
[/quote]
No, NG did not offer reps. A few members had the decency to admit your government's mistake and one offered up some aid make up for it. Classy, but none of these are official positions. The point is that your official position was a flat-out dick move. It's really not that hard to reverse course, all it takes is a bit of resolve and understanding that you are capable of doing the wrong thing once in a while. It makes a lot of sense to swallow your pride here and just extend an olive branch to TAA after what just went down. It's obviously not my place to give you advice on how to run your alliance, but there it is.

[quote name='Jacapo Saladin' timestamp='1311483593' post='2762562']
Stop postulating from your pulpit, sir pope.
[/quote]
I'm not really sure how telling me to shut up helps the situation.

[FeaR_LeSs]

[quote name='Give Me Water' timestamp='1311485049' post='2762573']
If I were NG gov, I would put a muzzle and leash on this one.
Just sayin.
Your post makes no sense [i]again[/i]. So why would you even post another thread anyway? That would be stupid, accomplish nothing, and just be a waste of space.
One member offering some cash because he's a nice guy is hardly "reps" but I guess this is of little importance.
Do you believe that NG was fully to blame? Your post certainly says so, an I'm pretty sure no one else in NG have this belief.
[/quote]

I never said NG was full to blame. Simply just said we offered to give them 3 million dollars

Edited July 24, 2011 by FeaR_LeSs

[MaGneT]

[quote name='FeaR_LeSs' timestamp='1311485461' post='2762578']
I never said NG was full to blame. Simply just said we offered to give them 3 million dollars
[/quote]
That's not what you said Fear. This is what you said:
[quote name='FeaR_LeSs' timestamp='1311483158' post='2762558']
Magnet we offered reps for the damage and said we were sorry. There is nothing more we can do. We will not make a whole new thread about this as we want this to end. Everyone makes mistakes and everyone learns from them.
[/quote]
The damages incurred by the raids aren't the issue. TAA seems to have made that clear and I don't think anyone is particularly concerned with what is likely less than that 3mil in damages. The issue here is the principle of throwing an ally out for no reason at all simply for the laughs. We both know what was done was wrong. Everyone does. No one would hold this against NG if your government would understand that they are fallible and have made a mistake. They should then attempt to rectify it in an official capacity. We all make mistakes. You're not judged for your mistakes, though, you're judged for how you handle them. Deflecting the blame and minimizing the situation is not a good way to handle this.

[Jacapo Saladin]

[quote name='MaGneT' timestamp='1311487084' post='2762595']

The damages incurred by the raids aren't the issue. TAA seems to have made that clear and I don't think anyone is particularly concerned with what is likely less than that 3mil in damages. The issue here is the principle of throwing an ally out [b]for no reason[/b] at all simply for the laughs. We both know what was done was wrong. Everyone does. No one would hold this against NG if your government would understand that they are fallible and have made a mistake. They should then attempt to rectify it in an official capacity. We all make mistakes. You're not judged for your mistakes, though, you're judged for how you handle them. Deflecting the blame and minimizing the situation is not a good way to handle this.
[/quote]

Actually the reason was that they no longer needed our assistance.

[img]http://www.esotericwhale.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/36-let-it-go.png[/img]

Edited July 24, 2011 by Jacapo Saladin

[MaGneT]

[quote name='Jacapo Saladin' timestamp='1311487776' post='2762602']
Actually the reason was that they no longer needed our assistance.
[/quote]
That's the reason that the treaty no longer exists. Is that also the reason that you invited raiders to attack them? Something doesn't sit right about having people who no longer need your assistance attacked.