Who's Tech Dealing With The Gramlins

[bigwoody]

[quote name='wenwillthisend' date='21 April 2010 - 01:10 AM' timestamp='1271830224' post='2268902']
I do feel the same way about TORN, I really do. I am glad we have a mutual feeling here, makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside. To you and alot of others in the peanut gallery sure, why not. I find your alliance ridiculous but I will not make thread after thread about it.[/quote]
You can if you want. I must admit that we've never quite managed to garner as much hate as your alliance, please teach me your ways!

[quote]Please explain how I am getting all misty-eyed, I am so dying to know this.

When it comes to this thread and all the other threads about us and how we are idiots and such it is quite simple.

Put up or shut up.
[/quote]
We are doing something about it. Your members are leaving, your tech sources are slowly but surely drying up. You guys have killed your once great alliance to satisfy your egos. Good job. Even at my worst moments I can't top that.

[wenwillthisend]

[quote name='mitchh' date='21 April 2010 - 04:07 PM' timestamp='1271830033' post='2268900']
I never said it was wrong or right. Tech helps in war. Tech is purchased from tech deals. Tech sellers help you in war.
[/quote]

Then really what is the problem? We are not breaking any rules and we are playing well within the rules Admin set up for this game.
Are you just upset that we are seen to be taking advantage of Admins rules?


Bigwoody, that fails to explain how I am apparently getting all misty-eyed

Edited April 21, 2010 by wenwillthisend

[Baldr]

[quote name='Mr Damsky' date='20 April 2010 - 09:14 PM' timestamp='1271816039' post='2268574']
We're not supporting Gremlins.[/quote]

Yes, you are.

[quote name='wenwillthisend' date='21 April 2010 - 12:52 AM' timestamp='1271829130' post='2268890']
Established by who? you? The CN Police?
Just because a few people say something does not make it law or right
[/quote]

That's true of your nonsense, too. You can say it all you want, but it doesn't make it true.

FAR is aiding you at war. This is simple. They are sending you tech, and you are at war. To send you tech, they have to click a little button that says "Aid". When you get that tech, it raises your NS, and makes your nukes a little stronger.

I wouldn't care, if Gramlins were not being such jerks. But they are.

[bigwoody]

[quote name='wenwillthisend' date='21 April 2010 - 01:15 AM' timestamp='1271830518' post='2268907']
Then really what is the problem? We are not breaking any rules and we are playing well within the rules Admin set up for this game.
Are you just upset that we are seen to be taking advantage of Admins rules?
[/quote]
You aren't making any sense. Tech sent to you is aid to you, therefore we are pointing this out to your sources.

[Baldr]

[quote name='wenwillthisend' date='21 April 2010 - 01:15 AM' timestamp='1271830518' post='2268907']
Then really what is the problem? We are not breaking any rules and we are playing well within the rules Admin set up for this game.
Are you just upset that we are seen to be taking advantage of Admins rules?
[/quote]

Are you upset that people are doing things which are also allowed, such as pointing out who is selling you tech and trying to convince them to stop?

Cry me a river....

[wenwillthisend]

No, I just find it funny that you all think that we are important enough to have so many threads about, keeps me smiling, it really does

[pezstar]

Good lord. In every single major war ever, there were instances of tech dealing to alliances at war. In 100% of those cases, it's been the business of the aggrieved party (in the case of Gre's tech deals, that'd be IRON) to deal with it. IRON can choose to attack the alliances on this list or their friends and allies can come and cry on the forums about it while IRON does absolutely nothing. Apparently, it's option two. None of the rest of your side can do jack squat, as you all signed agreements not to reenter the war. If IRON isn't going to do anything about it, I promise, no one really cares. Can you folks please do your hurring and your durring in private where you'll have the validation you seem to so desperately need?

Edited April 21, 2010 by pezstar

[bigwoody]

[quote name='pezstar' date='21 April 2010 - 01:24 AM' timestamp='1271831057' post='2268922']
Good lord. In every single major war ever, there were instances of tech dealing to alliances at war. In 100% of those cases, it's been the business of the aggrieved party (in the case of Gre's tech deals, that'd be IRON) to deal with it. IRON can choose to attack the alliances on this list or their friends and allies can come and cry on the forums about it while IRON does absolutely nothing. Apparently, it's option two. Can you folks please do your hurring and durring amongst yourselves? If IRON isn't going to do anything about it, I promise, no one really cares.
[/quote]
Plenty of people seem to care. The "Do Something About It" line has always been an especially weak one, especially when we are doing something about it in the most effective way available.

