Who's Tech Dealing With The Gramlins

[Denial]

[quote name='Natan' date='21 April 2010 - 12:39 PM' timestamp='1271815757' post='2268568']
So what the hell should we do with this list?

Roll everyone on it?
[/quote]
Seems about the only option here

What's particularly amusing is the fact that the list shows technology is being sold from alliances on both sides of the previous war.

[supercoolyellow]

[quote name='Puppet Master' date='21 April 2010 - 02:08 AM' timestamp='1271833670' post='2268967']
YAY thats me right there! Im so honored to be mention here, I'd like to first thank the Grämlins for buying my tech during the heat of the karma war when my choices of tech buyers were limited due to my surrender terms. I also like to thank Bilrow for pointing out something which has no meaning what so ever.

Did you ever stop to think that maybe we are sending tech because we HAVE ALREADY RECEIVED MONEY and are bound to finish the deal? I have friends in both DAWN and IRON and I would like to see them get peace, however you got to understand, business is business. Did i decide to renew the deal? No. But in the end it would not have mattered if i did or didn't. For the right price people are always going to do tech deals with the Gramlins, not matter what people say or want. You pointing out who is sending them tech is not going to solve anything. In the end it leaves us in the same situation, Gramlins top tier cant be touched while their bottom gets cut out. Throwing up a list like this is doing nothing other than trying to shame alliances for finishing tech deals they had already signed too. So thanks for the great and informative chart, I now know what people i can do tech deals with who wont simply back out in the middle of the deal and have honor enough to finish even if it is unpopular.
[/quote]

you know, highlighting yourself on the list, as an IAA POW isn't the most clever thing you could have done there.

[flak attack]

[quote name='Mushroom Man' date='21 April 2010 - 09:01 AM' timestamp='1271854843' post='2269075']
Hahaha, are you kidding?

I understand Invicta and you personally have a bad rep, but I don't think the majority of the OWF consider who protects FK or what alignment they have with Invicta before they read into their posts.

Aha, your attitude is hilarious though.
[/quote]
No, he's absolutely correct. I consider an alliance's relationship with Invicta before I ever make a judgement on them. Just like my dislike of MCXA makes me like TSO.

[lonewolfe2015]

Clever Bilrow, create a situation out of nothing where everyone brings up something to whine about which has an equally pointless answer to it.

Guys, if you don't like someone tech dealing to the alliance, go talk to them, pretty easy. That's what was done during the big war, no reason not to now.

This "CBs never expire" is a clever spin to poke jabs at alliances when everyone here knows perfectly well it serves no point in a discussion unless the committed act is still going on.

Save your bickering for a topic actually worth it... which isn't very many.

[Mustakrakish II]

[quote name='Bilrow' date='20 April 2010 - 11:42 PM' timestamp='1271824913' post='2268807']
I wouldn't have it any other way.
[/quote]
It's an uphill battle for most loathed of 2010. I wish you luck.

[Golan 1st]

[url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=81061&st=0"]Here[/url] you can see what CnG thought about war time tech deals when they didn't have to support Gramlins' war effort.

[SirWilliam]

[quote name='Golan 1st' date='21 April 2010 - 02:41 PM' timestamp='1271875266' post='2269339']
[url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=81061&st=0"]Here[/url] you can see what CnG thought about war time tech deals when they didn't have to support Gramlins' war effort.
[/quote]

[url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=84644&st=0"]Here[/url] you can see that C&G has not been involved in any war time tech deals. So, your point?

[Drai]

[quote name='ironchef' date='20 April 2010 - 06:57 PM' timestamp='1271815060' post='2268554']
However there has been a new policy set in CN that there is no expiration date on a CB.
[/quote]
Actually all of these alliances in the OP will be forgiven by July 16th, 2010. IRON and DAWN have just less than 3 months to use their CB.

[ironchef]

[quote name='Golan 1st' date='21 April 2010 - 11:41 AM' timestamp='1271875266' post='2269339']
[url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=81061&st=0"]Here[/url] you can see what CnG thought about war time tech deals when they didn't have to support Gramlins' war effort.
[/quote]

Well this is a great PM. I think this makes it clear that aid to gRAMlins is a big no no and IRON and DAWN have a CB on any alliance that feels a need to keep sending aid to gRAM. Best part is because of Athens they can sit on it for 6 months and use it when they are good and ready to do so.

[quote]From: _____________ Date: 2/15/2010 12:50:06 AM

Subject: Aid Transactions

Message: You appear to have recently sent aid to a nation belonging to an alliance engaged in active aggressive wars against member alliances of the C&G Union.We treat aid to ongoing combatants the same as direct aggressive actions againstus our ally, though we understand that some tech deals will continue to go through as some dealers are oblivious to the situation.

