Imperial Decree - New Polar Order

[WarriorConcept]

I don't need to. What happened is what happened, why would I speculate on something I don't know about?

Why are you arguing about something you claim you don't have knowledge of then?

Then you'd notice the sincerity of that apology has been called into question several times.

Please point that out.

So you admit to implying false connections intentionally?

No. I also asked you where I used a fake timeline. Still waiting.

[Dochartaigh]

That war would have occured wether or not Genmay used that CB or if GGA used their "CB" on GOONS.

Hell if we want to brign up history, we can claim that GGA sees protecting random unaligns who just happen to be on their "roster" against their enemies, because, you know, thats how GGA entered that war.

If you want to bring up ancient history and all ...

nice way to deflect the similarities between this CB and the one that Genmay used that \m/ supported.

this has nothing to do with whether or not the UjW would have begun, nor anything at all to do with GGA. this has to do with the fact that \m/ has a history of supporting the use of failed diplomacy as a reason for war except it seems when they fail the diplomatic part and it is used as a CB against them. hypocrisy anyone?

[WarriorConcept]

actually, while the actions are somewhat similar, they cannot be called one in the same. Polaris has yet to try to act like the world police despite all the crying they have done so.

for one, if they were the world police, as CNARF was attempting to do, they would have declared on Athens and FoB but instead, CnG handled that situation in house. they would have gone after GOONS but that was also handled through diplomacy. PC, honestly i have no clue about this one so i cannot comment on it.

but fact is, they did not go after the other alliances who have tech-raided micro-alliances. thus, the whole "world police" argument fails right there. it seems many cannot follow this logic. that is the first way that Polaris cannot be compared to CNARF.

the second way is that Polaris has never, nor do they here, attempt to state that all tech raiding will be met with force. thus, again it cannot be compared to CNARF.

three, Polaris is an alliance and CNARF hid amongst none and one man AAs as well as (possibly) other alliances in order to ensure that no one knew who they were and thus, they could remain hidden. Polaris is not attempting to hide from anyone. so a third way your comparing them to CNARF fails.

fourth, CNARF/Walford made thread after thread and post after post declaring the evils of tech raiding. Polaris has only done that on two occasions. The KoN raid and the FoA raid. Polaris is not attempting to change anyone's mind on tech raiding unaligned just on tech raiding alliances. so again, this one is more similar but in the end still fails when you compare the goals of CNARF and the goals of Polaris.

so that is four ways that your comparison of Polaris and CNARF fails WC. can this useless argument be dropped now?

That quote was referring to whether he believed the apology by \m/ was sincere, not about CNARF.

[Xavii]

Personally I would love to have Umbrella helping out PC should they defend \m/

Then again I'm not in Tri.

[F15pilotX]

Good, then you should already know the answer.

That answers my question quite nicely as well. Funny how that works.

[erikz]

Oh yeah, I hope to meet you in battle whenever PC enters, dear Polaris.

[Dochartaigh]

That quote was referring to whether he believed the apology by \m/ was sincere, not about CNARF.

whoops my bad. the CNARF argument lasted for a while so i was mistaken as to which one you guys were discussing.

[kriekfreak]

So let me get this straight. So in order to punish \m/ for techraiding someone else, you are now techraiding them? You might wanna declare up on yourself now Grub. Commander of the World Police.

[kriekfreak]

Personally I would love to have Umbrella helping out PC should they defend \m/

Then again I'm not in Tri.

I agree, it would be fun to see all of PC's MDoAP partners kicking some polarbears down.

[F15pilotX]

So let me get this straight. So in order to punish \m/ for techraiding someone else, you are now techraiding them?

Didn't Polar just declare war on \m/ ? Edited January 21, 2010 by F15pilotX

[uaciaut]

Disrespectful and vulgar behavior has consequences. Maybe this matter will convince some of the truth of that statement, or at least compel them to be more respectful in the future. I am sick and tired of the OWF being a cesspit of degradation and assorted crudity. These days, intelligent debate is insulted and degraded rather than encouraged. That needs to change; and those who involve themselves in such behavior need to consider becoming more constructive in dialogue.

You'd get a middle finger from me as well if you tried to approach MK about a matter that has nothing to do with TOP, particularly while starting with war threats that are the follow-up of more war threats.

And i'm not prone to defending people who sugar-coat their !@#$ either.

[AlmightyGrub]

You must not have a clue about what I'm saying. If NpO is choosing to be world police, don't you think they should at least go all the way through with it?

Do we really have to go there, it seems like a fairly poor argument to suggest unless I kill everyone I have an issue with at once that I am not living up to my own expectations.

If you really want to understand the differences between the three cases at the very start of this matter, you will actually have to submit yourself to the concept of rational thought, good luck with that.

Polaris is not choosing to be the world police, rather we are addressing a situation as we see it. Your mileage of course may well be different, I have no issue with that. If PC feels like we should punish them, perhaps they should engage in the behaviours right at the heart of the matter. If I was actually being completely serious PC still have 2 more days left on their deadline, \m/ chose to cancel their deadline for reasons best known only to themselves.

The concept of biting off what you can chew also seems to pass some people by. You know that whole allies of allies thingo you seem so quick to quote, yeah that one. Perhaps if you were actually involved at all you might understand how much discussion went into this over the last few days and how much full and frank disclosure was made at the same time... but that doesn't fit with your current agenda now does it?