If you don't like how we're going about it, Do Something About It

[pezstar]

[quote name='bigwoody' date='21 April 2010 - 02:30 AM' timestamp='1271831396' post='2268926']
Plenty of people seem to care. The "Do Something About It" line has always been an especially weak one, especially when we are doing something about it in the most effective way available.

If you don't like how we're going about it, Do Something About It
[/quote]

I agree that the "Do something about it" line is weak. That's why I've never used it.

[bigwoody]

[quote name='pezstar' date='21 April 2010 - 01:31 AM' timestamp='1271831480' post='2268929']
I agree that the "Do something about it" line is weak. That's why I've never used it.
[/quote]
You. Just. Did.

"Good lord. In every single major war ever, there were instances of tech dealing to alliances at war. In 100% of those cases, it's been the business of the aggrieved party (in the case of Gre's tech deals, that'd be IRON) to deal with it. IRON can choose to attack the alliances on this list or their friends and allies can come and cry on the forums about it while IRON does absolutely nothing. Apparently, it's option two. None of the rest of your side can do jack squat, as you all signed agreements not to reenter the war. [b]If IRON isn't going to do anything about it, I promise, no one really cares.[/b] Can you folks please do your hurring and your durring in private where you'll have the validation you seem to so desperately need?"

Bolded the most obvious instance, but that whole ramble was basically a long winded "Do Something About It"

[wenwillthisend]

[quote name='bigwoody' date='21 April 2010 - 04:34 PM' timestamp='1271831627' post='2268931']
You. Just. Did.

"Good lord. In every single major war ever, there were instances of tech dealing to alliances at war. In 100% of those cases, it's been the business of the aggrieved party (in the case of Gre's tech deals, that'd be IRON) to deal with it. IRON can choose to attack the alliances on this list or their friends and allies can come and cry on the forums about it while IRON does absolutely nothing. Apparently, it's option two. None of the rest of your side can do jack squat, as you all signed agreements not to reenter the war. [b]If IRON isn't going to do anything about it, I promise, no one really cares.[/b] Can you folks please do your hurring and your durring in private where you'll have the validation you seem to so desperately need?"

Bolded the most obvious instance, but that whole ramble was basically a long winded "Do Something About It"
[/quote]

But he never uttered the actual words "Do Something About It"

[bigwoody]

[quote name='wenwillthisend' date='21 April 2010 - 01:37 AM' timestamp='1271831806' post='2268936']
But he never uttered the actual words "Do Something About It"
[/quote]
Fine:

"It is my esteemed opinion that speaking on this matter is irrelevant, and I instead assert that you should turn to action, else I dub thee defeated, verily."

[pezstar]

[quote name='bigwoody' date='21 April 2010 - 02:34 AM' timestamp='1271831627' post='2268931']
You. Just. Did.

"Good lord. In every single major war ever, there were instances of tech dealing to alliances at war. In 100% of those cases, it's been the business of the aggrieved party (in the case of Gre's tech deals, that'd be IRON) to deal with it. IRON can choose to attack the alliances on this list or their friends and allies can come and cry on the forums about it while IRON does absolutely nothing. Apparently, it's option two. None of the rest of your side can do jack squat, as you all signed agreements not to reenter the war. [b]If IRON isn't going to do anything about it, I promise, no one really cares.[/b] Can you folks please do your hurring and your durring in private where you'll have the validation you seem to so desperately need?"

Bolded the most obvious instance, but that whole ramble was basically a long winded "Do Something About It"
[/quote]

What you heard and what I said are two different things. What I actually said is much more akin to "No one on the C&G side of the war gives a crap if people are aiding Gre, unless IRON is going to do something about it." That's not even close to DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT! It's a pretty obvious connection to a resumption of hostilities of what would likely be quite a few major alliances if IRON were to do something. Since they aren't doing something, it doesn't effect anyone but IRON and Gre, and therefore, no one cares. Not at all "Do something about it."

