Dochartaigh Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Ok, pop quiz....if they wait 1 more day after that, how many days will they have had to prepare? like i said, keep up the witty remarks. seems all VA is capable of in this war is witty remarks. i am honestly glad i am not allied to VA and waiting to see if they will join this war or not. cuz you realize that the ave. TPF member only sees the treaties and then looks around and sees him and his alliancemates getting destroyed, while his allies are only on the OWF making witty remarks instead of giving them aid. so regardless of whether any back room talks are taking place, TPF activated their defensive clauses and you continue to sit on your $@! instead of honoring it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWConner Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 like... witty remarks...VA is capable of...witty remarks. i am honestly glad.... I'm sorry, all I saw was the above. After that I think you said something about *$#es and something else. I'm not sure. TPF knows VA. VA knows TPF. We're all one happy family. Unfortunately... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dochartaigh Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 I'm sorry, all I saw was the above. After that I think you said something about *$#es and something else. I'm not sure.TPF knows VA. VA knows TPF. We're all one happy family. Unfortunately... so you are the type of family that allows their brother to be beaten until he is in the ICU before attempting to come to his aid? glad i ain't your family. if that were the case, i would disown you long ago and look for a better brother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNakedJimbo Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Oh you! Opening your mouth when you have no idea what you're talking about or what is going on...how cute. Oh, I know exactly what I'm talking about: shameless self-preservation, the strongest of all animal instincts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWConner Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 so you are the type of family that allows their brother to be beaten until he is in the ICU before attempting to come to his aid? glad i ain't your family. if that were the case, i would disown you long ago and look for a better brother. Um, last I checked, you don't choose family. We didn't choose TPF. It was fate. We were willed into their bosom. And that just shows how sad you are, disowning your own family member. How could you? He's your brother?!?! Anywho, it's good to let the big brother take a lil beating every now and then. Toughens them up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dochartaigh Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Um, last I checked, you don't choose family. We didn't choose TPF. It was fate. We were willed into their bosom.And that just shows how sad you are, disowning your own family member. How could you? He's your brother?!?! Anywho, it's good to let the big brother take a lil beating every now and then. Toughens them up. how sad i am? if my bro did not take a beating for me when he swore he would, why would i keep him around? i would rather have fate find me a brother that will keep his word and take a beating with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWConner Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 how sad i am? if my bro did not take a beating for me when he swore he would, why would i keep him around? i would rather have fate find me a brother that will keep his word and take a beating with me. Wow, some brother you are?!!? Jeesh. Drop blood because you got beat up a lil bit. I feel sorry for any of your brethren. Anywho, that's neither here nor there. Back to the topic at hand...wait, what was that again? Oh, right, TPF is getting rolled, nobody's helping them, they're on their own, their allies suck, all should die in a fiery grave... Ok, continue... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin McDonald Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 JWConner, for all your snide remarks here, I hope you do end up DoWing at some point... otherwise you run the risk of looking silly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWConner Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 JWConner, for all your snide remarks here, I hope you do end up DoWing at some point... otherwise you run the risk of looking silly. I know, that would suck greatly! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythicknight Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Wow, some brother you are?!!? Jeesh. Drop blood because you got beat up a lil bit. I feel sorry for any of your brethren.Anywho, that's neither here nor there. Back to the topic at hand...wait, what was that again? Oh, right, TPF is getting rolled, nobody's helping them, they're on their own, their allies suck, all should die in a fiery grave... Ok, continue... I'll grab the lighter fluid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 (edited) I'll grab the lighter fluid thick Also this thread is quite correct. Only the three are obligated due to TPF's actions, and the other five have no reason to come in short of their own desire. Could you clarify this for their MADP treaties as well? Are there any antispying clauses in those? Oh you are a tricky one. Two threads D: Edited December 29, 2009 by Penlugue Solaris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnCapistan Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Oh, I know exactly what I'm talking about: shameless self-preservation, the strongest of all animal instincts Clearly we are all cowards. Everyone allied to us should cancel their treaties as we can't be trusted. God I can't wait... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingEd Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Clearly we are all cowards. Everyone allied to us should cancel their treaties as we can't be trusted.God I can't wait... You tell em Mr Damsky! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Stop saying TPF allies aren't going to go in. You make yourself look foolish when you do so. You can insult them about the timeline all you wish, but have no doubts that alliances such as NEW and VA at the very least will be involved, and based off the replies from most of their other allies they will be involved as well. While they may have the ability to back out via treaties, realize that the relationships that exist between the alliances will make them blind to this. They will not care if they are not obligated to defend their friend, they will still do it. If you are friends with someone, even if they are completely in the wrong you will still stand with them. TPF's allies will come imo. Just do it quicker before you start to look like cowards who had to actually think about it and not just defend their friends because they were their friends. FBI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWConner Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Stop saying TPF allies aren't going to go in. You make yourself look foolish when you do so.You can insult them about the timeline all you wish, but have no doubts that alliances such as NEW and VA at the very least will be involved, and based off the replies from most of their other allies they will be involved as well. Hoo, I mean who, told you this? Lies I tell you...LIES! Bob, haven't you been told, we're dishonorable? Get with the times! