Poaching from our ranks- NSO

[TehChron]

It's an old cliche that when you first arrive in prison you're supposed to punch the toughest looking guy. Apparently that shows that you're tougher, or crazy, or whatever. I always thought that was pretty stupid. Seems like a great way to insure that guy's gonna try and kick your $@! later. Perhaps it's more prudent to knock out a weaker looking guy, who you know you could beat in a future fight. But then that just defeats the whole purpose of getting respect for the act. In fact, it is likely to have the opposite effect.

[OOC] Woulda loved to have seen that in the Shawshank Redemption. On a side note, you may need to use OOC tags for that. [/OOC]

Why would we want respect? We were only trying to liberate these oppressed neutrals from their chains of political stagnation.

[iamthey]

Lol, it's funny to see you know nothing about TDO. But keep up the pomp.

And don't forget to embrace the "dark side" Muhahahaha. Enjoy your silliness

Well that was nice...

[Aurion]

I'm willing to see all my pixels burns to preserve our way of life, if need be.

Preserving your way of life? There's not really anything you can do at this point that will help with that.

You're stuck in a classic no-win scenario. You now have the choice of two bad options. You can:

A. Lie down. You seem to be doing this, big talk aside.

B. Fight. You'll probably need help to do it, which kind of hurts the "neutral" aura a bit, no?

To be quite frank, you got played like a grand piano. You've succeeded in constraining your own options to the point where nothing you can do has a high probability of turning out very well for you in the long run, if you care about preserving your "way of life".

Just saying. Take it however you will, but that's what it looks like from my eyes.

[Heft]

NSO I thank you for your "benevolent, humanitarian mission" to free these helpless victims of neutrality slavery. Neutrals everywhere embrace your passion!

We truly only had the most noble of intentions.

Edited July 3, 2009 by Heft

[HellAngel]

Why is it an act of aggression? As weve already elaborated, neutral alliances are not really harmed by having members leave. They project no power, do not fight wars (ostensibly) and frankly do nothing more than pad stats. Thats about as aggressive as dropping trades with a couple of members of the alliance.

If taking a member from an alliance just because they werent a fit were a valid CB, im frankly shocked Athens isnt beating up on MHA even now for taking Sileath.

Oh dont give me that crap. You wanted to raise your own strength by poaching from the "weakest link" in the cyberverse. An alliance that has no treaties and is all on its own while you can fall back on your MDP partners should this turn out to evolve into war.

You're no better then the school bully always picking on the weakest kid on the yard.

[Hydro]

It's an old cliche that when you first arrive in prison you're supposed to punch the toughest looking guy. Apparently that shows that you're tougher, or crazy, or whatever. I always thought that was pretty stupid. Seems like a great way to insure that guy's gonna try and kick your $@! later. Perhaps it's more prudent to knock out a weaker looking guy, who you know you could beat in a future fight. But then that just defeats the whole purpose of getting respect for the act. In fact, it is likely to have the opposite effect.

We did not iniate this topic and, if you read Heft's logs earlier, we assumed it was over and done with. TDO chose to paint themselves as martyrs here and that they're being called out shouldn't be a suprise, nor should it be suprising that we are not going to just roll over for a bunch of "tough guys".

[KagetheSecond]

Oh dont give me that crap. You wanted to raise your own strength by poaching from the "weakest link" in the cyberverse. An alliance that has no treaties and is all on its own while you can fall back on your MDP partners should this turn out to evolve into war.

You're no better then the school bully always picking on the weakest kid on the yard.

Based on what I have seen from the NSO, I highly doubt that they need their MDP partners to stand up. They seem like they put their money where there mouth is...

[Sylar]

Preserving your way of life? There's not really anything you can do at this point that will help with that.

You're stuck in a classic no-win scenario. You now have the choice of two bad options. You can:

A. Lie down. You seem to be doing this, big talk aside.

B. Fight. You'll probably need help to do it, which kind of hurts the "neutral" aura a bit, no?

To be quite frank, you got played like a grand piano. You've succeeded in constraining your own options to the point where nothing you can do has a high probability of turning out very well for you in the long run, if you care about preserving your "way of life".