[bigwoody]

[quote name='pezstar' date='21 April 2010 - 01:40 AM' timestamp='1271832011' post='2268939']
What you heard and what I said are two different things. What I actually said is much more akin to "No one on the C&G side of the war gives a crap if people are aiding Gre, unless IRON is going to do something about it." That's not even close to DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT! It's a pretty obvious connection to a resumption of hostilities of what would likely be quite a few major alliances if IRON were to do something. Since they aren't doing something, it doesn't effect anyone but IRON and Gre, and therefore, no one cares. Not at all "Do something about it."
[/quote]
Right, you want them to address it in a way more favorable to you, or not at all. I am not shocked you feel that way, given your allies. Others whose opinions we value more feel differently.

The rest is semantics games.

[pezstar]

[quote name='bigwoody' date='21 April 2010 - 02:42 AM' timestamp='1271832142' post='2268943']
Right, you want them to address it in a way more favorable to you, or not at all. I am not shocked you feel that way, given your allies. Others whose opinions we value more feel differently.

The rest is semantics games.
[/quote]

Neither I nor STA gives a crap how anyone addresses anything in this situation. We're not getting involved in anything involving this stupid, stupid war again. As for the "semantics", I meant exactly what I wrote, and then I explained it to you because you did not understand it. If you want to attempt to change the meaning of my words by calling your misunderstanding of them "semantics", be my guest.

[shahenshah]

[quote name='pezstar' date='21 April 2010 - 11:40 AM' timestamp='1271832011' post='2268939']
It's a pretty obvious connection to a resumption of hostilities of what would likely be quite a few major alliances if IRON were to do something.
[/quote]

Ting ting ting!

"If IRON does something, they resume hostilities with few major alliances, if they dont do something, nobody should care, since they dont care and their friends are just rumbling and mumbling!"

Edited April 21, 2010 by shahenshah

[Puppet Master]

[quote name='Bilrow' date='21 April 2010 - 02:18 AM' timestamp='1271812675' post='2268506']
Since March 31, 2010, the following is the list of alliances sorted by amount who are sending tech to The Gramlins.


The Grämlins 2010-03-31 - 2010-04-31 Aid Received

Alliance Tech
Federation of Allied Republics 700
Fallen Knights 650
Mostly Harmless Alliance 250
Peoples Order of Truth 200
Sanitarium 200
Army of the Twelve Monkeys 150
Multicolored Cross-X Alliance 150
SOS Brigade 150
Sparta 150
The Democratic Order 150
The Mafia 150
The Ninjas 150
[b][size="5"]IAA POW 100[/size][/b]
League of Soviet Nations 100
NATO 100
None 100
World Federation 100
All for Yellow 50
Alliance of international defence 50
Avalanche 50
Blue Turtle Alliance 50
Bushido 50
Citadel Trading Company 50
Conservative Politically Allied Countries 50
Darkstar 50
Invicta 50
League of Imperial Nations 50
Nordreich 50
Nusantara Elite Warriors 50
Pirates of the Parrot Order 50
Regnum Invictorum 50
RnR 50
Rome 50
Saint Patricks Brigade 50
Sphinx Order 50
The Blood Brothers 50
The Confederation of Canada 50
The Golden Horde 50
The Legion 50
The Order of New World Domination 50
World Task Force Applicant 50
Total Received Aid 4,750
[/quote]


YAY thats me right there! Im so honored to be mention here, I'd like to first thank the Grämlins for buying my tech during the heat of the karma war when my choices of tech buyers were limited due to my surrender terms. I also like to thank Bilrow for pointing out something which has no meaning what so ever.

Did you ever stop to think that maybe we are sending tech because we HAVE ALREADY RECEIVED MONEY and are bound to finish the deal? I have friends in both DAWN and IRON and I would like to see them get peace, however you got to understand, business is business. Did i decide to renew the deal? No. But in the end it would not have mattered if i did or didn't. For the right price people are always going to do tech deals with the Gramlins, not matter what people say or want. You pointing out who is sending them tech is not going to solve anything. In the end it leaves us in the same situation, Gramlins top tier cant be touched while their bottom gets cut out. Throwing up a list like this is doing nothing other than trying to shame alliances for finishing tech deals they had already signed too. So thanks for the great and informative chart, I now know what people i can do tech deals with who wont simply back out in the middle of the deal and have honor enough to finish even if it is unpopular.