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wickedj Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 I'll be eager to see your reaction when it's your nation about to be destroyed because your ally did something that every alliance in CN disapproves of. Infact we DO have an ally who screwed up and isnt exactly making friends. while i cannot speak on a official capacity i feel confident in saying we would honor our treaty regardless of the odds, again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNakedJimbo Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 i feel confident in saying we would honor our treaty regardless of the odds, again The odds aren't really the salient point in this debate. The point is that the ally in question (probably) spied and is getting what they deserve for it. You have an unfortunate dichotomy: either blindly support your ally, which is pretty stupid, or sever on the grounds that someone who spies does not deserve your protection, no matter what words bind you to them. I personally prefer to honor principles rather than words. If you truly support TPF throughout all this, then wonderful and I applaud you for defending them. But if you're supporting a treaty, an inanimate object which has already been broken when TPF violated its anti-spying clause, then that's the opposite of noble. I hope what we've all learned from this is that every treaty should include anti-spying clauses so that no ally is ever put in a position where it has to choose between breaking its word or defending spies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Chocolate Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 (edited) I dont see any point in repeating this analysis for their remaining treaties, all classified as ODPs, at present, but if anyone sees a reason let me know. No, please don't. I'm having fun with this just on a pure "rules lawyer" level, and even I don't want that! That would be way over the top. I think that I speak for the majority of CN when I say there is absolutely no need. TPF has enough MDP's to involve enough alliances that, if followed, we will be looking at another world war. In fact, I see that being part of the "lesson" of these two threads. The other "lesson" being have some clue about what you are signing. I'll give you my own analysis of the treaties above later. However, I am wondering...am I going to have to consider you as a competitor for my treaty writing business? Edited December 29, 2009 by White Chocolate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadie Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Maybe this is true and maybe it's not; I don't have any way of knowing, other than believing one stranger's word over another. Perception matters more than reality sometimes. And this I can understand. If I was on the outside of this looking in, I can't say for sure I wouldn't think the same way you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chairman Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Yeah, I think the real point of stasis in this debate is whether TPF was proven to be spying. And the evidence is pretty lacking.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dochartaigh Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 Wow, some brother you are?!!? Jeesh. Drop blood because you got beat up a lil bit. I feel sorry for any of your brethren.Anywho, that's neither here nor there. Back to the topic at hand...wait, what was that again? Oh, right, TPF is getting rolled, nobody's helping them, they're on their own, their allies suck, all should die in a fiery grave... Ok, continue... wait, i am the one stating that i would defend my brother regardless of whether i agreed with his actions or not. i would get beaten to hell and back for them. frankly, i despise Athens for the most part but i will send my nation to ZI to defend them from any attacks upon them. why? because they are a brother of IAA. any alliance IAA is allied to is my brother regardless of my personal relations with them (you can hate your sibling but still defend them). so if i am more than willing to go to ZI for all my allies, i damn well expect them to be willing to do the same. If they aren't then the treaty needs to be looked at as it should not be above an ODP if not outright dropped because obviously the other alliance does not view the IAA as brethren, so why should they be treated as brothers? Thankfully, i know Athens has IAA's back regardless of what occurs. as does the rest of IAA's allies. that is the difference between you and me. you come across as if you don't honestly care. whether this is true or not, it is how you are coming across and the fact that we are coming upon the 3rd update of this war and still nothing from VA backs up my assertions more than your snide remarks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dochartaigh Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 The odds aren't really the salient point in this debate. The point is that the ally in question (probably) spied and is getting what they deserve for it. You have an unfortunate dichotomy: either blindly support your ally, which is pretty stupid, or sever on the grounds that someone who spies does not deserve your protection, no matter what words bind you to them.I personally prefer to honor principles rather than words. If you truly support TPF throughout all this, then wonderful and I applaud you for defending them. But if you're supporting a treaty, an inanimate object which has already been broken when TPF violated its anti-spying clause, then that's the opposite of noble. I hope what we've all learned from this is that every treaty should include anti-spying clauses so that no ally is ever put in a position where it has to choose between breaking its word or defending spies. actually you can support your ally while spanking them in private over their actions. so there is technically a third option. take for example MK's actions when Athens/FoB raided KoN... MK supported their ally while browbeating them in private. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorConcept Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 actually you can support your ally while spanking them in private over their actions. so there is technically a third option. take for example MK's actions when Athens/FoB raided KoN... MK supported their ally while browbeating them in private. but doch that'd be a logical thing to do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dochartaigh Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 but doch that'd be a logical thing to do i know, i know. /me whips himself for bringing logic into CN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kubla Khan Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 (edited) TPF spied, nations gonna get ZI'ed Edited December 30, 2009 by Kubla Khan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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