The New Grämlins

[kriekfreak]

[quote name='jstep' date='09 April 2010 - 01:51 PM' timestamp='1270817497' post='2254227']
who has a top tier anymore anyways?
[/quote]

TOP destroyed my pixels

[Sephiroth]

[quote name='Bilrow' date='09 April 2010 - 03:08 PM' timestamp='1270840089' post='2254509']
For the duration of the war up till today (1/29-today):


Offensively Gramlins hit and # of wars:
Democratic Alliance of Wise Nations 11
Independent Republic of Orange Nations 74

Defensively Gramlins was hit by and # of wars:
Democratic Alliance of Wise Nations 11
Independent Republic of Orange Nations 22

Ironically 29 of the defensive wars are current.
[/quote]
You can put 3 offensive and 1 defensive for The Citadel.

[Delta1212]

It'd really be more interesting to see the stats from the general peace declaration on.

[Jesse End]

[quote name='Delta1212' date='09 April 2010 - 06:52 PM' timestamp='1270860744' post='2254838']
It'd really be more interesting to see the stats from the general peace declaration on.
[/quote]

Since its only been 6 days since April 4th, you can see them all in [url=http://www.cybernations.net/search_wars.asp?searchstring=Declaring_Alliance%2CReceiving_Alliance&search=Gr%E4mlins]Gremlins currently active wars[/url].

Offensively Gramlins hit and # of wars:
Independent Republic Of Orange Nations 2
The Citadel 1

Defensively Gramlins was hit by and # of wars:
Democratic Alliance of Wise Nations 13
Independent Republic Of Orange Nations 21
The Citadel 3

[Azrael Alexander]

the whole front where the real war is to be fought (if at all) is at the +50K ns region

[Diomede]

[quote name='Shamshir' date='10 April 2010 - 10:32 PM' timestamp='1270935132' post='2255812']
the whole front where the real war is to be fought (if at all) is at the +50K ns region
[/quote]
It was already fought - and IRON lost. That's why their nations above 50k are currently in peace mode. Did I mention that war ended, btw?

[Gamemaster1]

[quote name='Jesse End' date='10 April 2010 - 12:07 PM' timestamp='1270915642' post='2255557']
Since its only been 6 days since April 4th, you can see them all in [url=http://www.cybernations.net/search_wars.asp?searchstring=Declaring_Alliance%2CReceiving_Alliance&search=Gr%E4mlins]Gremlins currently active wars[/url].

Offensively Gramlins hit and # of wars:
Independent Republic Of Orange Nations 2
The Citadel 1

Defensively Gramlins was hit by and # of wars:
Democratic Alliance of Wise Nations 13
Independent Republic Of Orange Nations 21
The Citadel 3
[/quote]

Those two wars against us are just Jack Diorno being Jack Diorno. I don't even think he is a real Gremlin yet, just an applicant. He declared on two others before I managed to anarchy him, likely just because I attacked him. Again.

[rapmanej]

[quote] On Peace Terms
Peace terms shall not be used to humilate the opponent or to cripple him economically beyond the need to remove the current and immediate threat to the alliance. No terms shall be offered which The Grämlins would not consider acceptable if the sides were switched. The terms shall reflect the opponents' behavior during battle.[/quote]

Nuff' said.

[Alterego]

Ramwedge & his cronies seems happy to allow Shamlins smaller nations be crushed while all the people at the top sit in peace mode for tactical reasons.

[Azrael Alexander]

[quote name='rapmanej' date='11 April 2010 - 07:18 AM' timestamp='1270966665' post='2256214']
Nuff' said.
[/quote]

indeed

[shilo]

[quote name='Shamshir' date='11 April 2010 - 03:32 PM' timestamp='1270992730' post='2256328']
indeed
[/quote]
I am sure your codex will serve as an important guideline for us in the future.

[kerschbs]

[quote name='Shamshir' date='10 April 2010 - 05:32 PM' timestamp='1270935132' post='2255812']
the whole front where the real war is to be fought (if at all) is at the +50K ns region
[/quote]

Really? No kidding? Your arrogance astounds me. I cannot wait until Gramlins gets held to their own "standards." You all have destroyed the reputation of one of the best alliances on Bob. It disgusts me at what Gramlins has let themselves become.