Just saying. Take it however you will, but that's what it looks like from my eyes.

Well a combined GPA-TDO force stats wise would be pretty large and obviously stronger then NSO and i kinda have to agree but if its a 1 v 1 they wont need that much help. but if TDO wants any respect and to get out of this alive there gonna have to fight.

and KagetheSecond just because they can talk big doesn't mean they could fight those overwhelming odds.

Edited July 3, 2009 by Sylar

[heggo]

Oh dont give me that crap. You wanted to raise your own strength by poaching from the "weakest link" in the cyberverse. An alliance that has no treaties and is all on its own while you can fall back on your MDP partners should this turn out to evolve into war.

You're no better then the school bully always picking on the weakest kid on the yard.

Don't give you what crap? A reasoned argument for why it was a favor to them, not an act of aggression? If you can so readily dismiss the arguments and put them out of mind, I should hope that you would also be able to refute them.

On another note, I must ask what exactly is meant by defending the neutral way of life? Would it be like some sort of militant agnosticism movement?

[gfloyd2002]

This shows the first signs of what many suspected would happen post-Karma War as several neutrals jumped up in the sanctioned alliance rankings -- people were going to agitate and try to pick them off simply because they can.

NSO is obviously the kind of alliance that will push any advantage if there is no perceived threat, and also the kind of alliance willing to use the strength of Frostbite to protect it from the consequences of aggression. TDO and GPA can't respond with military, nor could GOP or Grey Council -- Frostbite would presumably defend NSO and nuke the neutrals to oblivion. Presumably NSO will face no repercussions for this, letting the world know that neutrals are fair game. I suspect this is the first of really aggressive actions against neutrals by similarly amoral alliances. (No offense intended there, NSO is RPing its code.)

What would be very interesting to see in response to this would be a bloc of neutrals. All equally committed to their neutrality, aligned only to those agreeing not to treaty outside of the bloc, only to those committed to the same neutrality. I'm thinking they are going to need it to present sufficient strength (particularly nuclear strength they lack individually) to pose a sufficient deterrent to these kinds of actions now that they have some prominence in the Sanctions Race. The sheer numbers of such a bloc would probably better protect their preferred way of playing the game and from these types of attacks.

Out of curiosity, I forget, was Moldavi in charge of NPO for the NPO beatdown of GPA? I'm thinking it was Moos by then. Yeah, had to have been.

[Sal Paradise]

We've been here for awhile and we didn't punch anyone.

DON'T FORGET TO MENTION THIS ISN'T A PRISON.

[OOC] Woulda loved to have seen that in the Shawshank Redemption. On a side note, you may need to use OOC tags for that. [/OOC]

OOC: I'm gonna risk it.

[TehChron]

Oh dont give me that crap. You wanted to raise your own strength by poaching from the "weakest link" in the cyberverse. An alliance that has no treaties and is all on its own while you can fall back on your MDP partners should this turn out to evolve into war.

You're no better then the school bully always picking on the weakest kid on the yard.

No, we're Sith. We actually are far more brutal than mere children. Please don't insult us.

That being said, how on Earth do you reconcile your first point with the "OMGZ conspiracy theories!!!" that are running rampant in this thread, at times quoted and referenced by you?

I just dont see how you can say that with any logical consistency.

[Sal Paradise]

We did not iniate this topic and, if you read Heft's logs earlier, we assumed it was over and done with. TDO chose to paint themselves as martyrs here and that they're being called out shouldn't be a suprise, nor should it be suprising that we are not going to just roll over for a bunch of "tough guys".

What makes you think my comment is directed at NSO?

[Griff]

NSO I thank you for your "benevolent, humanitarian mission" to free these helpless victims of neutrality slavery. Neutrals everywhere embrace your passion!

Why thankyou good sir!