We ask you to immediately stop sending further packages of aid to these alliances and to cancel your current pending transactions. If so we will consider the situation resolved, but further aid packages will result in a military response. Your nation will be monitored for compliance with this request.[/quote]

[Arcades057]

[quote name='Golan 1st' date='21 April 2010 - 02:41 PM' timestamp='1271875266' post='2269339']
[url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=81061&st=0"]Here[/url] you can see what CnG thought about war time tech deals when they didn't have to support Gramlins' war effort.
[/quote]

You know, I realized a while back that pointing out the hypocrisy to people never convinces them they can't be on both sides of an issue at different times and be right in both situations. Good find on that, though.

[SirWilliam]

Ah, I get it now.

C&G members aren't in a comparable tizzy over the aiding of Grämlins here. Surely that means we now support the aiding of combatants by non-combatants!

[Arcades057]

[quote name='SirWilliam' date='21 April 2010 - 03:43 PM' timestamp='1271879019' post='2269417']
Ah, I get it now.

C&G members aren't in a comparable tizzy over the aiding of Grämlins here. Surely that means we now support the aiding of combatants by non-combatants!
[/quote]

I don't see anyone in a tizzy. Since members of MK seem more apt to defend the actions of Gramlins or to belittle those speaking out on IRON's behalf, you'd have to be a rube not to think that MK supports the actions of those whom they defend.

[lonewolfe2015]

[quote name='ironchef' date='21 April 2010 - 03:05 PM' timestamp='1271876737' post='2269370']
Well this is a great PM. I think this makes it clear that aid to gRAMlins is a big no no and IRON and DAWN have a CB on any alliance that feels a need to keep sending aid to gRAM. [b]Best part is because of Athens they can sit on it for 6 months and use it when they are good and ready to do so.[/b]
[/quote]

You want to explain why this makes sense rather than simply making blind statements?

[SirWilliam]

[quote name='Arcades057' date='21 April 2010 - 03:46 PM' timestamp='1271879192' post='2269419']
I don't see anyone in a tizzy.
[/quote]

You're not too observant then. The outrage expressed in multiple threads and dozens upon dozens of pages says otherwise.

[quote name='Arcades057' date='21 April 2010 - 03:46 PM' timestamp='1271879192' post='2269419']
Since members of MK seem more apt to defend the actions of Gramlins or to belittle those speaking out on IRON's behalf, you'd have to be a rube not to think that MK supports the actions of those whom they defend.
[/quote]

You're basing that on what? A couple MK members, if that even?

[der_ko]

MK looks out for itself and it's allies, but when the very same thing we protect our own from happens to an hostile alliance (IRON), we do nothing. Clearly MK needs to protect every alliance and every nation on Planet Bob, like we do with our own members and allies, or we will be blatant hypocrites.

This is Hegemony rhetoric 101. Next week we will cover how MK is more evil then THE DEVIL and the NPO combined.

[size="1"][quote name='shilo' date='21 April 2010 - 10:10 PM' timestamp='1271880612' post='2269456']
Der Ko also just won the godwin's award, quite early in this thread, don't get so defensive over posts which are naturally always non-representative of official policies.
[/quote]Just for you I made a small and irrelevant edit so your kind won't be distracted and confused.[/size]

Edited April 21, 2010 by der_ko

[shilo]

[quote name='SirWilliam' date='21 April 2010 - 10:00 PM' timestamp='1271880029' post='2269442']
You're basing that on what? A couple MK members, if that even?
[/quote]
Although we all have learned that BB posts are generally always not-concurrent with the policies of an alliance, some of us still think old-school and take countless attempts at downplaying this by you and your alliance mates infact as a desire to express your silent support for what ramlins are doing.
I know we got it all wrong, and you are just downplaying it cause it's fun to do, forgive us, we are still adjusting.


Der Ko also just won the godwin's award, quite early in this thread, don't get so defensive over posts which are naturally always non-representative of official policies.

[Pearl]

[quote name='Mustakrakish II' date='21 April 2010 - 12:08 PM' timestamp='1271869665' post='2269228']
It's an uphill battle for most loathed of 2010. I wish you luck.
[/quote]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA *deep breath* HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA

lol@billy


On a side note, Sparta should get EZI over that 150 tech. Those terrible terrible people.