[Carlton the Great]

Congratulations to IRON on their first Grämlin surrender

Though it does pain me to be cheering against a former ally and friend

[Lord Brendan]

After discussing the issue quite a bit with Ram and some other Gremlins, I feel that the terms (or lack thereof) are not quite as ridiculous as I originally thought. Although I still feel that Gremlins are being unreasonably stubborn about this, I think it's in IRON's best interests to comply with the Gremlins' demands rather than remain in peace mode indefinitely.

[Carlton the Great]

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='11 April 2010 - 02:18 PM' timestamp='1271009905' post='2256451']
After discussing the issue quite a bit with Ram and some other Gremlins, I feel that the terms (or lack thereof) are not quite as ridiculous as I originally thought. Although I still feel that Gremlins are being unreasonably stubborn about this, I think it's in IRON's best interests to comply with the Gremlins' demands rather than remain in peace mode indefinitely.
[/quote]
That's absurd. The Grämlins bandwagoned into this war, aggressively attacking IRON for the second time in a row. They have absolutely no right to be demanding anything from IRON, and it is only because of the spinelessness of certain alliances that this travesty is allowed to continue.

[The Warrior]

[quote name='Carlton the Great' date='11 April 2010 - 06:20 PM' timestamp='1271006435' post='2256420']
Congratulations to IRON on their first Grämlin surrender
[/quote]

Thank you Carlton. This nation made a wise decision.

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='11 April 2010 - 07:18 PM' timestamp='1271009905' post='2256451']
After discussing the issue quite a bit with Ram and some other Gremlins, I feel that the terms (or lack thereof) are not quite as ridiculous as I originally thought. Although I still feel that Gremlins are being unreasonably stubborn about this, I think it's in IRON's best interests to comply with the Gremlins' demands rather than remain in peace mode indefinitely.
[/quote]

Well we are sure glad that Ram will talk to you about his plans for our alliance , however I'm pretty sure that he is talking to the wrong people and his request is unacceptable.

Edited April 11, 2010 by The Warrior

[The Big Bad]

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='11 April 2010 - 02:18 PM' timestamp='1271009905' post='2256451']
After discussing the issue quite a bit with Ram and some other Gremlins, I feel that the terms (or lack thereof) are not quite as ridiculous as I originally thought. Although I still feel that Gremlins are being unreasonably stubborn about this, I think it's in IRON's best interests to comply with the Gremlins' demands rather than remain in peace mode indefinitely.
[/quote]

I am sure Gremlins are doing the best they can to put a positive light on this complete disaster. The fact is nothing they can do can save face now. No one would surrender and accept whatever terms the other side chose to impose after the fact. The only thing more stupid than accepting terms like that would be offering them. No, IRON's best interest is to continue on while Gremlins reputation and its very alliance continues to collapse. Gremlins dug themselves this hole I don't think we should expect the alliance they attacked to dig them out. It is amazing to watch such old and once respected alliance fail in such a total way. Sad really. Have to wonder how people who are so poorly equiped to lead get into power and then are allowed to drive an alliance into the ground.

[Golan 1st]

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='11 April 2010 - 09:18 PM' timestamp='1271009905' post='2256451']After discussing the issue quite a bit with Ram and some other Gremlins, I feel that the terms (or lack thereof) are not quite as ridiculous as I originally thought. Although I still feel that Gremlins are being unreasonably stubborn about this, I think it's in IRON's best interests to comply with the Gremlins' demands rather than remain in peace mode indefinitely.[/quote]We could consider complying with Gramlin's demands if we knew what they were.
Obviously, accepting them without knowing what they are is not a real option.

[Aeternos Astramora]

[quote name='shilo' date='11 April 2010 - 09:45 AM' timestamp='1270997136' post='2256349']
I am sure your codex will serve as an important guideline for us in the future.
[/quote]
So when DAWN makes Gre surrender, it's fair for you to make them unconditionally surrender.

Sounds good to me.

[shilo]

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='11 April 2010 - 08:18 PM' timestamp='1271009905' post='2256451']
After discussing the issue quite a bit with Ram and some other Gremlins, I feel that the terms (or lack thereof) are not quite as ridiculous as I originally thought. Although I still feel that Gremlins are being unreasonably stubborn about this, I think it's in IRON's best interests to comply with the Gremlins' demands rather than remain in peace mode indefinitely.
[/quote]
Well, thanks for your great diplomatic efforts, obviously they have more to say to you than to us. Continue using your great contacts to them to change their minds, and then we all can end this war.

But we surely know what is in our best interest, and in any case, it's the opposite of anything coming from gRAMlins.