[Baldr]

Could you literally show me where we asked for it? I would love to knock a whole in that one.

Quoting Margrave...

As with the Sith, so with \m/; we pursue our desires. That is our justification, that is all the justification we need. We do what we do to enjoy ourselves. If you have a problem with that, do what we Unjust always told you to do; Do Something About It.

That bolded "Do Something About it" was bolded in the original.

There are numerous examples of people from \m/ saying "Do something about it". There isn't any point in denying it.

There is another example here. I'll quote your own words.

The only alliance that ever stood up and put their actions where their mouth was in regards to their anti techraiding values was NPO, and the world now demonizes them as teh ebil, go figure.

Now NpO has acted. You should be happy.

[Merrie Melodies]

I actually find you to be a very intelligent and perceptive person... but my face was all okay by itself. You want to call me out then act surprised when I answer? Not my face that needs saving. You say I am bluffing, I say I am not and here we are. But thanks for the concern about my image, when I need advice on such I won't be coming to \m/ for the advice.

I have seen your references to my massive ego etc etc, I can deal with it, maybe I am a conceited self righteous knob, but I am still right.

To be honest, the only thing that suprised me was the verbage in your CB, I knew we would end up right where we are.

[magicninja]

Why was there a deadline? What was the conditions?

[Merrie Melodies]

Quoting Margrave...

That bolded "Do Something About it" was bolded in the original.

There are numerous examples of people from \m/ saying "Do something about it". There isn't any point in denying it.

There is another example here. I'll quote your own words.

Now NpO has acted. You should be happy.

And who started that argument? Hmm?

[erikz]

wrongly quoted.

Edited January 21, 2010 by erikz

[AlmightyGrub]

You better go ask your Emperor why he pushed this issue, I will give you a tip, it has something to do with how he thought he might be preceived.

You are entirely correct again MM, I will not be perceived as someone who merely threatens consequence without actually being committed to said consequences. I believe we have already been through that haven't we?. It is called doing what you say you will do. I do not make idle threats, I have every intention of following through on what I say, you were happy to believe I was bluffing..wrong much?

Edited January 21, 2010 by AlmightyGrub

[omfghi2u2]

And who started that argument? Hmm?

Yes, but who said, "do something about it."

-omfg

[heggo]

Quoting Margrave...

That bolded "Do Something About it" was bolded in the original.

There are numerous examples of people from \m/ saying "Do something about it". There isn't any point in denying it.

There is another example here. I'll quote your own words.

Now NpO has acted. You should be happy.

Awww shoot, you beat me to it baldr. May I simply add the following MM quotes to your fine list:

"To those bawwwing that this is just like the Athens-KoN incident, yes and no. Yes a small alliance was raided, No we won't say we are sorry and pay reps. If you were reallt upset last time YOU would have taken measures to insure it wouldn't happen again...........you didn't."

"well then, I guess these people need to get on with the "beating the living daylights out of us"

We are not going to change for them."

"That would require them to actually do something beyond whinging on about it."

"when you actually do something tangilbe I will redact my statement."

"Yes, the way I see it, you sit in the stands, whinging on about what you want while we go and take what we want. See the difference?"

Edited January 21, 2010 by heggo

[Merrie Melodies]

Awww shoot, you beat me to it baldur. May I simply add the following MM quotes to your fine list:

"To those bawwwing that this is just like the Athens-KoN incident, yes and no. Yes a small alliance was raided, No we won't say we are sorry and pay reps. If you were reallt upset last time YOU would have taken measures to insure it wouldn't happen again...........you didn't."

"well then, I guess these people need to get on with the "beating the living daylights out of us"

We are not going to change for them."

"That would require them to actually do something beyond whinging on about it."

"when you actually do something tangilbe I will redact my statement."

"Yes, the way I see it, you sit in the stands, whinging on about what you want while we go and take what we want. See the difference?"

I will give credit to Grub for doing something about it, yet we are still doing what we want (We are discussing opening up raiding if Polars military doesnt get its act togther)

You say we asked for it, well guess what we didn't go there to make a thread and brag about it, someone else brought it to the world and used it as a smear campaign, and we responded, something your own media corp knows something of. Out of curiosity, NSO was in there whinging long long before Grub was, why didnt you declare on us?.......oh wai

[AlmightyGrub]

Why else did he get involved in the first place

Read the OP genius, it seems fairly clear to me. You are dredging the wrong place if you think that is going to take you somewhere

[Trigger]

The Sith should be fine until they run out of lipstick or until NpO finds someone else to worship them.

lol, sigged

[Zombie Glaucon]

So you're not gonna say it instead you're going to make some witty comment about this being repetitive just because you don't want to say what you want to say?

Oh I see -- you've got the monopoly on playing fun nuance games around here. Very well.

Their apology was no apology, as I said quite clearly. They were sincere in not liking the consequences of what happened perhaps, but placation is no apology. To make an analogy, if I punch someone, it is not an apology when I say "Gee, I'm sorry you don't like that I punched you."

[Now here is when someone invariably comes along and attacks the argument on the basis of the details of the analogy (eg. "Saying things isn't like punching!"). If you're reading this and thinking along those lines, save your breath.]

[Meer Republic]

It's funny how times change.

o/ Polaris

For the record how many days are allowed to pass before \m/s allies are taunted as being cowards by the folk who took such great pleasure in tossing that around recently?

Edited January 21, 2010 by Meer Republic