[Golan 1st]

[quote name='der_ko' date='21 April 2010 - 11:04 PM' timestamp='1271880277' post='2269449']MK looks out for itself and it's allies, but when the very same thing we protect our own from happens to an hostile alliance (IRON), we do nothing. Clearly MK needs to protect every alliance and every nation on Planet Bob, like we do with our own members and allies, or we will be blatant hypocrites.

This is Hegemony rhetoric 101. Next week we will cover how MK is more evil then Hitler and the NPO combined.[/quote]No, I don't expect you to actively help us.
But you would be more consistent if you did so vocally support Gramlins (by you I refer to some of your members. Not MK as a whole).
Also, you are practically enabling them to continue their nonsense by not clearing out your position about the possibility that third party alliances join the war against Gramlins. To stop that, you did not have to declare war on Gramlins. You just had to say that you would not intervene if others do that.

Edited April 21, 2010 by Golan 1st

[Bob]

[quote name='Golan 1st' date='21 April 2010 - 04:18 PM' timestamp='1271881113' post='2269464']
No, I don't expect you to actively help us.
But you would be more consistent if you did so vocally support Gramlins (by you I refer to some of your members. Not MK as a whole).
Also, you are practically enabling them to continue their nonsense by not clearing out your position about the possibility that third party alliances join the war against Gramlins. To stop that, you did not have to declare war on Gramlins. You just had to say that you would not intervene if others do that.
[/quote]
MK WILL NEVER SUPPORT OUR FRIENDS. THIS WOULD GO AGAINST ALL OF OUR POLICIES AND PRINCIPLES.
When friends have a bad policy, you don't completely abandon them. Sound familiar? We are not supporting their offensive war like some chose to do with TOP (DAWN and IRON) but we are not going to let them be destroyed. If people allied to DAWN and IRON want to come in in support of their friends, then they can expect us to do the same.

Edited April 21, 2010 by Penlugue Solaris

[Golan 1st]

[quote name='Penlugue Solaris' date='21 April 2010 - 11:26 PM' timestamp='1271881582' post='2269472']
MK WILL NEVER SUPPORT OUR FRIENDS. THIS WOULD GO AGAINST ALL OF OUR POLICIES AND PRINCIPLES.
[/quote]This is the very same excuse which was so often used by the old Hegemony. It's good to see that their heritage is not lost.

[Drai]

To be honest, I think most MK members 'support Gramlins' because of the uproar it causes, not because we actually support it. It's amusing to watch accusations unfold simply because we don't share identical ideals to those in IRON/DAWN.

[der_ko]

[quote name='Golan 1st' date='21 April 2010 - 10:18 PM' timestamp='1271881113' post='2269464']
No, I don't expect you to actively help us.
But you would be more consistent if you did so vocally support Gramlins (by you I refer to some of your members. Not MK as a whole).
Also, you are practically enabling them to continue their nonsense by not clearing out your position about the possibility that third party alliances join the war against Gramlins. To stop that, you did not have to declare war on Gramlins. You just had to say that you would not intervene if others do that.
[/quote]
Unless I am mistaken, anyone who would consider interveening in this affair has already pledged not to rejoin the war when they surrendered.

[Golan 1st]

[quote name='Penlugue Solaris' date='21 April 2010 - 11:26 PM' timestamp='1271881582' post='2269472']
MK WILL NEVER SUPPORT OUR FRIENDS. THIS WOULD GO AGAINST ALL OF OUR POLICIES AND PRINCIPLES.
When friends have a bad policy, you don't completely abandon them. Sound familiar? We are not supporting their offensive war like some chose to do with TOP (DAWN and IRON) but we are not going to let them be destroyed. If people allied to DAWN and IRON want to come in in support of their friends, then they can expect us to do the same.[/quote]It's one thing to get them to stop implementing their "bad policy" and then defend them from the consequences. It's completely another to just back their policy in the name of friendship. By doing the latter, you share the responsibility for their policy.
If you actually mean it when you say that you oppose their policy, the least you could do is to stop defending it.

[lebubu]

[quote name='Golan 1st' date='21 April 2010 - 10:29 PM' timestamp='1271881727' post='2269474']
This is the very same excuse which was so often used by the old Hegemony. It's good to see that their heritage is not lost.
[/quote]

Oh, in that case, I guess we're just as bad as them. What now?

[shilo]

[quote name='Drai' date='21 April 2010 - 10:30 PM' timestamp='1271881792' post='2269475']
To be honest, I think most MK members 'support Gramlins' because of the uproar it causes, not because we actually support it. It's amusing to watch accusations unfold simply because we don't share identical ideals to those in IRON/DAWN.
[/quote]
Well, I am thankful many others don't just cry about a wrong when it concerns them...