Edited April 11, 2010 by shilo

[Egwaterboy61]

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='11 April 2010 - 07:18 PM' timestamp='1271009905' post='2256451']
After discussing the issue quite a bit with Ram and some other Gremlins, I feel that the terms (or lack thereof) are not quite as ridiculous as I originally thought. Although I still feel that Gremlins are being unreasonably stubborn about this, I think it's in IRON's best interests to comply with the Gremlins' demands rather than remain in peace mode indefinitely.
[/quote]

Your exactly right. There are no terms. And that is *exactly* what is so ridiculous. They are holding IRON in war (and held up peace talks) and fail to make it clear to IRON, or anyone for the matter, what exactly they want.

If GRE said: We want IRON to decommission x, y, and Z, and then pay us Xk tech, and IRON was just saying "No, those terms are to much." That wouldn't be as unbelievable.

It is the fact that Ram is being this stubborn about some obscure term for the sole purpose of showing IRON that GRE is in control, that is unbelievable.

[Wes Walz Pants]

[quote name='Egwaterboy61' date='11 April 2010 - 03:25 PM' timestamp='1271013925' post='2256501']
Your exactly right. There are no terms. And that is *exactly* what is so ridiculous. They are holding IRON in war (and held up peace talks) and fail to make it clear to IRON, or anyone for the matter, what exactly they want.

If GRE said: We want IRON to decommission x, y, and Z, and then pay us Xk tech, and IRON was just saying "No, those terms are to much." That wouldn't be as unbelievable.

It is the fact that Ram is being this stubborn about some obscure term for the sole purpose of showing IRON that GRE is in control, that is unbelievable.
[/quote]
No it's perfectly believable coming from Ram and the current Gramlins leadership. What's unbelievable is the fact that individuals such as Lord Brennan fail to grasp the concept that IRON has refused to consider Unconditional Surrender. It won't happen and it shouldn't happen.

[Egwaterboy61]

[quote name='Calderone' date='11 April 2010 - 09:23 PM' timestamp='1271017394' post='2256546']
No it's perfectly believable coming from Ram and the current Gramlins leadership. What's unbelievable is the fact that individuals such as Lord Brennan fail to grasp the concept that IRON has refused to consider Unconditional Surrender. It won't happen and it shouldn't happen.
[/quote]

From Ram, yes. From Gremlins leadership, not in the least bit.

The problem is that "Unconditional Surrender" is way to obscure. Gremlins has not, and will not, explain what it means. They want IRON to give complete mercy to them, before they explain exactly what they are doing, or planing for terms.

[Lord Brendan]

What Gremlins want is for IRON to say "we surrender and accept whatever terms you offer". IRON would then be given a 3-4 day ceasefire during which Gremlins want them to decommission all tanks, CMs, navy, aircraft and nukes, plus soldiers down to a certain level, in addition to leaving peace mode. It is at this point that they would reveal the terms, the nature of which I don't even think most Gremlins know.

Now, obviously if IRON were to comply with this demand and then be presented with terms that were unacceptable, then their position will have been significantly worsened. As it is though, their only other options are fighting back (which, given some of IRON gov's posts, they have already given up on) or waiting for someone to save them. Also, depending on the nature of the terms given they could always say "ok, we accept" and then have everyone run back to peace mode 5 days later, in which case they'll be back where they started except with lower bills.

Edited April 11, 2010 by Lord Brendan

[Carlton the Great]

[quote name='Lord Brendan' date='11 April 2010 - 05:18 PM' timestamp='1271020697' post='2256580']
What Gremlins want is for IRON to say "we surrender and accept whatever terms you offer". IRON would then be given a 3-4 day ceasefire during which Gremlins want them to decommission all tanks, CMs, navy, aircraft and nukes, plus soldiers down to a certain level, in addition to leaving peace mode. It is at this point that they would reveal the terms, the nature of which I don't even think most Gremlins know.

Now, obviously if IRON were to comply with this demand and then be presented with terms that were unacceptable, then their position will have been significantly worsened. As it is though, their only other options are fighting back (which, given some of IRON gov's posts, [b]they have already given up on[/b]) or waiting for someone to save them. Also, depending on the nature of the terms given they could always say "ok, we accept" and then have everyone run back to peace mode 5 days later, in which case they'll be back where they started except with lower bills.
[/quote]
Really? Better tell the Grämlins NS graph

[URL=http://img63.imageshack.us/i/nsgraph.jpg/][IMG]http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/2310/nsgraph.jpg[/IMG][/URL]