[enderland]

We did not iniate this topic and, if you read Heft's logs earlier, we assumed it was over and done with. TDO chose to paint themselves as martyrs here and that they're being called out shouldn't be a suprise, nor should it be suprising that we are not going to just roll over for a bunch of "tough guys".

Oh cry me a river.

[Farrin Xies]

We've been here for awhile and we didn't punch anyone.

Analogies in political discussions almost always fail terribly.

I think the analogy is quite apt in this case, actually. And analogies, by their very nature, are used so to help people understand a concept they're having trouble understanding; I for one am having trouble understanding why NSO would violate other alliances' sovereignty like this, and the analogy is essentially what I've come up with in my head as your motives.

Edited July 3, 2009 by farrin

[Merrie Melodies]

Well a combined GPA-TDO force stats wise would be pretty large and obviously stronger then NSO and i kinda have to agree but if its a 1 v 1 they wont need that much help. but if TDO wants any respect and to get out of this alive there gonna have to fight.

and KagetheSecond just because they can talk big doesn't mean they could fight those overwhelming odds.

I assure you we can be just as happy with a loss as with a win.

I believe you are correct TDO really is going to have to fight to survive this PR situation, bringing it out like this wasn't the greatest move but having done that if they dont attack us they will pretty much be punking themselves, hard for an alliance to survive for long after punkin themselves

[iamthey]

Oh cry me a river.

Well if I remember correctly it was you all who posted the OP?

Edited July 3, 2009 by iamthey

[TehChron]

Oh cry me a river.

We didnt start this fight, as we had clearly negotiated and considered the matter settled.

That TDO and others were refusing to accept the reality that you can not continue negotiations after they have ended is hardly our fault. Especially when they indicated their agreement with that view to begin with.

[KagetheSecond]

and KagetheSecond just because they can talk big doesn't mean they could fight those overwhelming odds.

It appears they're more than willing to fight. Even if they don't win the war, they would have accomplished their goal.

Edited July 3, 2009 by KagetheSecond

[Newhotness]

Based on what I have seen from the NSO, I highly doubt that they need their MDP partners to stand up. They seem like they put their money where there mouth is...

if tdo attacks, i highly doubt they wont bring in their treaty patrners. cuz if they dont, they will get crushed by tdo

[Hydro]

Oh cry me a river.

That's TDO's job, not mine.

[Matthew Conrad]

Well if I remember correctly it was you all who posted the OP?

He's not in TDO, GPA, or Grey Council. So...?

[enderland]

Well if I remember correctly it was you all who posted the OP?

I am not in TDO, but have been flying their AA on here for quite some time because previously no one else did so it was quite easy to skim through threads and see my posts (since I have sigs/avatars disabled and I was the only one essentially to use the TDO image ).

I believe you are correct TDO really is going to have to fight to survive this PR situation, bringing it out like this wasn't the greatest move but having done that if they dont attack us they will pretty much be punking themselves, hard for an alliance to survive for long after punkin themselves

So suddenly it's TDO's fault that you guys initiated what normally would consist of an act of war against them?

[D34th]

While I love my sith brothers and allies I have to say that' what they did is tremendously disrespectful. I could compare it to some guy inviting your girlfriend to date, while it's only up to her accept or deny the invite and if she accepts means that she worth nothing, the act of invite someone that you know that have a boyfriend is totaly disrespectful.

However I fail to see why this could be an act of war or an act of agression, if nowadays accept spied screenshots isn't an act of war why message someone should be?

Interesting strategy you have discovered here: bolstering your military power by poaching... neutrals?

A NPO member talking about poaching neutrals?

Not especially related to this incident...

Why do people think being neutral means you will not defend yourself? Being neutral means you take no side in a war or politically but it does not remove the ability to defend themselves. If TDO considers this issue an act of aggression then if they do attack the NSO it is by no means an act that betrays their neutrality.

This is a lost case Tyga, I spend all my time in GPA trying to explain it to OWF and I failed miserable.