Edited April 21, 2010 by Puppet Master

[Cormalek]

Wow, I was going to go along the lines of: "Wow, the embargo is really working!" or "well penny collecting pays off", but apparently my mileage varies?

As I don't feel the urge to feel outraged about at least one thing at any time, allow me to provide some context to those numbers:

5 out of 560 MHA nations trade with Gre, so that's 0.89% Considering how big impact OWF actually has on most nations of Digiterra (little to none), I'm suddenly really pleased with the work of our Ministry of Towels, as they are apparently really, [i]really[/i] efficient at keeping both tech and cash within our borders.

As to the Ebil FAR... pssh xD
7% of their nations trade with Gre, hardly an organized system of aid. Or, since the numbers seem to be hip right now - 1.4% of their theoretical export abilities [ooc: aid slots] are involved in trading with Gre. Filling 4.75% of Gre theoretical import abilities [ooc: again, aid slots].

Oh yes. They're really[i] turning the odds[/i].

Looking at the spread here, I'd rather point out, that Gre will be able to find trade partners regardless of any actions taken even by majority of big alliances of Bob. This might not be true, but to confirm/deny it, we would need data regarding Gre trades [i]prior[/i] to this situation. Without control group this is just a bunch of numbers, and has nothing to do with reality.

[Ryuzaki]

[quote name='pezstar' date='21 April 2010 - 07:24 PM' timestamp='1271831057' post='2268922']
Good lord. In every single major war ever, there were instances of tech dealing to alliances at war. In 100% of those cases, it's been the business of the aggrieved party (in the case of Gre's tech deals, that'd be IRON) to deal with it. IRON can choose to attack the alliances on this list or their friends and allies can come and cry on the forums about it while IRON does absolutely nothing. Apparently, it's option two. None of the rest of your side can do jack squat, as you all signed agreements not to reenter the war. If IRON isn't going to do anything about it, I promise, no one really cares. Can you folks please do your hurring and your durring in private where you'll have the validation you seem to so desperately need?
[/quote]

THANK YOU.

You perfectly sum up my opinion here.

[lebubu]

[quote name='Arcades057' date='21 April 2010 - 05:02 AM' timestamp='1271818905' post='2268655']
They are enjoying a short period of "big dog" syndrome.
[/quote]

Short period? heh.

[Haflinger]

[quote name='supercoolyellow' date='21 April 2010 - 02:09 AM' timestamp='1271830150' post='2268901']
Uh... guys... I think we've been doing this wrong. Fallen knights have given just 50 less tech to GRE, and we've hardly mentioned them
[/quote]
FK are a Sparta protectorate, and an Invicta splinter that we don't get along with. Thus, everything they do is automatically right.

This is the OWF.

[Banksy]

March 31st was some time ago~ Statistics from the last 10 days would be more relevant. Or are they less... provocative?

[ChairmanHal]

[quote name='Cormalek' date='21 April 2010 - 04:05 AM' timestamp='1271837094' post='2268991']
Looking at the spread here, I'd rather point out, that Gre will be able to find trade partners regardless of any actions taken even by majority of big alliances of Bob. This might not be true, but to confirm/deny it, we would need data regarding Gre trades [i]prior[/i] to this situation. Without control group this is just a bunch of numbers, and has nothing to do with reality.
[/quote]

None of what you said invalidates in any way the efforts to stop/suspend tech deals with Gramlins for the duration of the ongoing hostilities. I don't need data going back over 6 months or any period of time to know that. Would it be nice to have confirmation that the embargo is starting to take hold beyond some anecdotal evidence? of course...but effort continues. The only way to guarantee that an embargo won't work is not to try one at all.

[Mushroom Man]

[quote name='Haflinger' date='21 April 2010 - 10:02 PM' timestamp='1271851306' post='2269052']
FK are a Sparta protectorate, and an Invicta splinter that we don't get along with. Thus, everything they do is automatically right.

This is the OWF.
[/quote]
Hahaha, are you kidding?

I understand Invicta and you personally have a bad rep, but I don't think the majority of the OWF consider who protects FK or what alignment they have with Invicta before they read into their posts.

Aha, your attitude is hilarious though.

[Iotupa]

It's amazing how this war has somehow managed to make me agree with people I have never agreed with in the past. Please gRAMlins, stop the madness so I can stop agreeing with these people!